|
|
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 203
Campfire Member
|
Campfire Member
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 203 |
It seems there are some who wish to excuse the outfitter for what they call technicalities. Things such as having a resident quide present are not mere technicalities. What is to stop an outfitter from hiring one guide and using him in a blanket way to cover all clients. It seems the requirement that the guide be physically present is the only way to accomplish this.
Getting caught twice is a sign that he is not respectfull of BC's laws and regulations.
As for comparing his two convictions to traffic violations, many Canadians feel he should have more time to drive and pile up American traffic tickets and less time in the Canadian bush breaking our laws.
Murf
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 4,017
Campfire Tracker
|
|
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 4,017 |
A fish cop was checking pickerel lengths and noted that a 9 year old had a fish a couple of centimeters to short. Automatically the fish cop started writing out a ticket for a poacher. The father said "it's his first fish and he was so exited and started crying when I told him we had to release it. Cut us some slack please" the father pleaded. A crowd soon gathered around the familly and with the pressure applied the ticket was ripped up. In my opinion the fish should have been released,If the child is going to fish,he has to learn to obey the regulations.If he is told that it is okay to make exceptions now,he will likely break the rules again.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 3,500
Campfire Tracker
|
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 3,500 |
A fish cop was checking pickerel lengths and noted that a 9 year old had a fish a couple of centimeters to short. Automatically the fish cop started writing out a ticket for a poacher. The father said "it's his first fish and he was so exited and started crying when I told him we had to release it. Cut us some slack please" the father pleaded. A crowd soon gathered around the familly and with the pressure applied the ticket was ripped up. In my opinion the fish should have been released,If the child is going to fish,he has to learn to obey the regulations.If he is told that it is okay to make exceptions now,he will likely break the rules again. As an Alberta Conservation program instructor, I would have to say that a perfect time to teach the child about conservation and why the fish should have been released was missed by the parent. Ticket should have stood as well. Hopefully the CO took the time to talk with the child.
Last edited by troutfly; 04/25/08. Reason: grammer
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 869
Campfire Regular
|
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 869 |
Sometimes Outfitters have to take the wrap for a client's screw up and do the best he can with the cards he is dealt. If he was half the man that Horn says he is, Brian would have taken the "wrap" by contacting the CO service personally and saying that one of his clients screwed up. Brian could have saved face with said client by paying the dudes fine for him. Altering documents, then getting pinched on same, undermines any/all credibility he may have had. And like I said before, guys usually don't get busted on their first offence and Brian already has 2. RO
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 869
Campfire Regular
|
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 869 |
STA: my little girl kill you.  d.o.u.c.h.e.b.a.g. Good form there Greenhorn, especially after Art calls STW out for name calling on your behalf. RO
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 20,554
Campfire Ranger
|
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 20,554 |
Apparently, Greenhorn ain't to bright or doesn't understand english. Your doing a piss poor job of defending your friend Bryan with these type of posts too.
That's ok, I'll ass shoot a dink.
Steelhead
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 4,017
Campfire Tracker
|
|
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 4,017 |
Apparently, Greenhorn ain't to bright or doesn't understand english. Your doing a piss poor job of defending your friend Bryan with these type of posts too. The friends that a person keeps are usually a good indication of the type of person that he is.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 9
New Member
|
|
New Member
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 9 |
1999 was the first year that I owned the area and I had just applied and was accepted as a Landed Immigrant to Canada (I moved from the US), but I couldn't hold a guide license until 2000. The pilot was supposed to be our guide, but because of the weather, he couldn't make it back to us for 4 days. It just so happened that as the hunter and I were hiking up to recover his goat, that a guide from the neighboring area, was taking a short cut through our area, with his hunter. We talked and he saw that our guide was not with us. In fact, our guide/pilot flew over as we were talking, saw us, landed at the nearby lake and started up the trail to help with the goat. Our guide met the neighboring guide part way. Then, our guide, feeling bad for the very tired hunter, helped carry this hunter's pack back to the plane, then flew this guide and hunter, back to their base camp. My hunter and I had to pack his goat back alone and then wait until the next day to get picked up. Two years later, when this guide was no longer able to guide in this outfitter's area, because the outfitter leased the area to me instead, he turned the hunter and I into the game department, for hunting without a guide, because he was pissed at me for "taking his lease". Because I had let the hunter use my gun to shoot the goat and because I was the owner of this new business, I was charged with guiding without a license. We had a guide, he just wasn't physically present again. Hunting without a guide is against the law for a non resident of BC, which the owner of a territory (Bryan Martin) damn well woudl have known. So he knowingly broke the law here.
