Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Backpack Hunting Wiggy's sleeping bags?

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Hey, where's kutenay?! If she were here, it would be an OFFICIAL Wiggy-bashing thread! Somebody drop her a PM, would ya!

Wow. You guys are entirely too predictable.

Those of you who have dealt with me personally know that I'm a no-nonsense kinda guy. I don't sell anything that I have not proven to myself works as stated.

There's not a soul on this planet who knows more about sleeping in the cold than I. I make it my business to take these bags to the limits.

Not every person is the same, however, and I find that most don't really know much about sleeping in the cold when they venture out, therefore a person is bound to have a bad experience once in a while. About 3/4 of the time, regardless of the bag brand, it is the sleeper at fault because he/she expects too much from a "zip-yourself-in-a-bag-and-expect-a-good-experience" experience.

I take the time to educate each of my customers about the capabilities and limitations of each bag I sell. Including the HEAVY ones that are not necessarily backpacking bags.

My favorite is the overweight, middle-age man who wants a LIGHT WEIGHT sleeping bag for his upcoming sheep hunt. That is always fun! But, I still tell him like it is.

Wear too much in your bag? You're limiting the performance of your bag, not enhancing it. Don't hamper warm air from filling the bag. It will fill with warm air or cold air. Your choice.

Sleeping on an inflatable pad? You're heating air and the ground is cooling it faster than you can heat it.

Not munching before you go to the bag? You're gonna "run outa gas" and blame the bag.

Complaining about a draft collar? Failing to realize that you have one. Roll up an article of clothing, knucklehead!

Feet get cold? It happens to some. Get yourself some booties or the like. Not everyone has great circulation to the feet.

Going to bed cold? The bag is going to KEEP you cold. Go to bed WARM.

Condensation on the outside of your bag? GOOD. It's not on the inside of your bag. That is where the cold air is meeting the warm air.

Bag getting heavier every day? 'Cause it's DOWN! It doesn't breathe.

Cold on your COT? DOUBLE your pad. It's a must on a cot.


Okay, back to your bashing. Childish, but entertaining all the same.

Want to listen to these drooling idiots? Fine.

Want to know about sleeping in the cold in a Wiggy bag? Call me.

Taylor

I sold Wiggy Bags before you did. Have heard customer testimonials first hand. Have dealt with Wiggy.

Nuff said...

Over 800 Wiggy bags just in 2009 out of this shop, Brad. I can count customer bad experiences in the last 5 years ON ONE HAND. Some people just have no business sleeping outside, as I'm sure you know. Some just don't know how.

Not nocking or quesioning your experience, Brad. Just stating mine here.

Taylor

Ok, we have the wiggy's bag for 218.00
Slumberjack Gamma for 160.00
the BA farewell for 153.00
The montbell SS #1 for 175.00
North face Pyxis for 240.00

This is the related competition, construction and price.

Most of us here are researchers or gear heads. We're not buying camping sleeping bags. If we want a syn sleeping bag to pack, what's the best bag to get, that's all that matters here.

I would pick the North face for weight or the montbell for room, and pray I survive the night.

Kent

No offense, but thats about the stupidest thing i have ever heard. I use a sleeping bag to warm me when i am cold and keep me warm. Isn't that the purpose of a sleeping bag? All my sleeping bags seem to do that for me.

Big W -- I'll explain:

Sit around a campfire until your feet are cold and you get a chill, then go to the bag. You'll have a much harder time getting warm than if you have been up and around doing chores.

Many of my customers are sheep hunters. They are exhausted at the end of a day. Eat. Warm up. THEN go to the bag. Don't go to the bag exhausted and cold.

Put something warm in a Thermos and it will keep it warm. Put something cold in a Thermos and it will keep it cold.

krp - price is not a factor if you have weight/climate/size parameters that you are trying to meet and all models are not comperable.

Taylor

It sounds as if this Marc Taylor knows what he's talking about? I don't know why every one says he's so abrasive? Maybe the Wiggys bags are just too heavy to back pack?

I'm putting the the competition in a price range, it wouldn't be fair to compare the wiggy's with ID or the slick bag.

