Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Express Rifles and Big Bores Only What's a good, low-recoil DG Cartridge?

I am just kicking around the idea of getting a big-bore rifle for the sake of nostalgia and for future trips to Africa. The gun would only be used on perhaps Cape buffalo, as I have no intention of ever hunting rhino, elephants or the great cats (I know this may change if I ever get to Africa).

I am very sensitive to recoil, as I've had two extensive shoulder surgeries. The last operation was a total reconstruction that left a few bolts and a screw in the joint. The problem is, the screw is right on the point of the head of the humerus in the front...right where a rifle rests when it is mounted properly. Shooting rifles of even moderate recoil hurts. I'm tough, so I can take a bit, but after a few rounds I know I'm done, and have to postpone practice for another day.

I don't really want to go with the time-honored .375 H&H, as I'd like a bit more insurance if I'm hunting dangerous game. I've heard/read that some of the lower-recoiling big bores are the 404 Jeffery, 450/400 NE and 470 NE. Are there others?

Of course, I know handloading would allow me to tailor loads to my unique situation, but I'd like to have the opportunity to use factory ammo as a first choice.

Any help will be appreciated...thanks!

375 H&H fits the bill, but I understand the 404jeff is a great round, but of course ammo availability is tougher.

The 450/400 might be one to look at. Also, you might consider the 9.3x62 round, basically a necked up 30-06. For Cape Buffalo, they have a reputation of working just fine and the recoil is less than all of the above. It is also legal in some places, such as Zim, I believe, and probably others. Also, with your known, documented shoulder problems, I'd almost guarantee that you could get a waiver, approval, whatever is needed, to hunt DG with the 9.3 anywhere in Africa no matter what their regulations say. The 9.3 is the route I would go if I were you. The 9.3x62 chambering is becoming more popular over here all the time and factory ammo availability is very good, especially over in Africa. JMHO.

Test

A bullet through the right shoulder caused Don Heath to also have trouble with heavy recoiling calibers and he has found that the 9.3x62 works fine on Zimbabwe buffalo.
I can assure you it also works great on Alaska's large Brown Bears as well , with minimal recoil.

I will say the 9.3x62 is not basically a necked up 30 06. the dimensions are a little different; it is a mm shorter and holds more powder. howwever, it enjoys a sterling reputation amongst riflemen. had the Allied forces not destroyed the Mauserwerke factory at the end of WWII, we would be speaking of the 9.3 as we now do the 375 in all likelihood as it was the standard workhorse of africa, along with the 404J prior to WWII.

if you have a bum shoulder I would think of building the rifle a little heavier; my father in law has one in CZ factory form and he, too, has a bad shoulder. he put a dead mule recoil reducer in his and now he loves it.

good luck

build a 9.3 around 9 1/2 pounds, add a Good recoil pad and- if still necessary - have a brake added.

Thanks for the replies and suggestions so far.

I've already decided I won't be going after dangerous game on my first safari. I feel it better for me personally (and probably my PH, too!) to get some experience first...learn the ropes of hunting in Africa with a PH a bit...before striking out for Cape buffalo. This will give me a few years to practice with the rifle at my "decelerated" rate before I'd actually need it in a hunting situation.

My thoughts on the 9.3x62 are this: I figure I won't be able to practice with these big rifles nearly as much as I would like to. I am not saying I will go to Africa unprepared, but merely I won't have a thousand rounds through the rifle before I make the trip. My shoulder simply cannot take such abuse. Wouldn't something bigger than the .375 offer me more "breathing room" on a shot on a buff, given equal practice time with the rifle?

have to go with Phil on the 9.3, great cartridge and very underrated. jorge

Go on with the 9,3x62, this caliber has not a bad recoil, hundred of thousands hunters use it every year in Europe without problem and some use it in Africa too. To learn control your rifle and get use to recoil, shoot some 250grs Nosler or 232grs Norma bullets. Don't concentrate on bench shooting, find a good load accurate enought, remember it's an hunting rifle and caliber not a bench rest one. Then fire it from REAL hunting positions. You will find that recoil is really managable. You can also add a Browning Reactar recoil tamer pad (or another one)to your shooting vest. Then when you're, ready choose the right bullet and train to connect with your "game lethal zone" size target. Try to find target that represent game cause in the wild there's no bull or X on game.
Good training. The best rifle is the one you manage and feel best with. Better a 9,3 throught the shoulders than a 416 Weatherby in the paunch....
Dom

I don't know who told you that a .470 NE is "lower recoiling" but he has a bad sense of humour.It only takes 3 or 4 full power rounds thru mine and I'm not really interested in shooting it anymore that day.

You have 2 flanged cartriges listed which would typically be used in double rifles and the jeffries which would typically be used in a bolt action. Are you looking for a double or a bolt?

Although I see your point about a bigger thump and more breathing room, I think most people would agree that it is much more important to place the shot well, than to use a cannon.

What are you shooting now that is at the upper end of your comfort level? If you are shooting a 6# 338 and that hurts abit then you can probably deal with a bigger, heavier stick for the meanies, If you are shooting a 9# 30/06 and its causing pain that will certainly be more problematic.

If africa is to be on the menu- even though you seem to want to avoid it the .375 is the only choice IMHO- especially if you want to use factory ammo. If your luggage is lost you could be almost guaranteed to find ammo for a .375 almost anywhere in africa. The others not so much.