The same time that the COS was talking to me about this issue, they had received a complaint that I had hunted as a resident in both Montana and BC, in 2000. When I showed them my non-resident hunting license and tags in MT, for 2000, plus proved that I met the residency requirements of being a resident for 7 months before hunting in BC, that charge was dropped. They then wanted to know how many days I was in and out of BC in 2001. According to their interpretation of the game laws, residency was a year to year situation. They based residency, also on physical presence in the province. Most residents likely didn't know that they were supposed to be physically present for 7 months of the proceeding 12 months, before doing any hunting as a resident. Since a month is basically 30 days, 7 times 30 is 210 days of physical presence was required. According to this law, even if you don't move or change your "residency", you might not be qualified to hunt as a resident. This is even if you owned or rented a home, paid taxes in BC, had everything registered in BC, didn't live anywhere else but BC and didn't claim any residency priviledges anywhere else, besides BC. So, if you were a truck driver and worked for more than 5 months outside of the providence or if you worked in a mine, say in Alberta, you might not have been qualified to hunt as a resident. But, if you couldn't hunt as a resident in BC and weren't qualified to hunt as a resident anywhere else, where does this put a guy? Pretty confusing. So, because I couldn't prove that I was in BC for 210 days in 2001, they charged me as not being qualified to hunt as a resident. I surely didn't keep track of where I was every day and could only prove less than 1/2 of a year of actually being physically present in BC.
Here is the BC WIldlife Act Definitions- And I dont' think this has been changed in years. "resident" means (a) a person who (i) is a Canadian citizen or a permanent resident of Canada, whose only or primary residence is in British Columbia, and (ii) has been physically present in British Columbia for the greater portion of each of 6 calendar months out of the 12 calendar months immediately preceding the date of making an application under this Act or doing another thing relevant to the operation of this Act, or (b) a person who (i) is not a Canadian citizen or a permanent resident of Canada, but whose only or primary residence is in British Columbia, and (ii) has been physically present in British Columbia for the greater portion of each of the 12 calendar months immediately preceding the date of making an application under this Act or doing another thing relevant to the operation of this Act; Bryan Martin may be the best guy in the world, a fine hunter and a great guide, but he has been operating in BC for a relatively short time and he has knowingly broken game laws and he has been shown to be a liar. I suspect this will not be the last time we hear about him on charges.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,904
Campfire Regular
|
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,904 |
seen my share of lower 48 and canucks barf in the Cabo pools 
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 68
Campfire Greenhorn
|
|
Campfire Greenhorn
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 68 |
There are a few things wrong here.(That's my opinion).We have canadians thinking that only native people should be able to hunt in canada or be able to run an outfit????Anyone not born in Canada should not be allowed to hunt in the place he chooses to reside in?That's about the dumbest thing ,i have heard in a long time.Canadians like Americans like Jews like chinese etc break the law.We can not condone this and it should be dealt with severly,but making an immigrant issue out of it appears to be retarded,especially when Hunters around the world share the love for nature and game all the same.
We seem to forget that hunting and the great outdoors as well as the experience of each individiual makes frequenting Forums like this a great experience ,especially in times when hunting is at rest.
Me,i don't care what nationality or color someone is.If he hunts ethically and with respect,he is my kind of guy.
If you pay taxes you should be able to hunt.
Sometimes we loose the respect when responding to statements,only because we never have to face the other person.If we would all be out in a hunting camp and have the same discussion,we would treat each other quite differently,i would hope.
Let us not forget that it is not only like-minded people that read in these Forums.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 20,554
Campfire Ranger
|
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 20,554 |
That's ok, I'll ass shoot a dink.
Steelhead
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 4,017
Campfire Tracker
|
|
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 4,017 |
We have canadians thinking that only native people should be able to hunt in canada or be able to run an outfit????Anyone not born in Canada should not be allowed to hunt in the place he chooses to reside in?That's about the dumbest thing ,i have heard in a long time Actually it was basically only one person that felt that way.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,294
Campfire Outfitter
|
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,294 |
bummer, i just wasted 15 minutes of my life to find out someone has an opinion, facts are around if you want them and people screw up..... sue me  woofer
"I would build one again, if it were not for my 350RM (grin)."