I simply put the montbell and NF above the wiggy's as better tech wise. The NF gives up 6 inchs of girth and that's not a little thing, but has the climashield neo that is great. It weighs at least a pd less at 3 lbs. The montbell is techniquely a better bag.

I love my BA bags but don't have to deal with cold below 10 deg often, wouldn't be my choice as a dedicated cold bag.

That leaves the wiggys and slumberjack gamma going head to head, they look alot alike spec wise, both USA made, a plus.

What's the magic of the wiggys, it's not the only bag with climashield, or has breathable fabric. It's not the roomiest, lightest, smallest packed.

On this site you have to sell to gear heads that look at everything. You have to prove your product. It's different than selling to some fat sheephunter that came to Alaska with no gear or knowledge.

I'm not against wiggys, never seen one, but spec wise it seems slumberjackish and not the best choice. Not your fault. That's what you are up against.

Kent

Well I know I am in the minority here as I actually LIKE my wiggy's bag. Its a 15 degree bag that has been perfectly warm down to 20 degrees so far and with the overbag its rated to -15 and took it down to lows of -20 and stayed warm just fine snowshoeing last feb.

I have owned slumberjacks in the past and atleast the models I was using do not begin to compare with the quality of the wiggy's atleast. I go to bed with damp clothes in the slumberjack and wake up just as wet as they were when I went to bed. In a wiggy's they seem to actually dry and yes the outside of my bag is damp, but the water had to go somewhere. I found them to be very true to the temp rating IME. But I also go to bed on a full stomach and sleep with a hat on, I just assume most people do this.

Granted at 3.5 pounds for a 15 degree bag it could be considered 1.5 pounds overweight comparing to some of the WM and Montbell down bags, but after feeling how clammy my buddy's down bag felt on Kodiak after day 4. I was pretty much sold that the extra 1.5 pounds is worth it if I am backpacking and my only real way to hope to dry my clothes out drying crappy weather is to sleep with it in my bag as often the case that is the only way to get my clothes dry when backpacking. And my wiggy's glacier hunter also compacts to about 2/3s the size of my other buddy's 0 degree BA down bag.

I was looking hard the Montbell Spirals at just under 2 pounds for a 15 degree bag that also has some stretch, but being as I am packrafting all summer in addition to less than impressive weather during hunting season makes be want to stay syn over down. No I'm not going to start the debate. If down works for you great, but Mr. Murphy likes me a lot I guess as he visits me often. And even in waterproof sil-nylon sacks things still seem to happen at times. No my tent doesn't leak, but other things. Example I slept on top of my camelback straw between my pad and bag. I know I know I'm just lucky

Not saying they are the end all and be all, but for my uses they work fine. If you are looking for a superlight weight bag then no wiggy's isn't for you. If you want a bag that is decently light and works well even when damp (not soaking wet) then you might consider a wiggy's. But like others said there are a ton of choices out there. Consider your needs and what works best for you and choose accordingly. I have no regrets about my purchase and after reading the posts here consider myself lucky.

Thanks, best laugh I've had all day.

alaska_lanche, with respect, comparing brands (Wiggy vs Slumberjack) doesn't tell us anything unless we know the kind of synthetic fill in each. Some companies use different kinds of synthetic fill in different bag models. There is considerable range of properties in various fills: weight to loft, longevity, condensation, softness, etc.

FWIW I slept three nights near timberline in a damp older and well worn Slumberjack Everest Elite last week, with the bag wet though in places. 48 hours of rain with strong gusty wind on ten inches of snow produced a sloppy flood, till it finally and blessedly froze hard the last night. I slept plenty warm and my wet synthetic clothes dried each night. I've done the same in a down bag.

I went to bed cold each night, though not deeply cold, and as has been my universal experience, I warmed up in my bag.

Marc, we know what you mean but you kind of overstated the case about getting into a sleeping bag cold will keep you cold. The thermos analogy isn't parrallel because the content of a thermos isn't producing heat like a metabolizing body does. A sleeping bag with a human in it has a heater in it. Unless the body is deeply hypothermic it generates heat which is captured inside the bag and everything inside gets warmer if it is a decent bag at all. As you modified later, if a person is really cold, especially if low on calories, it will take longer to warm up and that's for sure. He may not ever get warm enough to be comfortable. But a normal healthy body warms up the inside of a small insulated space to some extent.

