Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Backpack Hunting Bear protection- Pepper Spray or pistol

I was recently on another forum where this question was brought up. I thought it was a good question, but mostly jokes were made. Just looking for some opinions.

For me, none of the above, short handy rifle, either my .45/70 or my son's .44 mag trapper. YMMV

You talkin Okie bears or Ak bears???

Seriously, I don't think a handgun will be much good at stopping a charge unless it's a real big one (AND) you are really good with it (AND) really lucky to boot. I s'pose if a bear was trying to drag you out of your tent then a HG might be helpful. Sleep with your feet near the door so he grabs your feet first, then don't shoot your foot.

Actually, I like the 45-70 suggestion because a bazooka is too big to backpack.

JimF

My thought is, if a bear is close enough for pepper spray to be effective, then I want to be launching lead not hot sauce.

I pack a .480, with a handload that pushes a 460 gr hard cast to 1050 fps. I'm fully aware of the limitations of a handgun, but I also realize it is better than being unarmed, and there are lots of places I won't be carrying a rifle.

Good recipie......that just leaves the lucky part to worry about then..... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

JimF

Jim
I've seen the man shoot that handgun... Wouldn't want to be a thang... I've seen people that could not do what he does... with a rifle...
art

Art,

You happened to be at the range on a day I was shooing pretty well <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Remove the scope, have me fire it offhand, and at a moving target, and the equation suddenly changes. Worse yet is lack of practice, and a handgun requires frequent practice to be mastered. That is the longer version of understanding the limitations of a handgun. I have no doubt that big heavy slug will kill a bear every time if properly placed, I just don't know for sure on the accurate placement thing.

I think one things folks who recomend pepper spray is, it also requires accurate placement, and wind conditions can also make it less effective, or worse yet incapacitate the user. I also wonder how many folks that carry pepper spray ever buy an extra can to practice using it?

I always tell them to carry a bag of pixie dust to sprinkle for varifying wind direction before spraying. Heel tapping might help more than the spray, too.

Been said before but it bears repeating (pun intended)

Having a rifle makes you no more a rifleman than having a piano in the house makes you a pianist!

Reckon that would go least 'bout double on the handgun scenario. Just cause I don't feel adequately armed with a handgun doesn't make 458 Lott or others who are very proficient with said tool inadequately armed. But part of my mispent youth I dabbled in competitive handgun shooting and while maybe not a slouch I just like "my" odds better with a rifle.

Having enjoyed the excitement of having a bear in camp (when I was in camp trying to sleep) 4 different times at 4 different locations (twice when backpack hunting by myself), I recommend:

1) keep your food/meat pole separate from where you sleep. surround it with empty cans or other noisey objects, have a clear line-of-fire to where your food is and keep a bright light and loaded rifle handy.

2) keep a loaded pistol with you at night (.40, .45, or .44 mag)

3) keep a air horn (like they use in sailboat races), and bear spray handy.

4) if weight permits surround your camp with at least one strand of aluminum wire, an electric fence charger, and a battery.

or

5) take the attitude that if the bear kills me, he/she wins. if I kill the bear I win. If we both die, then at least I broke even!

1 and 5 are basically what I use nowadays.

One more thought, in Colorado, you are only allowed to kill a predator (if not licensed for it), if you or another human are in danger of your life or serious injury, or if it is attacking livestock. So if a bear is stealing your elk, killing your dog, or destroying your ATV, you are not legally allowed to kill it.

Weird world, huh?

Wait a minute buff, I've had my share of problem bears too and while it depends on where in AK I am about rule 1, I get, rule 5.

But if anyone or anything is stealing my elk (called moose here), killing my dog or destroying my property they are going to get chased off and or an azz whupping, if they decide to escalate that to lethal force, rather than running, I too must resort to lethal force. That seems to be to the letter of the law to me. Am I missing something? Certainly it can escalate quickly and I'm prepared for that. But the same would hold true for a human trying to do me wrong, wouldn't it?

My older brother was charged by a crazed griz. during the Valdez oil spill clean up . He pulled out an issued can of pepper spray and gave it a blast but, the wind blew it right back in his own face . Stumbleing backwards blinded he yelled to the guy that was with him ( who was armed with a 12 gauge ) to shoot . The man , named Roger , had never fired a gun before . He fires one shot , then yells " The gun is jambed , RUN " , They both stumble down the mountain ( They had been sent up the hill to see if they could find a bold eagle that was spotted covered in oil ) The bear is haveing a huge s&%@ fit behind them , but not comeing . They return with fish and game , to find the griz dead , in a big circle of torn up alders . That one shot , had split the bears lower lip, and into it's guts . the bear had been eating oil covered birds and seals . One shot Roger , saved my brothers life , where pepper spray failed . Might just as well as peed in the wind !!