MtnHtr
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 68
Campfire Greenhorn
|
|
Campfire Greenhorn
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 68 |
We have canadians thinking that only native people should be able to hunt in canada or be able to run an outfit????Anyone not born in Canada should not be allowed to hunt in the place he chooses to reside in?That's about the dumbest thing ,i have heard in a long time Actually it was basically only one person that felt that way. Well,isn't there are saying ,that "Evil things will prevail, when good men fail to act"??There were only a few guys that contradicted him,though. Everyone is entitled to their opinion,but it should stop when we start making summary convictions.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 869
Campfire Regular
|
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 869 |
Brian Martin was CONVICTED, not just "charged", "accused" or "alleged to have done". Not only that, but he's been CONVICTED not once, but TWICE.
Save the bullchit speech. If this act was committed in the US of A, by a Canadian immigrant, you would be doing anything but trying to justify his actions.
RO
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 20,554
Campfire Ranger
|
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 20,554 |
Brian Martin was CONVICTED, not just "charged", "accused" or "alleged to have done". Not only that, but he's been CONVICTED not once, but TWICE.
Save the bullchit speech. If this act was committed in the US of A, by a Canadian immigrant, you would be doing anything but trying to justify his actions.
RO Damn right.....and if it was a US citizen that got busted in the US of A he would be treated the same as any other vilator. Don't make this into something it isn't.
That's ok, I'll ass shoot a dink.
Steelhead
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 81
Campfire Greenhorn
|
|
Campfire Greenhorn
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 81 |
I have been reading this post with some laughs and a few smiles as I watch people go from discussing this post to becoming third grade playground kids who have nothing better to do that call each other names. You guys need to grow up and have a little common sense.
I have personally worked in the guide/outfitter business in BC for 9 years now. I have guided moose/bear and goat hunters from all over NA and have meet some really neat people. When it comes to the act and regs of the hunting/guiding industry, they are pretty well spelled out. There is not really much room for wiggling around.
The fact that Mr. martin actually had his hunter cancel his tags for the animals harvested, filled out a guide return with all the animals killed on it and that he doctored it to make it look like it was legal, tells me that he knew exactly what he was doing and the be damn with the laws of BC. As an Outfitter, he sets a crappy example to his guides, staff, clients and to the organization as a whole. Also what he did is a lot worse that some speeding ticket, seatbelt law or other minor infraction. What he did is inexcusable, if I did what he did, I would loose my guide licence and I would quite anyways because I would be disgusted with myself and be embarassed about it all.
I personally do not like foreign ownership of our territories, but until that is corrected, I live with it.
I also do not care if he is a US citizen or BC citizen, he has to be made accountable for his actions and since he pled guilty, he should lose his licence. The fine means nothing to him, but lose his licence and territory for 5 years and that is a lot of $$$ that he will never be able to make up. I have heard that GOABC is investigating him and his business and are looking at kicking him out of the association.
He might be a great guy to people on this board and to others in the business, and he probably is, but what he did is inexcusable and he should be ashamed of himself. I for one would not be letting that type of guy teach my kinds anything about life, especially about hunting. But that is my personal opinion.
SS
If you shoot it on your own, they will cook it
If you don't, they will feed you something they shot.
Which is like having another man change your tire on your truck, NOT GOOD
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 68
Campfire Greenhorn
|
|
Campfire Greenhorn
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 68 |
Brian Martin was CONVICTED, not just "charged", "accused" or "alleged to have done". Not only that, but he's been CONVICTED not once, but TWICE.
Save the bullchit speech. If this act was committed in the US of A, by a Canadian immigrant, you would be doing anything but trying to justify his actions.
RO Why are you getting so worked up about it?I don't think,i would treat a canadian,who has commited the same crime in the USA any differently since i am canadian.The guy got his punishment and as SITKASPRUCE said,he is getting further investigated.What i have a problem with is that it becomes an immigrant issue.By the way, Brian Martin is a resident i.e:Landed immigrant in Canada,therefore he falls under the juristiction of canad.Laws just like a citizen does.He is according to the law,no foreigner any more.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 869
Campfire Regular
|
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 869 |
I'm not even close to worked up, by a long shot.
I'm just calling B.S. on all the posters who are trying to down play what he did, like he some how got the chitty end of the stick.
RO
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 4,017
Campfire Tracker
|
|
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 4,017 |
I'm just calling B.S. on all the posters who are trying to down play what he did, like he some how got the chitty end of the stick.
His friends would have him appear as a victim. 
|
|
|
|
|
522 members (264mag, 2500HD, 1lessdog, 12344mag, 1minute, 10gaugemag, 53 invisible),
1,852
guests, and
1,290
robots. |
|
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
|
Forums81
Topics1,194,059
Posts18,521,394
Members74,023
| |
Most Online11,491
Jul 7th, 2023
|
|
|
|