Got a grin from your comment about knowing more about sleeping cold than any human on earth. There are a few old Innuit who know a little, and a northern Cree trapper friend of mine routinely sleeps out in minus 40 with no sleeping bag, blankets etc. He does like to have a piece of canvas to lay on. Now I know where to send him for pointers.

Agreed. However, the prices between the bags were the same. The temp rating on the sumberjack was for 0 vs. the wiggy's at 15. Been cold in the slumberjack at 20 degrees even though its rated for 0 and doesn't dry the clothes out as well either as the wiggy's. Also the slumberjack was heavier and didn't compress as well as the wiggy's. It doesn't really matter what loft amount, insulation type, or model of bag they cost the same and one does a better job of keeping you warm, is lighter, and allows moisture to pass to the outside of the bag more readily that is the bag I'll choose. However, that said I have never considered slumberjack a good brand of sleeping bag so wiggy's coming out on top of this comparison doesn't really say much.

Like I said work what works for you, if its a down WM bag then great, if its a $80 slumberjack then use that if thats what you like. We all get the chance to pick what fits us.

Alaska, nice report, haven't talked to ya in awhile. I'm interested in this because I'm also wanting to get a 0 deg synthetic bag. Seems now days all you can do is research specs. Optics, backpacks, sleeping bags, most everything.

On paper, looking at the midlevel bags, for a dedicated cold bag, it goes.
NF with climashield neo, weighs 3 lbs, the only issue is a 62 inch girth, much smaller than the rest.
Montbell SS synthetic, weighs the same as the wiggys, techniquely better with draft collar and roomier, should move moisture fine.
Wiggys, basically an oversized climashield military type bag system, not alot of features but serviceable.
The Slumberjack gamma is also a part of a military type SVCSS system, specs out like a clone of the wiggys, just longer, not your normal slumberjack.
The BA system I like but can be 6 1/2 lbs with a syn over bag and a down inner plus pad, defeats it's purpose, and I still need a closed cell pad. Works great at 25 deg and above.

I just wonder if the wiggys bag works fine and I don't doubt it when those like yourself say so, then will a better tech bag work better? For those that haven't bought a bag yet it's a realistic question. I wouldn't trade in a bag I already have if it's working. That's like guys who have to have the latest Bows, or packs or tents every year.

I guess the best question to ask is, if your bag was destroyed, would you buy the exact same one with all the choices now?

I'm thinking ahead for a black bear hunt in Alaska sometime.

Talk to ya later.

Kent

Well with the WM bags being twice as much as a Wiggys with not twice the performance, I dont know if I'd go that route.

Kinda like buying a Kimber vs. a NULA. You might not get QUITE the same performance with an ultralight 84M vs. the NULA but for 1/3 the price, it just might do OK....

Kent,

That Montbell bag looks interesting for sure. Are you looking at the 0 or 15 degree?

Not sure how well it compresses, but I am sure its comparable to the Wiggy's or better.

I am able to fit my 15 degree Wiggy's Glacier Hunter as well as my Big Agnes insulated air core pad, and all my clothes into my waterproof compression sack and compress it all down pretty small.

It all goes into this sack in fact:
http://www.rei.com/product/730884

Then it compresses from there and it all goes into the sleeping bag compartment in my pack with ease or strapped to the outside of me pack if coming out with an animal.

I was able to try on a Wiggy's bag prior to buying which I didn't have access to a Montbell which is why I went that route. Also being part of a sleep system for me is appealing to me as in the long run saves me $$$. Sure I guess if I had unlimited funds I'd buy a -40 WM down bag for winter camping as getting wet in the winter is less likely and for summer use I'd go with one of the bags you listed above if I was able to try them on. I just like the feel/cut of the Wiggy's bags. Plus I like the big retard zippers on them......because they don't seem to get caught not because I'm well ya know.

If I had to do it all over again I'd probably still go the route of the Wiggy's as its proven itself to be able to keep me warm and dry out my damp clothes better by passing moisture better than my NF cats meow or slumberjack bags I've tried. Just supersition I guess that these other bags won't work as good or better, but for know I'll go with I know what works. Good luck in your search Kent.

