Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunting Optics Shipping Optics to Canada..... BEWARE !

It appears that the USPS and US Customs do not have the same rules for shipment of Optics to Canada.

If you use PayPal or Click-n-Ship to create a paid label, part of the process is checking off a box confirming that you are not shipping and prohibited or restricted items as defined here:

http://pe.usps.gov/text/Imm/ce_003.htm#ep6216933

But not so fast. I had a scope being shipped to Canada seized by our stalwart Homeland Security guys (US Customs) because they claim I needed an export license for it.

After hours on the phone (all you get is "we're to busy to talk to you" recordings), I handed it off to my US Senator. Doubt I'll ever see the scope as it will probably be "sold" at some Customs Auction held at 2 AM on Christmas Eve.

The meaning of those bumper stickers "I love my country, but fear my government" is getting more clear!

You will get your scope back, but its going to cost you a holding fee. I think I paid a couple hundred dollars to get mine back after the same thing happened to me. Bad thing is, I asked the USPS before I shipped it and they said no problem.

Well I'm paying no fee as I conformed 100% to USPS regs.

It is not their employers (us) problem they they can't get their acts together.

Nice thing about being from a state with <500K people and two U.S. Senators...... they take an interest in every voter.

I'm just wondering how a scope going from WY to BC ends up seized in Chicago. There may be more to this than meets the eye, given Chicago's record of complete corruption for decades.

You can find help here, oldman..

http://www.wamhsac.org/

Can't believe that I clicked on that link.

Have shipped scopes to Canada with no problems, just declare what they where and value my Canadian friend had to pay duty when it was pickup up in ontario, used USPS in July.
Good luck
Anie

Shipping scopes to Canada without jumping through a bunch of hoops is not legal. If it was hassle-free you broke laws and got away with it. Unlikely you will be so lucky next time.

Karen
If you had a clue it would be even better... You just fell into an end game with that scope and it will cost more to recover than the scope is worth.

Those auctions are well advertised and available. They really want people to know about them and make them as easy and well-timed as possible... It is a revenue stream for them.

Routing of stuff to Canada always goes through a USPS US Customs Port... Chicago may be the closest route.

I sure am glad you are posting now instead of Framis. I mean he is like all confused all the time and does really stupid stuff...

Oh wait! Are you sure you aren't Framis?
art laughing

Well maybe I got away with 1, when you walk into the post office and telling them what you are shipping you think they would have stopped me! Declared a $300 value on a conquest from camerland and my friend had to pay about $30c

Well here are the facts (which you and I will agree are totally stupid), but they are the facts.
1. The Post Office does not set the rules for what may or may not be shipped w/o an export license. They will accept anything that you ship as long as it does not violate their Safety regulations.
2. The Department of Commerce is in charge of what requires a license and why.
3. Several years ago the USA entered into a treaty with other OAS countries to attempt to stop the flow of inter country shipments of firearms, ammo, explosives and so on. Some idiot bureaucrat added all optical sighting devices to the list. From there it went into legislation (which we know they pass w/o reading), then into the Federal Register (which no one reads) and then into Commerce Dept Regulations.
4. Since Canada is an OAS member.... bingo, if you send a scope w/o a license you are violating a Federal law. If you send it and lie about what is in the box, the Black Helos will be landing on your lawn.

I spent at least 12 hours on the phone with my US Senator, Commerce Dept., the Post Office & US Customs. Also countless hours were expended with this document:

http://www.gpo.gov/bis/ear/ear_data.html

If you look in section 744 Category 0 you will find optical sights under "Misc." with a code of 0A987 on page 8.
You will note that one of the codes applied to scopes is "FC".
That stands for the "Firearms Convention" which was the outcome of the OAS treaty. If you find the country code chart, you will note that Canada has an X in the FC column. That means anything with an FC code cannot go to Canada w/o a license AND you need a new license every time you send an item to a different addressee. In the case of Canada, the addressee ALSO has to get an import license from Customs-Canada !

Now, maybe because of the intervention of Senator Barrasso, I
MIGHT get the scope back and I MIGHT not be fined. We'll see.

The Customs guy in Chicago told me that they were really stepping up their enforcement efforts relative to shipments among OAS countries because they have has quite a few incidents of boxes labeled "gift" being full of weapons ,ammo, explosives etc. (Weapons, ammo and their parts are under The State Department which has it own set of Regs as does Fish & Wildlife, the FAA and so.)

So you do whatever you want, BUT if they catch you, you'll lose the item, pay a fine and if you lied about what you were shipping, they will land on you with both feet.

I have become an expert on Commerce Dept regs., not because I wanted to, but because I had to to figure out this mess.

More to follow.

Hope you stay out of jail

That doesn't appear to be a risk as Customs well understands what a confused mess for the ordinary USPS customer who assumes the USPS has the facts (which they do not) and, of course, the prescribed penalty under the regulation for my violation is a fine.

Bridger-Teton eh? can see it out our front door.

It takes an export permit from the US gov't to ship the scope out of the States to Canada, which takes 3 weeks and is free. The Canadian gov't doesn't care.

Exactly.

The problem is the export out of the US, not the import into Canada. It is legal for me to import powder, bullets, barrels,scopes, etc for personal use across my border without a permit. It is illegal for me to cross your border without the export permit with the same items.

This is actually a bigger issue than many people realise. Apparently you can't export a scope over x4 power outside of Europe without the same sort of export paperwork...

Real easy to avoid this BS Don't ship to Canada.......

bosslady, have spent alot of time on bobcat and wildcat mtns up the pilgrim creek drainage still very wild country today lots of grizz

And heaven forbid you try to ship something with a mil-dot out of the country. Dont ask me about that mess but you would think sending it to an active duty service man overseas via USPS would have been ok. Live and learn....

Karen
Where went all the bluster?

USPS employees are specifically NOT allowed to make ANY judgement about the legality of shipping anything. They may only say their rules do not allow such a thing. If they were allowed to make legal judgements they would actually have to know everything about their rules AND all laws... Pretty foolish to expect that.

You sure are getting fully engaged here since Framis left...
art laughing

You know SD, since you apparently don't know who you are posting to and are contributing nothing of value to this thread why don't just watch and learn from those of us who have ACTUALLY been through this process and wish to advise other members of the pitfalls associated with exports ?
In plain English, stop being a troll.

For those interested: I spoke with Customs Canada this AM and they have No requirement (as LongDraw stated) for an import license for telescopes and are not a signatory (sp?) to the OAS treaty that started the whole mess. So all the stupidity can be laid on our Congress and how the Commerce Department chose to implement whatever law the Congress passed.

What was the old TV show: "Incredible but True" ?

And some wonder why the Chinese will win in the long run?