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Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121 Likes: 1
Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121 Likes: 1 |
If there is anyplace wetter than SE Alaska, I don't know of it. Last several fell to 25 calibers. Bear die easy.
"Dear Lord, save me from Your followers"
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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If there is anyplace wetter than SE Alaska, I don't know of it. Last several fell to 25 calibers. Bear die easy. Agreed...
Luck....is the residue of design... ![[Linked Image]](http://i423.photobucket.com/albums/pp311/patrickgsinclair/96zvyt.gif)
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Joined: Jun 2012
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Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 483 |
If there is anyplace wetter than SE Alaska, I don't know of it. Last several fell to 25 calibers. Bear die easy. I've heard that before. In fact I felt the same way until one didn't die easily then I changed my whole outlook. Ten drt animals doesnt mean number 11 wont take flight to parts unknown in my experiance.
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Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121 Likes: 1
Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121 Likes: 1 |
Agreed, regardless of the whole through the critter. They do seem to get more [bleep] over little fast slugs though, and I stick with them.
"Dear Lord, save me from Your followers"
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Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 483
Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 483 |
One of my favorite rifles is nice little Sako in 25-06. Shoots fantastic is light and doesnt kick me in the shoulder, just a joy to shoot and in many cases does an unbelievable job of hammering game. But I rarely use it and choose my relatively heavy hard kicking 444 for only one reason, it hits harder, at woods hunting distances, than any other rifle I have and does the best job of putting them down quickly and puts the biggest entrance holes in them. Certainly my 25-06 kills and in many cases vary quickly, but not as quickly as does the 444 and based on that I choose the 444 over all of my other hunting rifles.
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Joined: Jan 2013
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Campfire Greenhorn
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Campfire Greenhorn
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 53 |
(This topic reminds me of sheep hunting in grizzly country: a sheep is easy to kill and doesn't require a .338, but that is what most sheep hunters in Northern BC were carrying. The purpose for the .338 wasn't to kill sheep but for a secondary reason. Ditto for larger calibers on black bear in thick brushy country with no dirt to leave tracks: the purpose is not killing power but the secondary reason of tracking/finding power.)
This is why I hunt elk and moose with my 338wm. And I carried a .338 Win hunting deer solo and packing meat on Admiralty Island. Arguably the densest population brown population in the world, one per square mile (once you subtract out the uninhabitable portion (the bare rock in the mountains) the number exceeds far one brown bear per square mile). But some of our friends in Montana (that don�t even live in grizzly country) are bullies and pretend to know it all. That island is one quarter the size of a county in Montana, but has more brown/grizzly bears than the entire lower 48.
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Joined: Jul 2007
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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BTW - whatever rifle you use, a bear rug makes a real nice addition to the house decor: ![[Linked Image]](http://i87.photobucket.com/albums/k129/GuyMiner/hunting%20photos/IMG_3946.jpg) Regards, Guy
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Joined: Oct 2002
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Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121 Likes: 1 |
The critters would agree ![[Linked Image]](http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b297/Shoalcove/House/DSCN1959.jpg)
"Dear Lord, save me from Your followers"
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Campfire Tracker
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New Member
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OP
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Very nice, I am looking forward to this!
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 13,108
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 13,108 |
Dennis-I find it curious that you've had runners on black bruins via the 270 WSM. Which slug is your friend using and how far have they been running (normally)?
Thx
Dober I think the last three he shot were with 150 Bergers. One of the bears was 600 lbs and the bullet just didn't get in deep enough. Finally killed it at 30 feet. Squared just over 7'. I didn't see the shots on the other ones so can't comment on his shooting. He did take his 7RUM out this past August and shot one at 600 and he dropped at the shot- right through the heart. That was a 180 Berger. I think he is becoming a better long range shooter and more patient with his shots. Not saying anything necessarily wrong with the 270- just a combination of factors which makes us treat it as a jinx. I don't know why, but of all the animals I have guided and hunted, the bears have always been the slowest to die! I have seen some quick kills too- my son's bear two years ago was dead at the shot- 150 yards, 180 Norma Oryx from his 308.
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Those who live by the sword get shot by those who don't.
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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BTW - whatever rifle you use, a bear rug makes a real nice addition to the house decor: Regards, Guy open or closed mouth ?