Now onto more serious things. The Alaska drawing application is in full effect and you need to be applying. Come on up for black bears we can chase some for sure. I'd prefer late september rather than the spring, but if all you can swing is the spring we'll make it happen so come on up with your Montbell so I can try it out.

Is my predictability good or bad....(smirk?)

I've been in your store more than once and in meeting you could tell in mere minutes you're a stand up gent and a pleasure to deal with to say the least. I have friends, who are also yours, and they will say the same thing. My comment about this thread having the potential to hit 5 pages is always true on a Wiggys thread, and that's the one thing every guy here in this thread can agree on, love the the bags or hate 'em.

I have the Wiggys bag, and I've used it on 2 Alaskan hunts, and it's going with me to Ak next year too (all 3 - moose hunts) I've used in an unheated tent, with a pad on the cold ground and woke up toasty every time. I've also used in in a heated wall tent, hardly a true test of any bag - However I will say that on the 9th day, we had all or gear flown out, save the basics so to camp one more night, so I slept in the bag, on my cot, without a pad. Waking up to a cold tent and not having a pad, my back was chilly. Imo, a pad is a must in any tent or bivy. I sleep hard, so when I'm out, I sleep fine. Perhaps others don't.

I dont hunt sheep with it, nor camp in -40 below temps with it, and I dont have another synthetic bag to compare it with, which is why I was reluctant to post. That, and I knew this thread had the potential flamage of the typical hot button threads, like "inter-racial marrage"..or "abortion".

I've never dealt with Jerry Wigutow, never needed to. I don't know first hand if the guy is anything like what is said here, but I could easily buy it. If a guy is an arrogant azzhole to his customers, it's a safe bet it will surface on the internet and the merits of that product will be slanted heavily, regardless of its craftmanship or attributes. I suspect this accounts for at least 50% of the negative posts here. Had I been talked to like a dog by someone who I'm contimplating spending hard earned money with, you can bet I'd too be going outta the way to share said displeasure, to put it nice.

Lastly, I will say that this bag is a true fother mucker to get rolled up tight enough to get it compressed to fit back in the carry bag......(grin)

Alaska, thinking the 0 deg bag. During the Dec/Jan archery hunts here in Az, it usually gets in the 20s and sometimes in the teens, and occasionally in single digits. My BA 15 bag is streched to it's limits even with an extra closed cell pad and light liner, extra cloths, hand warmers. I can still sleep cold. If I take an extra 35 deg bag I'm toasty but puts me at 6.5 lbs, and all down. Seems I could go with a 4 lb syn bag and my BA pad or prolite 4 for 5.5 lbs and also have a multi purpose bag for out of state hunting, hoping to get up where you're at soon.

Mark's claims are so outlandish it's hard to take him serious and I discounted wiggys. With your report of experiences it's back up in contention, I really want to try one now.

When I broke my leg in Sept elk hunting, It had been raining all afternoon, I was crossing a creek and drug myself out of the water onto the bank completely soaked. It was cloudy, in the 60s, evening time and the water was cold. In 15 minutes I was shaking uncontrollaby, shock, hypothermia, probably both. I was with someone else (Always hunt solo on my own hunts) because I was helping him on his hunt, we were day hunting. He was able to go and get help and get me out, it still took 4 hrs and I had plenty of time to play what if in my mind as I laid there.

If I was backpacking solo I would have had my BA bag, it might or might not have been wet. If I got in it there is no bottom and it is down. I would have to blow up the pad and get it in and then hope my cloths don't soak the down. I'm trying to survive a night that will get in the 40s. I already felt frozen in 20 minutes. Everything is soaked from the rain, I've made fires in those conditions before but not with a broken leg, my leg was completely snapped, flopping side to side, I don't believe I could move around enough to get dry fuel. I would have tried if I had to though. I didn't have duct tape in my daypack but do in my backpack and I didn't have my trekking pole, the two things I wanted for sure to stabalize my leg. Just an observation, temps in the 40s to 60s don't seem dangerous, even wet. I got to the hospital at 10 something at night, they did not get my body temp up to normal till the next morning even putting heated blankets on me every hour.

Lightning will probably never strike me twice and I'm not afaid of going back out or even dieing out there, might as well be comfortable doing it though.

