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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 19,237
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 19,237 |
Sounds good to me. I'll definitely look for them and pick up a couple boxes to try. I really like the performance of the old 170 Win. Silvertips but they've gotten a little too pricey lately to make it worth the extra cost.
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Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 61,130
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 61,130 |
The Winchester 150 grain PowerPoint HPs are likewise impressive but scarce as hen's teeth.
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Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 5,735
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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If you haven't see a bullet deflect off bone in a deer you haven't looked at many wound channels in very many deer.
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 19,237
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 19,237 |
I've seen a few incidences of bullet deflection but never happened to me personally with a .30-30. I read alot about surface "blow ups" on here but have always suspected that most of those were more likely incidences of deflection {ricochet} than actual blow ups.
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Joined: Feb 2008
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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The purest form of a surface blow up I have ever seen was early in the life of the .243 my uncle let my dad shoot a deer with some fast hand loads. It was a nice buck and it was hit square on in the neck and should have passed through the neck bone. The deer dropped like a stone. When it got up and ran off after the neck cutting by another uncle it caused quite a commotion. My cousin and I had to go chase it down and when we got it it was of course quite dead. It had a fist size chunk of meat missing, and the bullet never made it to the spine. Never found any fragments or other path out of the deer, just that big divot of missing meat.
Probably the jacket and core just disintegrated right there. I shoot chipmunks with 35 grain VMaxs at about 3200 and they will only just barely scuff up a board under or behind the "volunteer", and usually the chipmunk is just about vaporized. I have shot quite a few out of the scrap lumber pile with a board underneath them and one within a foot or so behind. If you get the chipmunk, the boards will have minor scuffs at most. I have seen the same results with .243s and 55 grain VMaxs. I have only done a few direct comparisons with the .243 compared to dozens with the .223 though.
My conclusion has been that those bullets just come completely undone. The Nosler BT lead free usually leaves some tiny little sparkles of jacket and you might find a few tiny like #12 shot size copper BBs.
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Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 19,075
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 19,075 |
If you want to say deflect then yea, but don't blow smoke up someone's butt that bullets bounce off. A 1/4" tree limb will deflect a bullet's flight
Last edited by saddlesore; 08/20/11.
If God wanted you to walk and carry things on your back, He would not have invented stirrups and pack saddles
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Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 5,735
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Feb 2008
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If you want to say deflect then yea, but don't blow smoke up someone's butt that bullets bounce off. A 1/4" tree limb will deflect a bullet's flight Grow up you F-ing moron. Go shoot a tracer round through a willow swamp at night and tell me they don't bounce just like a ball. I have seen enough bullets hit rib and not break the rib, and leave at something approaching the angle of incidence that I have no question they can perform a very close approximation of a golf ball bouncing off concrete.
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 19,237
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 19,237 |
I'd have to agree that small caliber V-max's are very fragile and if any bullet was going to completely blow up and cause a surface wound I'd be bettin' on those. I've shot them from my 17 HMR into 2 liter soda bottles filled with water and had them completely disintegtate inside with absolutely nothing penetrating the back side of the bottle. What gets me is when I hear this or that 100 gr .243, 130 gr .270 or 150 gr .308 bullet "blew up completely" on a rib and never entered the pleural cavity. I simply don't buy that and think it has to be deflection.
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Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 11,361
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 11,361 |
I'd avoid the FTX in any caliber. They suck!
1st Special Operations Wing 1975-1983 919th Special Operations Wing 1983-1985 1993-1994
"Manus haec inimica tyrannis / Ense petit placidam sub libertate quietem" ~Algernon Sidney~
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 7,437
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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The Nosler 170 grain Partition is a fine 30-30 bullet. The plain vanilla cup&core bullets usually work just fine though.
μολὼν λαβέ
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Joined: Aug 2011
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Campfire Regular
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OP
Campfire Regular
Joined: Aug 2011
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I'd avoid the FTX in any caliber. They suck! Would you care to elaborate? I'd like to hear about your experiences with them and which calibers.
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Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 11,361
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 11,361 |
They are a hollow points with a plastic nose. The just blow up on deer size game.
1st Special Operations Wing 1975-1983 919th Special Operations Wing 1983-1985 1993-1994
"Manus haec inimica tyrannis / Ense petit placidam sub libertate quietem" ~Algernon Sidney~
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Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 5,735
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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I'd have to agree that small caliber V-max's are very fragile and if any bullet was going to completely blow up and cause a surface wound I'd be bettin' on those. I've shot them from my 17 HMR into 2 liter soda bottles filled with water and had them completely disintegtate inside with absolutely nothing penetrating the back side of the bottle. What gets me is when I hear this or that 100 gr .243, 130 gr .270 or 150 gr .308 bullet "blew up completely" on a rib and never entered the pleural cavity. I simply don't buy that and think it has to be deflection. Yeah, I think so too. There seems to be a bounce window. Maybe a better way to put it is that for a given bullet there seems to be a range of velocity and impact angle that will produce bounce. .22 LR olid nose seems to have a wide window. 30 caliber FMJ is extremely prone to bouncing and little VMaxs are so fragile they don't seem to bounce ever.
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Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121
Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121 |
I have a couple hundred of these coming my way to give a whirl. Can't imagine they won't work. http://www.hornady.com/store/MonoFlex-Bullets-New
"Dear Lord, save me from Your followers"
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Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 11,361
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 11,361 |
They are fragile and expensive. The Core-Lokts work better.
1st Special Operations Wing 1975-1983 919th Special Operations Wing 1983-1985 1993-1994
"Manus haec inimica tyrannis / Ense petit placidam sub libertate quietem" ~Algernon Sidney~
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Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121
Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121 |
Tell me how an all copper bullet is fragile?
They ain't that expensive either
"Dear Lord, save me from Your followers"
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Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 11,361
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 11,361 |
That plastic nose makes them open to fast.
1st Special Operations Wing 1975-1983 919th Special Operations Wing 1983-1985 1993-1994
"Manus haec inimica tyrannis / Ense petit placidam sub libertate quietem" ~Algernon Sidney~
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Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121
Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121 |
The bullet, not you dipshitt
"Dear Lord, save me from Your followers"
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Joined: Dec 2007
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Dec 2007
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Have you actually shot something with them?
He who joyfully marches in rank and file has already earned my contempt. He has been given a large brain by mistake, since for him the spinal cord would suffice.
- Albert Einstein
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 6,293
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Feb 2005
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Crickey, those things ain't cheap, are they? I'm interested to see how those work for you, Scott. I'd think they would penetrate like no tomorrow.
This is a shooting forum, there is no place here for logic.
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