|
|
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 27,692
Campfire Ranger
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 27,692 |
Am I the only one that is thinking that the best way to resolve a lot of this would be to get John, Matt, and Larry in one place and have them bring their rifles, put them to the test, and video (and post) the results?  I think that would make for some great entertainment viewing.
Member: Clan of the Turdlike People.
Courage is Fear that has said its Prayers
�If we ever forget that we are one nation under God, then we will be a nation gone under.� Ronald Reagan.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 12,895
Campfire Outfitter
|
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 12,895 |
Formula is:
Distance to Target(Yards) = Height of Target (Inches) divided by he Size(mils) x 27.77.
Assuming this is a nice Mulie Buck, then TOp of back to botttom of chest is about 15 inches and it looks like it subtends 2 mils so . . . . . .
15/2 mils x 27.77 = 208 yards.
BMT
Or if you want the easy way Range in Meters= Target size in meters x1000/height in Mils So in the case above, if we guestimate the height of the target is just under half a meter, but more than a third of a meter, and it subtends 2 Mil Range = (.4x1000)/2 = 200m Notice the nice simple math when combining Mils with linear measurements in Meters. Anybody who thinks using imperial measurements or MOA is easier is simply scared of metric!
Last edited by Pete E; 11/04/10.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 21,826 Likes: 3
Campfire Ranger
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 21,826 Likes: 3 |
Anybody who thinks using imperial measurements or MOA is easier is simply scared of metric! Or have never used it in real life. It was fine in college chem lab, but everything here is still in inches. BMT
"The Church can and should help modern society by tirelessly insisting that the work of women in the home be recognized and respected by all in its irreplaceable value." Apostolic Exhortation On The Family, Pope John Paul II
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 12,168 Likes: 16
Campfire Outfitter
|
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 12,168 Likes: 16 |
Pete E, Using MOA the formula is: Range = (target in inches) Divided by MOA X 100 Range = 15 / 7.5 X 100 = 200yds Most hunters in the US are not used to using Meters as a measurement of target size, much less a unit for distance. How many meters is an elk�s chest? Most elk are about 28� back to brisket so using MOA is simpler for me. 3 MOA is about 950 yds 4 MOA is about 700 yds 5 MOA is about 560 yds 6 MOA is about 470 yds 7 MOA is about 400 yds 8 MOA is about 350 yds I wouldn�t say I was scared of metric but am not willing to switch over at this point in my life. Besides, I though the metric system was just one more step toward The New World Order. Crap maybe I am scared.  Another big advantage for me is the linear nature of wind drift in MOA and using imperial yards as the unit for distance. In a 10MPH wind the drift of my 243 is a simple divide by 2 formula at 7000ft and 30degs. 243 10MPH Drift 300 yds = 1.5 MOA 400yds = 2 MOA 500yds = 2.5 MOA 600yds = 3 MOA 700yds = 3.5 MOA 800yds = 4 MOA 900yds = 4.5 MOA Switching to the 264 we can use almost the same formula but the 264 is divide by 2 minus 1 Example is: 800yds = 3 MOA While we engrave the 10 MPH drift on the DCT for each yardage it simple for me, by a long shot, to use MOA instead of mils.
John Burns
I have all the sources.
They can't stop the signal.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 32,312
Campfire 'Bwana
|
|
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 32,312 |
No, no, Roy got it right. Well, almost.
It's the Cliff notes for the condensed version of Hemingway's "For Whom the Bell Tolls". It's a good read when you are waiting for the barrel to cool. Glad you still have a sense of humor....... Lol, yeah.... I ran that drop chart at 25-yd increments out to 1000 yds (though at this point it's just hypothesis past 875 or so), and with a column for a 10 mph full value crosswind. It got big. I make smaller ones for my sporters but I do like that big honkin' chart for that rifle. Best part- it's a chart that has been tweaked and vetted by shooting a bunch over enough time and across enough different conditions that I know it speak'um truth! That Conquest sure has been a reliable longer-range scope. Chattering Leup erectors are part of what led me to try a Conquest and I've not been disapointed by them. In fairness, Leup did address that in their latest rework of the VX3's supposedly. I guess this is a roundabout way of saying, when my $750 was on the line, and after some direct comparisons with the 4.5-14 Leup we were talking about, I preferred this scope on balance. The easy "spec sheet vs. spec sheet" ding on it is that it has less erector travel than the Leup so I'll concede that one up front, though what has takes me WAY far out there.... A reticle having some windage hash marks would be very nice, whatever their metric was. Points to John's scope for that, too. When I was running a Rapid-Z I did appreciate that aspect of the reticle. At any rate, in the business of long-range shooting I'm just an enthusiastic midlevel participant who appreciates very much the wealth of knowledge that guys like Pat, Dober, John, Rost, JWP, JoeCool, and heck even Larry <BSEG> bring to the forum.
