Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunting Rifles .223 options?

Wow. For the record, I never tried to "know you up" on anything. I asked for the information you so obviously thought I needed, since I am always interested in learning something new. That is a trait common to folks who don't figure they have learned it all already. A side benefit of that trait is that we can usually answer a question without being an ass about it.

I am still waiting to hear how "simply crushing schitt" puts any more meat on the table than just killing it. And as far as the humor factor, killing an animal doesn't really have a laugh factor here(although there are some folks whose demise has been known to make me chuckle). As long as the animal dies(and the more humanely the better), I figure the bullet did its job. Humor doesn't enter the equation. Generally speaking, I have found that only juveniles and those trying to compensate for other deficiencies find humor in doing more damage than necessary to pot an animal.

As for the information given, the pictorial was nice, but the text left a bit to be desired. BC does not simply equal speed. It does usually equal higher weight, and requires a faster twist to stabilize it. Although the higher weight does maintain more velocity at long range, faster twist barrels are often slower, and higher bullet weight equals less initial velocity if you give a tinker's damn about pressures. So simply saying that "BC equals speed" would be less than the full truth, especially if I were a noob "Window Licker", as you so eloquently put it. Might want to ease up on the smartass a bit, we aren't all in your fan club, and that sure ain't no way to grow it...

Thank you! You have to understand Slick and his followers logic which is, shoot the heaviest/highest bc bullet for the caliber you can. It's almost always the 75 gr Amax.

What they can't get through their minds is "There is no free lunch". Shooting heavier bullets means less velocity. Faster twist = less velocity. In the end I find it highly doubtful the 75 gr out performs the 55 gr bullet at all in practical use. It's not moving as fast but has the ability to stay in motion longer, it's heavy and has a trajectory of a rainbow.

Now someone will cite how great the .223 is shooting long distance matches with heavy bullets. Sure it goes far, but it's killing paper with unspectacular velocity and energy.

They can crunch numbers on software all day but it's on paper.

What next, a .223 shooting a 200 gr bullet with a bc of 590 at 900 fps in a rifle with a 1-4" twist? That gets my interest. NOT!

Wow, you are a dumb [bleep]. Please tell me more about what you haven't a clue.

I was told the Swift isn't going to like the short action Savage, any truth there?

Can't believe someone can get the .223 to shot decent Bullets maybe? Haven't reloaded for it yet and I'm using Federal bulk ammo. I can tell you it don't like a windy day.

I bought the Savage in .223 to use in more densely populated areas, it has been a disappointment. I think the only draw this cartridge has is it is used by the military. I'd love nothing better to convert it to .220.

Easy choice for me, I'd never take a .17. The smallest caliber I own is the .223 and I like it. I wouldn't call it boring either, not with the accuracy that it delivers.

The .17 is not new, it's floundered for many years in the .17 Remington. And years from now I imagine the newer versions will be gone too. If you live anywhere with wind you'd be nuts to choose the .17.

If you have 600 rounds through those barrels shooting heavy slugs I can take a good guess what the throats and barrel above look like. Keep shooting.

Recently I started thinking about picking up a model 70 Stealth in .22-250. Can't find them. Plenty of .223 WSSM chamberings but I don't trust it.

This got me thinking. Winchester has a lot of failed rounds like the .225 and 6.5mm Mag. But would did they come out with that wasn't a failure?

Sure will Big Stick. I work in a gun shop, have for years, and get to see what comes in the door to be sold on consignment or traded in. The shop also has a gunsmith. Many talks with the gunsmith about the guns traded in or to be sold on consignment has touched on the subject many times. Most of these show higher then normal barrel wear or throat erosion and in most cases they are fast twist such as 1:7.

Now, lets here your experience to the contrary. You probably work closely with firearms I'm sure. Or did I just hear a "Duh!" out of you.

I'M WAITING NOW!

Didn't care much for your sarcasm or your buddy Steelhead's. Oracles? Of what, stupidity?

In fact there was a nice article in Field & Stream explaining barrel twist. You should read it several times, it may sink in.

Stick,

Great pictures, and interesting surgery done on the little Kimber. I built my 223 AI on SA Rem 700 with Seekins DBM that rates a bullet up to 2.6" COAL, Brux 1-8" barrel, and 75 gr Amax.

But little Kimber does have me thinking performance in a lighter, smaller package. Rates more than a think......

Also liked your comments on high BC bullets....

Put another way: Velocity is a wasting asset, but BC is forever...

Tanks for the slide show...

Bob

Wow. For the record, I never tried to "know you up" on anything. I asked for the information you so obviously thought I needed, since I am always interested in learning something new. That is a trait common to folks who don't figure they have learned it all already. A side benefit of that trait is that we can usually answer a question without being an ass about it.

I am still waiting to hear how "simply crushing schitt" puts any more meat on the table than just killing it. And as far as the humor factor, killing an animal doesn't really have a laugh factor here(although there are some folks whose demise has been known to make me chuckle). As long as the animal dies(and the more humanely the better), I figure the bullet did its job. Humor doesn't enter the equation. Generally speaking, I have found that only juveniles and those trying to compensate for other deficiencies find humor in doing more damage than necessary to pot an animal.

As for the information given, the pictorial was nice, but the text left a bit to be desired. BC does not simply equal speed. It does usually equal higher weight, and requires a faster twist to stabilize it. Although the higher weight does maintain more velocity at long range, faster twist barrels are often slower, and higher bullet weight equals less initial velocity if you give a tinker's damn about pressures. So simply saying that "BC equals speed" would be less than the full truth, especially if I were a noob "Window Licker", as you so eloquently put it. Might want to ease up on the smartass a bit, we aren't all in your fan club, and that sure ain't no way to grow it...

It's sad that someone that has a little knowledge on something can't share it without being such an ass. He's a hard one to figure out? If you watch him on his little videos you can see his insecurities.

Great varmit round. Works just fine as a battle rifle, been there done that got the retirement. For me not a deer round. Will it work yes, will it wound, yes. A good shot will easily kill a deer, so will a 22LR. For myself I prefer something a bit larger. Seen way too many wounded deer, small caliber no penitration huge shoulder wound, gut shot etc. If you can handle it hit correctley, then fine. Not legal in a states as a deer rifle.

i have nothing against the 60 gr NPT, 'cept i have never got it to shoot very well in any of my rifles. i gave up on it.

Whenever Tikka is mentioned by naysayers - the "plastic" clip is mentioned.

It seems to me that the next question should logically be - "Have you ever heard of a Tikka clip not working properly?

My first choice would be a Sako.

My second choice would be a Tikka.

Thank you! You have to understand Slick and his followers logic which is, shoot the heaviest/highest bc bullet for the caliber you can. It's almost always the 75 gr Amax.

What they can't get through their minds is "There is no free lunch". Shooting heavier bullets means less velocity. Faster twist = less velocity. In the end I find it highly doubtful the 75 gr out performs the 55 gr bullet at all in practical use. It's not moving as fast but has the ability to stay in motion longer, it's heavy and has a trajectory of a rainbow.

Now someone will cite how great the .223 is shooting long distance matches with heavy bullets. Sure it goes far, but it's killing paper with unspectacular velocity and energy.

They can crunch numbers on software all day but it's on paper.

What next, a .223 shooting a 200 gr bullet with a bc of 590 at 900 fps in a rifle with a 1-4" twist? That gets my interest. NOT!

Ok, had decided to pick up a 223 after the new year, was just gonna handle some, see what I like to handle, leaning towards a Ruger since that's what I mostly shoot, now starting to read all this and all the decisions on what to get, CRAP!!! I just need to step away from the fire... (like that will happen!)