Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire Is God vengeful??

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zOWx5G76pkU


this explains everything

Guess I should be an able minister of the other side then with my 155 IQ. Gosh, I could get 'em saved over twice as fast as the IQ70 crowd. Funny how that never seems to work out, though. Laffin'!

This morning I was listening to a speaker and was reminded of a rather simple theory which I have pondered for more than 50 years. It appears that we seek the answers to four basic/broad questions in our lives:

Who am I (identity)?
From whence did I come (origin)?
Why am I here? (purpose)
Where am I going? (destiny).

Those can be seen as a search for personal freedom and actualization - and I think that the answers do bring great freedom to some people - maybe millions.

Seems like almost every system described as a "religion" is built with some or all of those queries. As each person searches for the answers, he/she may encounter and dig into various "religions" for resolution. But, no "religion" as such seems to do it all as such.

In my case, being a Christian is not at all tied to any "religion", denomination or organization - those systems do not fully work, and at times they cause messes. So, I suppose that I am not at all "religious".

However, my personal relationship with the triune God, as bolstered by His Scriptures, answers those four basic questions completely, and the resulting walk is explanatory, guiding, fulfilling and abounding with hope. I cannot speak for anyone else's approach - but God speaks with omniscience.

The old theory seems to hold very well - but the above merely puts a scratch on the surface of the issue.

Well Bark..

it is a choice... evident by those that don't have a belief in God..

My belief in God is not a "cover my fanny" scenario..and there is no game playing on my end..

just for the record..

it is religion, contaminated by man kind that I have a problem with..

Well Keith,

those 'critics' also have an IQ of 155 or so..
only difference in their's versus yours, is they don't notice the decimal somewhere in theirs...1.55 to 15.5

of course that is why they are liberals..they don't need to pay attention to details and they convince themselves they are always right and everyone who doesn't think as they do are wrong.. that is what make them liberals..

GUS! Where in the Hell are you when we need you so bad?

Whether God is vengeful or not, is not my concern. It's His/Hers.

God gave me the ability to reason for myself, and the rope with which to hang myself, should I choose to use it.

What I do in this life, is my own call; His/Hers later to Judge, based upon my actions, ones that I, alone, am responsible for.

I get one shot at this life, and intend to live it as I see fit. After that, it is, literally, out of my hands.

Besides, I don't presume myself as omnipotent as God, so if I ask Him/Her to guide me, and make a decision/action after that, I can only hope that He/She did so guide, if I find/believe the action to be right.

As to the vengeful part; God may not be, but I can be. So be it.

Of course, YMMV....

Seafire,

Helping a buddy clean up some reclaimed hardwwod here so I just have a sec... you mentioned dismay at the idea that a hole in the ground was a piss-poor way for it all to end. Paraphrasing; correct me if that's not accurate. But anyway, from MY spiritual perspective, what could be more beautiful than a hole in the ground?

"What is", is fundamentally beautiful. It is undeniably where you came from- all questions of God aside- and it's where you GET to go back to!

The loss of individuality is what gives people the willies. As in, most people want to believe that they will exist as a discrete entity post-death. I don't need that, because my spirituality centers around connectivity and oneness.

Just some thoughts. People hear me say I don't believe in God and imagine I, and many like me, are in a spiritual wasteland. Quite the opposite. Love abounds!

yes there are the 4 questions, do any of them need an answer? I co-exsist within the tribe as all tribal animals do........I am no greater or less than the animals I hunt.

I could write a book, but it would still be just words, I would say some what you say is correct.

God lives in eternity, not just back and forward, all directions. He is everywhere. The bible supports this. Therefore he is not a physical presence. He would not speak in words, words are time and place related. When, where, why, how, who. God can not be contained in those words or defined by them. That's the only way we know how to communicate and so attempt to make God in our image. The bible is man's words defining God, a good foundation and containing the most rudiment description but not God's literal words. Seems there are also some of man's words about physical worship, tithing, temples, sacrifice, baptism, that God really could care less about but the church needs.

I don't know what he really is, just what he is not, I will just say spirit but doesn't explain all the facets. I don't believe he does miracles in the physical world, probably pays little attention. He is concerned with our spirit, we could be dying with a great positive spirit and he would rejoice, we could be rich and healthy with a festered spirit and he would feel sorrow. I believe he has expressed these emotion communications to those writing the bible, read between the lines. I think they added other things on their own also for congregational control.

I believe God is pure emotion, our true reality is pure emotion, though we put an emphasis on the physical, that's our existence right now. Religion is our physical manifestation of our God belief, there's no way it is pure.

The closer we can get to pure love/emotion, the closer to God we will be. God is love, live in God... if there is a heaven it is just living in God and all those with him.

The path of hopelessness/despair, hate, Satan, I don't believe the end but a hard road to travel and probably needing help to get off. I think there will be great deeds to be done after, what are we preparing for here, to lay at Gods feet and throne and eat grapes, mindless slugs or suffer physical pain for eternity.

Which is the heaven and which is hell. A slave to God or a slave to the devil, either or. We were given free will here and should be multiplied after, made in Gods image. I chose not to be a slave to either, I will serve willingly for good. Evil from either direction I will fight.