Next time I want a big syn bag to crawl into, duct tape and pole sections to stablize my leg. Oh, I better get SPOT or my wife won't let me go.

Kent

OK, that was a danged good post



I've stated before, Marc was very good when I bought my Wiggy's bag from him, enjoyed the customer service.

can't say why he feels the need to chest thump so hard when he's on here.

I've no doubt Taylor has BTDT, but he ain't the only guy that has.

some of the guys that he called out have some decent experience bping and hunting.

I've done a fair bit of both myself.

guys killed game with open sighted lever guns and trapper nelson packboards, and the guys that know how to hunt still could and use a woolen blanket for their sleep system if necessary. It's the Indian not the arrows.

this IS the bping thread, with a bit of personal experience in bp hunting, if I have a guy new to the gig ask me what sleep bag he should purchase, it's not going to be a Wiggy's bag. Not because JW is an umitigated azzhole or that Taylor doesn't come across here as well as he does via the phone, it's just based on experience of using different bags including the Wiggy's bag.

that ain't bashing, it's just a natural fact.

I don't have a Kimber, I use a NULA now, why? they don't make a lh Kimber, so even though I finally bought a NULA and really like it, I wouldn't reco it to a newbie, you got to make sure hunting high country is really your gig and face it, it's not for everybody, you must make compromise on creature comforts to do lightweight bping.


perhaps it's Taylor's Marine background IIRC, you either fight or flight, give me a guy that'll fight anyday. But I wish for Marc's sake and those of his friends that have his back that he could let a little more of the MT show through here and what I experienced on the phone than what he does.


I'm sure Marc could do what he's done using another brand bag, and I could get by with my Wiggy's if that's all I had to work with, but for bping in my personal experience I think there's better choices.

but I don't expect the Ford salesman to drive a GMC cause I drive one.


I will say I found it telling his obvious disdain about "middle aged fat guys wanting to hunt sheep"

I guided for a spell and I saw that attitude in some of my coworkers,
yeah it's frustrating to have a client that's overweight and not in good shape, (have also seen guys with a pot belly that could walk most guys into the ground, so you never know) but hell if they didn't need your services they wouldn't be paying for them.

some of those middle aged fat guys would have loved to hunt sheep in their 20-30's when they were studs, but life gets in the way sometimes, they have mortgages, kids to put thru school etc. by the time they feel they can spend that money on themselves they've been in mgmt, parked behind a desk and had too many good dinners.

I always tried to be grateful for every client we had, their check clearing is what paid my wages and allowed me to spend so much time outdoors.

different strokes for different folks, whether bags or how we view our customers or potential customers/

I've had 2 Wiggy bags for awhile now.Didn't get them from Marc because he wasn't around then.

They're good bags but they do not have the supernatural powers some proclaim.

For me Wiggy's bags are not for backpacking,just to heavy and bulky.

Thank you. You just made an astute post yourself.

FWIW I need to buy a new bp bag so am paying attention here and to other sleeping bag threads. My aging Slumberjack was a gift, chosen for its light weight, about two pounds, with never any illusions about it being top of the technology. I use it way less than a no label one pound bag of unknown origins. I picked it out of a bin of left over gear donated to a wilderness camping program by North Face, I think. I suspect it was some kind of one-off test bag. My friend who ran the program told me to take anything I wanted because they had taken everything they could use.

I seldom backpack in deep cold anymore, though for late Oct. and early Nov. hunts in mountains along the Canadian border we have to be prepared for sudden deep cold. I have some big hefty bags for deep cold when transported by vehicle, and on a few Oct. horse hunts I've taken both the one and two pound bags, using both at once in base camp and using the light bag for distant bivvies. It's time I replaced both of those bags, and there are more choices for "summer weight" bags now.

Personal factors of discomfort/comfort vary so widely between different people that it takes some experience and reading between the lines to evaluate what people say in terms that apply to my style. My tolerance for what would be discomfort for many people is pretty high. Because of those personal factors, plus variations on how people use bags (on what kind of pad, wearing what inside, fully zipped? etc.) I totally ignore temperature ratings for sleeping bags. They may be of some value for the same basic models of bags from the same company.

Sounds like I need to meet Marc in person and pick his brain.