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Joined: Jun 2010
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jun 2010
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We drive the mountains of northern PA for bear. We usually get 20 guys together and start pushing the laurel and the sidehills. Lots of times the bear are seen by the drivers first and are running. Even when they come past the standers they are running and full of adrenaline. Shooting a placid bear who is peacefully feeding is a lot different than shooting one fueled up on adrenaline. We've killed plenty but lost plenty as well. 30-30's, .35 Rems, .308's, and .270's have been responsible for most of the long blood trails (and I do mean long)that fizzle out with no bear at the other end. The .30-06's,7mm and .300 mags have been more reliable killers. Now these bears have ranged in size from under 100 pounds to nearly 700 pounds. And this is a sampling of at least twenty bear I've been there for the shooting of and one of my own.
Now I remember one instance with a .30-06 that the bear got away. The hunter was using 150 grain bullets (wouldn't of been my choice) in his pump 760 and he emptied his gun at close to a 400 pounder. We couldn't find the bear and the next day another party killed the bear. Apparently the original shooter hit it twice in the shoulder and twice in the guts and the next day it was still on it's feet. Another time that jumps out at me a sow and two cubs came past one of the guys and the sow stepped ove rthe log the guy was sitting on and stopped. He shot her in the shoulder at a distance of 20 yards and she took off. We all felt pretty good about the situation but we bloodtrailed that bear for close to a mile and lost all blood.
Another time my BIL shot a really big boar in the shoulder with his 7mm mag at 50 yards and the bear made it a couple hundred yards and was finished off by another group.
So it all depends on where you are bear hunting, if the bear are peaceful and undisturbed they can be easy to kill but if hunting pressure has them on the run they can be a real bear (pardon the pun) to bring down. My own bear took five shots from my .32 Special at twenty yards before he succumbed.
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Joined: Jan 2013
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Campfire Greenhorn
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Campfire Greenhorn
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 53 |
I mentioned shooting black bear with a .30-30, but I�m used to being the only hunter for miles around and being able to pick my shots.
I�ve never envisioned hunting as you described, but given the a catch-as-catch-can element with snap shots at less than desirable angles a .30-06 (as you suggested) with good 180 grainers sounds like a sensible minimum. As well as the cartridges you mentioned I would think the .358 Win, .35 Whelen and .45-70 (if range is not a problem) might be good candidates.
North America is a big chunk of real estate and I think posters on this forum sometimes forget that fellow posters may have a very different reality.
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Joined: Jan 2001
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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Interesting, and surprising way to hunt black bears. FWIW, I'd take the .270 of the original poster if that's all I had for hunting black bear, and not feel handicapped. I have bigger and take it however, when hunting bear on purpose. I've never had any trouble killing nor finding a bear that I've shot, though was glad for a good blood trail on an archery bear of mine that went 75 yards in brushy timber. OTOH I have trailed 8 wounded bears for other people that were difficult to track. We lost three of those due to nothing to follow on moss, duff, etc. Two of those I am sure died, the other I am pretty sure survived. I'm confident that I can kill a black bear with a .22 rimfire-- but I'd rather you take a larger bore If I'm going to help you track it! 
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Joined: Jan 2013
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Campfire Greenhorn
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Campfire Greenhorn
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 53 |
Interesting, and surprising way to hunt black bears. FWIW, I'd take the .270 of the original poster if that's all I had for hunting black bear, and not feel handicapped. I have bigger and take it however, when hunting bear on purpose. I've never had any trouble killing nor finding a bear that I've shot, though was glad for a good blood trail on an archery bear of mine that went 75 yards in brushy timber. OTOH I have trailed 8 wounded bears for other people that were difficult to track. We lost three of those due to nothing to follow on moss, duff, etc. Two of those I am sure died, the other I am pretty sure survived. I'm confident that I can kill a black bear with a .22 rimfire-- but I'd rather you take a larger bore If I'm going to help you track it! The vast majority of my life (and hunting) was spent north and west of you and I have never imagined the scenario MooseMike described, but if that�s the way it�s done in Pennsylvania his caliber choices are appropriate. My original post was �I shot my first black bear with a .30-30 and 170 grain Remington core-lokts, so I�d think your .270 Win (with an appropriate bullet) is more than adequate�. I�m certain you could kill a bear with a .22 rimfire. A Cree Indian in Northern Ontario told me 45 years ago that the first moose he killed was with a .22, to quote �I figured 15 shots in the ribs would kill any thing�. I myself as a youth used to think if I ran into a black bear while grouse hunting (the seasons coincided) I would give it a load of birdshot in the face to blind it until I had a chance to dig the slugs out of my pockets. But for many decades now I�ve thought that the game we kill deserve the best (quickest) death we can give it. I hope I wasn�t too heavy handed when I called out some our Montanan friends on this thread earlier, but they are really big fish in a small pond by comparison and have no right to belittle other posters. I also know our Canadian friends are far too polite to be confrontational when in fact they are living the real deal. Dennis
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 5,611
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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Hunters are usually pretty unlaxed about such stuff and the experienced ones do what they want anyway, while swapping yarns and tucking away what we can learn from others.