The CENTER will hold.
Reality, Patriotism,Trump: you can only pick two
FÜCK PUTIN!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 18,453
Campfire Ranger
|
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 18,453 |
Am I the only one that is thinking that the best way to resolve a lot of this would be to get John, Matt, and Larry in one place and have them bring their rifles, put them to the test, and video (and post) the results? And after they shoot their known rifle, supply a (one) rifle unknown with a day to familiarize themselves with it and see who is really the best shot.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 12,168 Likes: 16
Campfire Outfitter
|
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 12,168 Likes: 16 |
RDFinn, I want to be the worst shot but have brought the best rifle, so I am gonna sandbag like crazy if I have to shoot something else. The point being any jackass (me) can shoot good with one of them Greybulls. 
John Burns
I have all the sources.
They can't stop the signal.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 18,453
Campfire Ranger
|
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 18,453 |
Based on what BobinNH stated I would have to agree that your rifles make long range shootin easy. But, heck, after shooting those pre-64's, most rifles would seem accurate...................
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 28,288 Likes: 15
Campfire Ranger
|
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 28,288 Likes: 15 |
Am I the only one that is thinking that the best way to resolve a lot of this would be to get John, Matt, and Larry in one place and have them bring their rifles, put them to the test, and video (and post) the results? And after they shoot their known rifle, supply a (one) rifle unknown with a day to familiarize themselves with it and see who is really the best shot. I'm bettin' on the Huskemaw boys.......... 
It is irrelevant what you think. What matters is the TRUTH.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 12,168 Likes: 16
Campfire Outfitter
|
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 12,168 Likes: 16 |
Ouch'
I would give you a hundered bucks if you could make them show.
John Burns
I have all the sources.
They can't stop the signal.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 61,130
Campfire Kahuna
|
|
Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 61,130 |
If this gets pulled off, I like RDFinn's idea, and I'd send one of my rifles, with my handloads for it ("turn key, if you will... to "borrow" a phrase) for the unfamiliar rifle.
I doubt there'd be less than a few who'd also offer likewise.
And, that John says he'd sandbag, so as to try to make his rifle look better, says something, doesn't it?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 12,168 Likes: 16
Campfire Outfitter
|
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 12,168 Likes: 16 |
Yea it says I am already making excuses for when my alligator mouth gets my canary butt in a sling.
What are you planning on sending keeping in mind I am recoil sensitive??
John Burns
I have all the sources.
They can't stop the signal.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 61,130
Campfire Kahuna
|
|
Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 61,130 |
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 293
Campfire Member
|
|
Campfire Member
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 293 |
Im still lost on Matt comming in on a decent thread and going off topic just to call John out. Then spending the next few posts whining like a school girl that Johns response was rude. Realy, whats with that?
I can say one thing. If you took a run of the mill shooter like myself and had 2 guys with rifles, John with his setup, and who ever else with a Mill this/meter that rig. Gave them each 10 minutes to explain thier rigs to me, and then sent me out to engage multiple targets at varying distances. I can pretty well bet I'd do better with Johns rig.
Now thats not to say Johns rig is better, or even worth the money. Its just to say that I think its more intuitive for the average joe that doesnt care to become a millitant sniper type.
Given that thats Johns target audience, as well as Leupolds with thier CDS, ect.........it would be expected.
What realy seems funny to me is the sniper folks telling John he sells crap. And telling Leupold they sell crap. Thats about like telling Walmart they sell junk. They dont care, they sell what thier customers want at the prices they want to pay. Nobodies going to say Walmart and Leupold arent successfull. Even with his so called junk John is doing good enough to be a paid advertiser here.
To all the naysayers acting like they could field a better product at a better or equal price and be successfull. Where's your banners? I dont see your names listed as "Sponsor" of anything. Is it me or are none of the others that field a finished hunting rifle as a buisness model knocking Johns buisness aproach? Why does it seem like John and Huskemaw are in a market segment all thier own, and seemingly successfull at it? Why are so many folks in such a hurry to knock a guy for identifying and filling market niche?
