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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Nov 2005
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Boils down to this for me. What have I got to gain by having discourse with cops? I avoid them when I can. Very much so. Works out good. We usually avoid folks who aren't police, they don't want us around unless something is wrong. I don't hate cops, by any means, but I gave up a long time ago, hoping that a cop would help me in times of trouble. In fact, I don't know one person around here, who has ever had a cop show up and help them out when they were in need. Sorry, just the truth.
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Joined: Mar 2005
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Cruisin' down the middle of the road on this subject. Law enforcement is necessary, but I'm thinking a little imposition of justice would do away with the need for so many cops. To my way of thinking the collective law agencies in the US are a fifth column which I cannot fully trust. I don't fear them...just don't trust them.
Never been arrested but have had a number of experiences good and bad with LEOs. There are some of those tools out there far too impressed with their power and unconcerned with their purpose to suit me. They will lie during testimony in court. They will turn on the victim with abrasive and intimidating interrogation. They will not expend resources to solve crimes, sometimes when the perp is identified for them.
Some years back I lived in the Keys and had a fishing boat that no agency of the law could catch. The reason they never did was simple. On the day I took delivery one of the nation's finest told me he couldn't wait to take a chain saw to it during an inspection. Why would I let them do that? I had the speed and it was simple to employ. Why would I embrace LEOs, even if I understand that most are OK and stand for the right things, when far too many are two bit punks.
OTOH, one of them saved my life years ago and I never got his name or got to shake his hand.
Boils down to this for me. What have I got to gain by having discourse with cops? I avoid them when I can.
Color me skeptical of our paramilitary police agencies. Well said. I would add: For me, it is not about individual LE officers, it's about an "over-militarization" and "over-professionalization" of police departments. Then factor in an attitude by our legislatures and the courts that have given police departments increasing power, through an explosion of regulations, statutes, and decisions over the past 20 years, and there has indeed become a larger degree of distrust among citizens. It is government vs the citizens attitude that governement officals will deny, but in practice is a different matter. Casey
Casey
Not being married to any particular political party sure makes it a lot easier to look at the world more objectively...
Having said that, MAGA.
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Joined: Jun 2006
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jun 2006
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Boils down to this for me. What have I got to gain by having discourse with cops? I avoid them when I can. Very much so. Works out good. We usually avoid folks who aren't police, they don't want us around unless something is wrong. I don't hate cops, by any means, but I gave up a long time ago, hoping that a cop would help me in times of trouble. In fact, I don't know one person around here, who has ever had a cop show up and help them out when they were in need. Sorry, just the truth. Well, reference those people at Ft. Hood where a cop showed up and helped them while in need.
Not many problems you can't fix
With a 1911 and a 30-06
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Posts: 54,284
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
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Well, reference those people at Ft. Hood where a cop showed up and helped them while in need. Point taken. However, I expect that exactly NONE of those soldiers were wishing there was a cop around when that Muslim was firing on them. I'm guessing they were wishing they could've had their piece on them on-base.
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Posts: 54,284
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 54,284 |
IOW, cops or the lack thereof, only become an issue to me when my own government disarms me in the face of criminals and then their agents fail to be their to provide protection. I'd rather spend my money on a gun than another cop over at the county seat. Again, sorry, but just telling it like it is.
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Joined: Dec 2007
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2007
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These threads just aren't quite the same without Hunter1960.  Good post Digital Dan! That's exactly the way my dad, an ex-cop feels. And exactly the way my bro-in-law feels, a current cop. Imagine that. Current and former cops not wanting anything to do with police and stating outright they do not trust. Imagine that...
BAN THE RAINBOW FLAG!
PERVERTS OFFEND ME!
"When is penguin season, daddy? I wanna go kill a penguin!"
---- 4 yr old Archerhuntress
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Posts: 10,414
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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In fact, I don't know one person around here, who has ever had a cop show up and help them out when they were in need. Sorry, just the truth. I don't know if this qualifies as "show up," but a number of years ago I was driving a car whose radiator tended to leak and overheat. I pulled into the parking lot of a supermarket and went in a bought a gallon of distilled water. When I went to put it in my radiator, I couldn't get the radiator cap off. I have to admit I was being careful, since I didn't want to be burned by steam. There was a police officer standing by the entrance to the super market. I went over to him, explained that I couldn't get my radiator cap off, and asked him if he would come over and help me. He hesitated for a moment (thinking probably he shouldn't leave his post), but he did come over and got the cap off for me. I was very grateful!  Penny
Now faith is the assurance of things hoped for, the conviction of things not seen. --Hebrews 11:1
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2006
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I sure hope all these paranoid anti's don't think that all cops love one another cause I can tell you first hand it ain't so. One of the things I used to say to piss off fellow cops (the jerkoff's that is) was that I wore my bulletproof vest to protect me from knife wounds in the back. When I get out on patrol where it's safe, I can take it off.