If you polled 100 ph's I would imagine that every single one would prefer that their client show up with a .375 (or 9.3) they can shoot well and have practiced with alot, than a .416 or a .458 that kicks like heck and the causes a flinch that causes the PH's but to be in the wringer with a wounded buff in the long grass. I know that every single one I have ever talked to has said that.

If pachyderms aren't on the menu I think most would also agree that nothing is to be gained by an increase in bullet diameter above .375 anyways.

All of the above is of course simply my own opinion and I've only shot 1 buff in my waking moments (1000's in my dreams though!)

And with that said (I'M glad you asked!) I used a .458 lott, shot him through the heart @70 yards and he ran about 20 yards and was dead in les than 20 seconds. I'm fairly convinced that a .375 would of done exactly the same thing. I'm also convinced that a .470 that landed on the wrong side of his diaphragm would of had a much different result.

A charging buffalo isn't stopped by hitting him with .050" diameter more bullet, but by disrupting his central nervous system with a spine or brain shot, this requires bullet placement, not Horsepower. Horsepower is always good but only if it is in the right place.

I also think that anyone who thinks that they can shoot a .470 (or a .458 or a 404) a couple of times and be ready for a safari is deluding themselves, or waaaay more skilled then the average shooter that I bump into in the field.

I'm also quite dissapointed that my answer doesn't quite match with Phil's and feel that his experience in shooting hairy nasties should renders all other posts here (especially mine) as pointless. If Phil says it will work just do that and be done with it- it will surely be a very good solution.

Thanks! I'll be sure to leave that puppy off the list!


I could go for either. Of course, a double could eat up another year without practice, as I'd have to save up that long to afford one.


Agreed. I owned a .338 Win Mag as an elk gun and eventually gave it up and went back to my trusted .270 Wby Mag. I shot the Weatherby better (the damn thing refused to miss), so it was a better elk gun, at least for me.


I can handle the .300 mags in a sporter-weight rifle (about 8lbs with scope), but that's about it. Any bigger, and I would need a lead sled at the bench. However, I tend to practice from shooting positions more than from a bench, and this shooting is usually much easier on my shoulder. The .338 Win Mag wasn't so bad off-hand or over a rest where I could stand instead of sit.


I know. I just want something that sounds more romantic.


I think all these cartridges are too much for me. It will come down to my level of discipline and committment to overcome the obstacles. I think I will be able to practice almost equally with each.


Good to know.


Me, too.


Got pix?


I will file this advice away to be used at a later date (hopefully!).


Totally agree. I don't plan on shooting the rifle just a couple of times. That's why I'm giving myself 3-4 years lead time before I'll actually need the rifle in a DG hunting situation. I know I won't be able to practice a lot during each session (6-10 rounds, perhaps?) due to the shoulder, so that means I'll need to offset that with more sessions. More sessions = more time. I hope I'm giving myself enough time to get this thing out in the field a few dozen times and at least shoot a deer or two and perhaps an elk, as well.


Who?

I have a 9.3x62 on a Model 70 and the recoil is not bad at all with 250 grain triple shocks at max load. In fact, this rifle is much more pleasant to shoot than a 30-06 Model 700 ADL that I used to own. I think the 9.3 is ideal for plains game at moderate range and will cleanly take buff.

I think I'm liking the 9.3x62. If I plan to hunt in Namibia or the RSA, will I be OK for buff'?

Seattle,

notlim is talking about Phil Shoemaker (458Win) who has posted above several times. Phil is a well known Alaskan guide/outfitter whose advice is well worth listening to.

Test

Thanks. I'll watch for more of his posts.

Seattle, I am a big fan of the 9.3x62 having just built one with 21" barrel and set up as an iron sight rifle. However, IMHO, it don't get a whole lot more romantic than the 375HH. Its done it all many times over. But the 9.3 recoils less and can be built a little lighter, or heavier for even less recoil. I think either one would suit your needs very well. Les

Seattle,,,,,,,,,I believe that whatever cartridge you use in Africa, either from the 9.3x62 on up, you still may have some serious shoulder issues.

What fun is it to have a rifle and not enjoy 20-40 rounds at the range. Ok! 10 rounds then.

Regardless of cartridge, another approach would be to put a muzzle brake on the rifle.

If I were you and considering your shoulder problem, I`d rather have a cartridge more suitable for caped buffalo, WITH a brake and less recoil, rather than a less powerful cartridge without a brake and more recoil.

Yep! It`ll be noisier with more flash, but as the `ol saying goes,,,whatever advantage is gained somewhere, there will always be a dis-advantage somewhere else.

Something else to think about uh???

Virtually every guide that I know both here in Alaska as well as most I know in Zimbabwe, Zambia, Mozambique and Tanzania absolutely hate muzzle brakes and some even refuse to guide hunters who use them - so that is why I recommended that you try and use a heavier 9.3 before adding a brake.

Seattle.

If you are a handloader getting good practice is easy. I download my 375 RUM with AA5744 and 225 gr. Hornadys. Even used it to shoot a Mn whitetail last fall.

I just bought 4 lbs of 5744 and some 525g Cast Performance cast bullets for my 500 Jeffery. Should be a heck of a praire dog and jack rabbit round at around 1600 fps.

Chuck