Yeah I can see pounding him for the "aluminum block offsets the scope" comedy, but to attack his entire rig, and person?
Seems rather childish to me on several levels.
Rick
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121 Likes: 1
Campfire Oracle
|
|
Campfire Oracle
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121 Likes: 1 |
I'm so going to shoot a deer right in the face this fall.
"Dear Lord, save me from Your followers"
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 24,665 Likes: 6
Campfire Ranger
|
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 24,665 Likes: 6 |
Based on what BobinNH stated I would have to agree that your rifles make long range shootin easy. But, heck, after shooting those pre-64's, most rifles would seem accurate................... Uhhh, ohhh. I would have gone after Bob's family before going there.
![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/X0n16mr.png) WWP53D
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 18,453
Campfire Ranger
|
|
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 18,453 |
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 35,900
Campfire 'Bwana
|
|
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 35,900 |
Based on what BobinNH stated I would have to agree that your rifles make long range shootin easy. But, heck, after shooting those pre-64's, most rifles would seem accurate................... Uhhh, ohhh. I would have gone after Bob's family before going there. You guys are ssoooo bad! Yeah washtub accuracy is all I ever got from those old relics.....at that I had to hold my mouth part open and let the tongue hang out a certain way to hit anything.....and those 270's just sorta fall apart accuracy-wise after 100 yards (bullets got the BC of asprin tablets).  I dunno how I have managed to kill a damn thing with them.....been a real crap shoot all these years.....  After messing with John's 264, I felt like I was hunting with a muzzleloader..... 
Last edited by BobinNH; 11/04/10.
The 280 Remington is overbore.
The 7 Rem Mag is over bore.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 8,785
Campfire Outfitter
|
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 8,785 |
Am I the only one that is thinking that the best way to resolve a lot of this would be to get John, Matt, and Larry in one place and have them bring their rifles, put them to the test, and video (and post) the results? I think that would make for some great entertainment viewing. Pay Per View and proceeds going to charity?!?!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 58,669 Likes: 42
Campfire Kahuna
|
|
Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 58,669 Likes: 42 |
Im still lost on Matt comming in on a decent thread and going off topic just to call John out. Then spending the next few posts whining like a school girl that Johns response was rude. Realy, whats with that?
I can say one thing. If you took a run of the mill shooter like myself and had 2 guys with rifles, John with his setup, and who ever else with a Mill this/meter that rig. Gave them each 10 minutes to explain thier rigs to me, and then sent me out to engage multiple targets at varying distances. I can pretty well bet I'd do better with Johns rig.
Now thats not to say Johns rig is better, or even worth the money. Its just to say that I think its more intuitive for the average joe that doesnt care to become a millitant sniper type.
Given that thats Johns target audience, as well as Leupolds with thier CDS, ect.........it would be expected.
What realy seems funny to me is the sniper folks telling John he sells crap. And telling Leupold they sell crap. Thats about like telling Walmart they sell junk. They dont care, they sell what thier customers want at the prices they want to pay. Nobodies going to say Walmart and Leupold arent successfull. Even with his so called junk John is doing good enough to be a paid advertiser here.
To all the naysayers acting like they could field a better product at a better or equal price and be successfull. Where's your banners? I dont see your names listed as "Sponsor" of anything. Is it me or are none of the others that field a finished hunting rifle as a buisness model knocking Johns buisness aproach? Why does it seem like John and Huskemaw are in a market segment all thier own, and seemingly successfull at it? Why are so many folks in such a hurry to knock a guy for identifying and filling market niche?
Yeah I can see pounding him for the "aluminum block offsets the scope" comedy, but to attack his entire rig, and person?
Seems rather childish to me on several levels.
John is clueless and you'd do well to lend Matt your ear. Just sayin'...especially given your knowledge base and "experience". Thank me later.............
Brad says: "Can't fault Rick for his pity letting you back on the fire... but pity it was and remains. Nothing more, nothing less. A sad little man in a sad little dream."
|
|
|
|
|
567 members (17CalFan, 12344mag, 10gaugemag, 10gaugeman, 19rabbit52, 10ring1, 59 invisible),
2,115
guests, and
1,261
robots. |
|
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
|
Forums81
Topics1,194,086
Posts18,521,930
Members74,024
| |
Most Online11,491
Jul 7th, 2023
|
|
|
|
![[Linked Image]](http://i492.photobucket.com/albums/rr288/Bwnci/welsh-flag-large-anim.gif)