A friend of mine in high school killed a pretty fair sized black bear with a .22 long rifle. He was grouse hunting with a .22 and came on a bear eating huckleberries in a clear cut. He rested on a stump for precsion and shot the bear at the base of his ear at 40 feet.
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Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 53
Campfire Greenhorn
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Campfire Greenhorn
Joined: Jan 2013
Posts: 53 |
I don�t doubt for a minute!
I�ve always had great affection for the Canadian people ever since the Vietnam era when I was sixteen and the law for alcohol in the states was 21 years old and the Canadians would take a poorly forged note from my your mother.
There were many times I�ve crisscrossed your country and wished I could put out roots somewhere between northern Ontario and Alaska. I�ve driven the Yellow Head and Highways 1, 37 & 97 among others in B.C.
Last edited by Sourdough54; 02/11/13.
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 13,108
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 13,108 |
We drive the mountains of northern PA for bear. We usually get 20 guys together and start pushing the laurel and the sidehills. Lots of times the bear are seen by the drivers first and are running. Even when they come past the standers they are running and full of adrenaline. Shooting a placid bear who is peacefully feeding is a lot different than shooting one fueled up on adrenaline. We've killed plenty but lost plenty as well. 30-30's, .35 Rems, .308's, and .270's have been responsible for most of the long blood trails (and I do mean long)that fizzle out with no bear at the other end. The .30-06's,7mm and .300 mags have been more reliable killers. Now these bears have ranged in size from under 100 pounds to nearly 700 pounds. And this is a sampling of at least twenty bear I've been there for the shooting of and one of my own.
Now I remember one instance with a .30-06 that the bear got away. The hunter was using 150 grain bullets (wouldn't of been my choice) in his pump 760 and he emptied his gun at close to a 400 pounder. We couldn't find the bear and the next day another party killed the bear. Apparently the original shooter hit it twice in the shoulder and twice in the guts and the next day it was still on it's feet. Another time that jumps out at me a sow and two cubs came past one of the guys and the sow stepped ove rthe log the guy was sitting on and stopped. He shot her in the shoulder at a distance of 20 yards and she took off. We all felt pretty good about the situation but we bloodtrailed that bear for close to a mile and lost all blood.
Another time my BIL shot a really big boar in the shoulder with his 7mm mag at 50 yards and the bear made it a couple hundred yards and was finished off by another group.
So it all depends on where you are bear hunting, if the bear are peaceful and undisturbed they can be easy to kill but if hunting pressure has them on the run they can be a real bear (pardon the pun) to bring down. My own bear took five shots from my .32 Special at twenty yards before he succumbed. The hunting you just described would really suck- so many people in the woods that they shoot each others animals- holy hell. When I bear hunt, I never see a sole unless it is someone I bring with me! Bears are unmolested unless the smell me!
NRA Benefactor Member
Those who live by the sword get shot by those who don't.
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Joined: Aug 2009
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Campfire Greenhorn
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Campfire Greenhorn
Joined: Aug 2009
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I've hunted black bear twice in British Columbia with John Sievers. http://www.bchuntingadventure.com/about-bchuntingadventure.htmlReasonable distance shots... 200 yards or less. I took my first with a .375 H&H and my second with a .458 Lott. I just hate being under-gunned. In truth, any good rifle shooting premium bullets (A-Frames, TBBC, TSX, etc.) will take down a black bear. My current love that I think is the perfect black bear rifle is the .338 Federal.
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