I have NOT killed a bear or been charged by one. Have had two come near camp at night. (bright moon lots of snow around, easy to see the little black balls romping around.) Even the little guys get your attention. Have had cats harassing horses. Too dark to get a shot off.
One trip into Denali will get your attention regarding bears. No trees for miles and lots of bears. I would not want to be close enough to a bear to use pepper spray. Some of those campgrounds on the road that runs through the park look like invitations for bears to come and check out the scraps. Firearms are not allowed. I thought the 3500lb rental car was about the safest place in the park. People were actually sneaking up on the bears to photograph them. A ranger finally showed up and chewed them out. The goofballs had no clue how close to dying they were. Airhorn would be a better bet if you had no other choice. Bears can cover a lot of ground quickly if they are annoyed enough with you.
My friends in Fairbanks carry rifles when they are fishing or birdhunting.
Been paralleling Lewis and Clark (two hundred year anniversary) and the animal that had their greatest respect was the grizzly bear. They are portaging 20miles around the Great Falls right now and Lewis has forbidden anyone to leave camp alone because of the number of grizzlies in the area. When they first ran into the big brownies they quickly "satisfied their curiosity" after realizing just how tough these bears were. The men eventually realized that the bears would charge in a straight line and if they set themselves up in a line they could each shoot and fall back to the side as the bear charged.
Long winded way to say, "no thanks" to the pepper spray crowd. Half a mile is close enough for me even with binoculars and a telephoto lens on my camera. Only reason I want to be closer is if I have a bear tag and 250gr or bigger bullet in the rifle.
Oh yeah, got an opinion on a pistol, too. Better than nothing, but the best pistol would not be as good as a 30-30. I certainly wouldn't trust myself to put a bear down at pistol range while under a charge.
Some of you Alaska guys might remember a couple that owned a photography shop in Anchorage. Great people. The wife was a salty old gal when I met her twenty years ago. In addition to owning the shop they had jade mines above the Arctic Circle and they made movies about Alaska for schools. Lots of time in the bush. She had many stories about bears. They carried .44 magnum six shooters or .45 Long Colts and felt they were adequate for black bears. She said the black bears would run up to you like a dog and try to bite. The pistols would put them down. Brown bears were a different story. Their advice was don't make the brown bear ackknowledge your presence. For the most part wouldn't bother you if it didn't feel territorially threatened. If it did, you better watch out. She unloaded all six of her .44mag rounds into a brownie in camp once and didn't phase it. Someone else shot the same bear later and it had six holes in it. Rifle please! was their opinion for brownies.

link to an old thread on another forum...a 1st hand bear spray experience.
http://forums.kifaru.net/cgi-local/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=3;t=000552

I just make sure my hunting partner is a little slower than I am.

homerdave knows that's not an option for me (slower partner) grinning here. My pard is one of the fastest critters on two legs I've ever seen. When we were all guiding together it was fairly common if we had someone antsy that didn't want to sit and glass, we'd send em on a "hike with Mike" they became a big fan of sitting and glassing after one of those adventures. The dude can travel, specially uphill, to give you some perspective, I took a 24 year old kid on a sheep hunt last year that had just got out of the service here. He couldn't keep up at all, and told plenty of people about how that old man could just walk off and leave him. It's just as bad when I hunt with my ole companero Oz, flat ground maybe if he's not excited, uphill fuggedaboutit.

When my son was 6, my mother decided that he needed to see Glacier National Park. After supper (we were staying at a hotel) she just had to go for a walk around the lake. My wife has foot problems and was excused from the expedition. I jokingly told Mom that if a bear showed up, I was going to knock her to the ground, grab Larry, and run. She, in all seriousness, thought that it sounded like a good plan.

I bet she did! But grannies can be cagey, she prolly had her eye on a stick to whop you with the whole time, whereupon she'd snatch up her grandbaby and do the shuffle! (grin)

My 2 cents I would think marlin in 450 would do ok also
or a short barreled lever in a 500 S&W would do a number
also Cheers northcountry