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Joined: Nov 2004
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2004
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Well, reference those people at Ft. Hood where a cop showed up and helped them while in need. Point taken. However, I expect that exactly NONE of those soldiers were wishing there was a cop around when that Muslim was firing on them. I'm guessing they were wishing they could've had their piece on them on-base. In terms of wishing, I am always reminded of something my grandfather, "The Old Indian" used to say: You can wish in one hand and $hyte in the other. See which one fills up the fastest. Reference the Militarization, our units only wear BDU's when going to the range, or working some other kind of special detail, such as K-9 units. We have rank structure that makes us a quasi-military organization, I suppose, but other than that, our cadets are encouraged to make time to visit the Mom and Pop establishments, eat a sandwich and drink a coke. I get calls at least three times a week from folks who live in the county I used to Troop. "This one is selling that." "That one is taking stolen stuff". I pass on the information to the units who work that county now. I do my best to avoid these threads, and enjoyed doing my best to hijack it earlier, but the truth is, bitching about law enforcement is like bitching about your elected officials. If you want things to change, be willing to put yourself in that position. I am off in here spinning my wheels, there is definitely room for you too.
"The number one problem with America is, a whole lot of people need shot, and nobody is shooting them."
-Master Chief Hershel Davis
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Campfire Greenhorn
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Campfire Greenhorn
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Nineteen years LEO; Patrol, Custody, FTO, Firearms Instructor, former SWAT (that evil paramilitary gestapo) and also a proud follower of oathkeepers.org principles. Take a minute to check out the site.
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
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"over-professionalization" of police departments.
Casey Please elaborate.
The only thing worse than a liberal is a liberal that thinks they're a conservative.
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 54,284 |
Nineteen years LEO; Patrol, Custody, FTO, Firearms Instructor, former SWAT (that evil paramilitary gestapo) and also a proud follower of oathkeepers.org principles. Take a minute to check out the site. Good man. I just hope there's enough of y'all.
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 4,773
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jun 2006
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Well, reference those people at Ft. Hood where a cop showed up and helped them while in need. Point taken. However, I expect that exactly NONE of those soldiers were wishing there was a cop around when that Muslim was firing on them. I'm guessing they were wishing they could've had their piece on them on-base. What they were wishing is likely for the shooting to stop. Reality being what reality is, they did NOT have weapons, and reality being what reality is, there would almost certainly have been far more casualties if 300 armed soldiers started shooting at the same time from friendly fire. I don't know why you don't respect cops but expect them to respect you.
Not many problems you can't fix
With a 1911 and a 30-06
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 21,692
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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IOW, cops or the lack thereof, only become an issue to me when my own government disarms me in the face of criminals and then their agents fail to be their to provide protection. I'd rather spend my money on a gun than another cop over at the county seat. Again, sorry, but just telling it like it is. Just to show you that I'm not trying to pick on you Cole, I offer this story. A few years back, when Kentucky passed their CCDW law, people used to always tell me at traffic stops that they had their gun, and that they had a permit for it. My pat answer was that if they didn't pull theirs, I wouldn't pull mine, and we would get along fine. I was also asked numerous times, how I felt about that law. My answer for that was, the country I grew up in was covered in guns. I told them that if you went into the courthouse and yelled "Drop the Gun!" They would cover up the floor in Government Model Colts, and Smith J Frames. Everybody was armed. I don't mind that at all. It seems to make everyone a little more "polite" for lack of a better descriptor. Anyway, I understand your point. Hope you can understand mine.
"The number one problem with America is, a whole lot of people need shot, and nobody is shooting them."
-Master Chief Hershel Davis
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
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Posts: 54,284 |
I never said I didn't respect cops. Go back and re-read the posts. I don't respect you, but that's because of your past behavior on here. I have a lot of respect for Powell, Terry, NHK9, and even Hunter.
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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the po po have never understood the anxiety they cause in the average Citizen when there is an 'interface' between cop and Citizen.
On the other hand, maybe they do...........
. Amen to that, Cole. Amen! Some of those good publik servants " get off" pushing around Joe Publik Taxpayer.
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
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Posts: 54,284 |
I understand completely and took no offense.
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 54,284
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 54,284 |
Well, reference those people at Ft. Hood where a cop showed up and helped them while in need. Point taken. However, I expect that exactly NONE of those soldiers were wishing there was a cop around when that Muslim was firing on them. I'm guessing they were wishing they could've had their piece on them on-base. What they were wishing is likely for the shooting to stop. Reality being what reality is, they did NOT have weapons, and reality being what reality is, there would almost certainly have been far more casualties if 300 armed soldiers started shooting at the same time from friendly fire.I don't know why you don't respect cops but expect them to respect you. I don't believe that point for a second.
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 50,169 |
Some of those good publik servants "get off" pushing around Joe Publik Taxpayer. There is some truth to that statement, but some "Joe Publik Taxpayers" cry about be being oppressed for profit, fun or sense of importance. Lots of them.
The only thing worse than a liberal is a liberal that thinks they're a conservative.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 21,959 |
In my own admittedly limited experience, when I have been pleasant/respectful with cops they return the favor, if I was an azzhat, they weren't nice, but still not unprofessional. I used to be, ahem, sort of a speeder and had a few instances to verify the above! 
"For joy of knowing what may not be known we take the golden road to Samarkand."
James Elroy Flecker
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