Jesus didn't write, didn't preach, he spoke in parables, he spoke in as close an emotional language as he could, tugging on our heart strings.

Now, many things we do as Christians are great, I just see a different angle... prayer, especially when more than one will pray the power will be multiplied. Power of spirit, Holy spirit if you will coming from inside each one. Concentrating on the spirit of another, healing that spirit and sometimes indirectly the physical with just an inner well being. I also believe there are the same good forces in other religions and don't think they are excluded, God is everywhere, there are as many paths as souls.

When my son died my spirit/soul was shattered, every one that said they prayed, thought of me and him, just said 'I'm sorry'... or 'Sorry'. Gave me a piece of their spirit's glue to help put the pieces back, as many as I could, didn't matter if they were religious or none at all. I am here to witness the power of shared spirit... emotion.

My words truly don't express my real emotions of God, life, my fellow man, death and spirit... they're just man words... but my own.

Kent

Is God vengeful? by faith I believe not.

Not true. There are many religions that belief in a human. Buddism is one of the religions that belief in a human.

Please read your bible, especially the old testament. There are many examples where God took vengence on the enemies of Israel. The purpose of his vengenance was to correct disobedience and sin. God never took vengenace just for the thrill. There was always a purpose and mostly it was corrective in nature followed by restoration.

God is neither male or female. God is God.

KRP,

The reason that I found what you wrote about God interesting is that in your view, if I understand correctly, the relationship between any man and God is voluntary and completely inclusive. It matters not at all if the man is Adolf Hitler, Pol Pot, Osama Bin Laden, Billy Graham, Mother Theresa, you or me. It only requires the emotional desire to be connected to God. Moreover, the relationship is completely independent of what we have done in life because good, evil, sin, religion as well as parts of the Bible are just creations of men and are nothing to God.

Your theology raises some interesting questions though. For example; Are the 10 Commandments
something Moses made up for 'congregational control'? If sin is a creation of man, did Jesus really die for them?

You have mentioned more than once that your written words cannot accurately reflect what you mean so I apologize if I have mis/over-interpreted.

Please add my condolences to you and your family for the loss of your son.

Carbon

He must be vengeful or he would have not allowed this thread to start.

Years ago, a life ago, I took theology classes. I can't remember per verse and not going to look it up, again we could write a book on just a few points. Seriously I can cherrypick verses to substantiate any view I want, talk to 5 different Christians and you will hear about 6 different Gods.

Legalize out of the way. going by my memories years ago and questions unanswerable. These are subjects I wrote in essays, I got good grades and strange looks.

Why did Moses have to go up the mountain, God's arms too short. I jest because to me God is so much more than the small God the jews wrote about. He feels inspired by God's spirit, therefore he received the 10 commandments from God. Could be as simple as needing a cohesive symbol for fractioning tribes at that moment.

Where would God's anger come from, he made everything, he knew the course it would run. Again man trying to fit God into their mold, They are angry so therefore God is also, They defeat their enemies, therefore God used them to smite his enemies and destroy them... the killing was justifiable under God's anger... holy even.

Scary hell with a demon of torture... So the devil has freewill, he can leave God and go his own way. He can present himself before God and talk with him about current events in a normal conversation, look up Job. He is a fallen angel and will control most of the souls when all is said and done... We are to be more than angels, more powerful, how can he have any sway over us. If he is allowed before God, why wouldn't any soul, even Hitler's, to state their case and ask for redemption, and wouldn't our brother Jesus stand there in our defense, even the most low of us.

Contradictions, I could go on. I believe the premise correct, there are emotions of God's in there that he wanted revealed.

There are many more.

For myself, I feel I've distilled my faith down to the lowest point. He's not a small God.

God is pure love, God is life eternal, live in God... purely biblical...

Kent

I don't believe that at all. The Bible is God's written word to all people. Evil and sin are very much something to God. Those concepts are the very reason that God laid aside His kingdom of heaven for a time and took on flesh to suffer the indignities this life offers and suffered horribly on a Roman cross. It's no small wonder these things are mysteries to us, but through study and prayer much can be revealed to those who would seek out these answers.

A relationship with God was made possible by the death of Christ. It comes only after salvation through Christ. Once that transformation of our spirit takes place, our sins are removed forever: past, present, and future. Sin after salvation, while on this earth has earthly consequences like any wrong decision, but no consequences on our eternal spiritual salvation. The best way to stay as free as possible from such sin, is through an ongoing relationship with God.

'

I've read this whole thread and it reinforces a contradiction in reasoning that I became aware of years ago :

The same guys who have no problem accepting the fact that the universe is so immense that its size is incomprehensible to our minds will demand of the Creator of the universe that He be understandable to us . Our puny selves demand that He satisfy our intellect and - once that is done - we will allow for His existence .

Jesus Christ is very real and as Brother Lawrence put it many years ago : " He is within you - look not for Him elsewhere . "

Once He is accepted , all questions will vanish .

Until He is accepted , no answer will satisfy .

Excellent post! Well said.