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Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
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Posts: 131,947 Likes: 54 |
That is not a command to us, he's speaking directly to the disciples. If I cherry pick the next words 'whoever does not believe will be condemned' then baptism isn't included in condemnation. Nor should it be, as he had just stated the indispensable conditions for salvation and, since baptism follows belief in order, it wasn't necessary to repeat it.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Leo of the Land of Dyr
NRA FOR LIFE
I MISS SARAH
“In Trump We Trust.” Right????
SOMEBODY please tell TRH that Netanyahu NEVER said "Once we squeeze all we can out of the United States, it can dry up and blow away."
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Bowsinger.......... the Pope, Billy Graham, and countless other men of the cloth have to be wrong for TRH to be right.
Consider this........... each night, this thread goes to sleep on one of the back pages.
Just look at post times and see which bunch revives it the next morning.
Can you spell "agenda"?
TRH is just a useful idiot for the Campbellites.
They are religious elitists and that appeals to TRH because he is SPECIAL.
Never holler whoa or look back in a tight place
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Which group disparages the other group with derogatory statements? Which group rejects Romans 10:10? Which group rejects James 2:17?
"Only Christ is the fullness of God's revelation."
Everyday Hunter
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Happy birthday, "Torque!"
"Good enough" isn't.
Always take your responsibilities seriously but never yourself.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Yes! He contradicts scripture..
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Which group disparages the other group with derogatory statements? You mean like you and TRH judging another person's salvation...? How flippin' disparaging and derogatory do you consider that to be...?
Every day on this side of the ground is a win.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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And the other two questions?
"Only Christ is the fullness of God's revelation."
Everyday Hunter
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2000
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1 Corinthians 13:12 "For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known."
I can't see any more clearly than that now. How wonderful it must be to see every little detail with perfect clarity! I envy those who already can.
"Good enough" isn't.
Always take your responsibilities seriously but never yourself.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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I'm having a hard time with the notion that the mere mention of this or that in the Bible indicates that it's some kind of standard or requirement for us today. Ken, do yo refer to the topic of baptism as "this or that?" Btw, who can say assuredly that the "thief on the cross" had not been baptized with the baptism of Jesus or John? Where is the proof?
"All that the South has ever desired was that the Union, as established by our forefathers, should be preserved, and that the government, as originally organized, should be administered in purity and truth." – Robert E. Lee
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Is there verse where Jesus actually commanded us to be baptized, using the word literally.
Not commanding the disciples to go out and baptize, which is specific to them.
Kent I believe Acts 10:48 is the only verse that could meet your requirement.
"All that the South has ever desired was that the Union, as established by our forefathers, should be preserved, and that the government, as originally organized, should be administered in purity and truth." – Robert E. Lee
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Since you hold baptism to be necessary for salvation, I'd like answers to the following questions, if you have time. ["I don't know" is a proper answer if it's truthful]
In this present time :
What person can perform an effective baptism?
What is the accepted method?
If a person publicly states his belief in Christ, expresses repentance, and is baptized in accordance with your answers to the first two questions, but publicly states that baptism is NOT a requirement for salvation, what is his standing with regard to salvation?
I'm not one to demand an opinion be backed up by bible verses, BTW, just asking your take on these questions.
Never holler whoa or look back in a tight place
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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The more I read these threads, the more I admire Jesus for avoiding the written word. One of his life lessons I can appreciate... he didn't teach from it, engage in it, command his disciples to write bibles... or go door to door ringing the bell with pamphlets.
Words can't define God, contain him or is there enough to explain him.
That's what the Holy Spirit does, not to tell us what written word means... but what Christ means.
Kent For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ for it is the power of god unto salvation to everyone who believeth. . . Romans 1:16
"All that the South has ever desired was that the Union, as established by our forefathers, should be preserved, and that the government, as originally organized, should be administered in purity and truth." – Robert E. Lee
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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"........... for it is the power of god unto salvation to everyone who believeth. . . Romans 1:16"
That was true before Paul thought the thought or wrote the words down.
I believe THAT is the point Kent is making.
It naturally follows that the Holy Spirit could put that same thought in Kent's mind even if he had never read the Bible.
Right?
Never holler whoa or look back in a tight place
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Feb 2002
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This thread calls to mind an episode of All in the Family shown many years past. In it, Archie had taken a small child into a church and baptised same in a fountain. He did this in a stealthy manner so no one would catch him. He was worried that the parents would not have the child baptised so took matters into his own hands. Not because he was christian, but he just new it should be done. As he was pouring water over the child's head, Archie exclaimed,"I baptise you in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit."
If that had happened today and had been reported in the news, would the baptism be valid regardless of the human element of the baptiser?
"You've been here longer than the State of Alaska is old!"
*** my Grandaughters
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Surely you aren't asking me. If you were, my answer would be;" I don't know...... ask God."
Never holler whoa or look back in a tight place
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2003
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Ken, 1 Corinthians 13:12 "For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known."
I can't see any more clearly than that now. How wonderful it must be to see every little detail with perfect clarity! I envy those who already can. Although we don't see every detail as clearly as we will someday, some of us see more clearly than others. God's Word tells us the Holy Spirit will guide us into all Truth. Jesus says God's Word is Truth. We unapologetically accept God's Word and back it with our lives. We do not rely on personal experiences because everyone's ways are right in their own eyes. We constantly bring ourselves into obedience like we read in, 2 Corinthians 10:5"We are destroying speculations and every lofty thing raised up against the knowledge of God, and we are taking every thought captive to the obedience of Christ,"
"Only Christ is the fullness of God's revelation."
Everyday Hunter
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2009
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"........... for it is the power of god unto salvation to everyone who believeth. . . Romans 1:16"
That was true before Paul thought the thought or wrote the words down.
I believe THAT is the point Kent is making.
It naturally follows that the Holy Spirit could put that same thought in Kent's mind even if he had never read the Bible.
Right?
How would Kent know that there was a Holy Spirit unless he read about it in the Bible? The Jews that Paul met in Ephesus (acts 19:2) had never heard of the Holy Spirit, and they lived at the time of miraculous gifts of the Holy Spirit, received only by the laying on of the apostle's hands (except for the household of Cornelius.)
"All that the South has ever desired was that the Union, as established by our forefathers, should be preserved, and that the government, as originally organized, should be administered in purity and truth." – Robert E. Lee
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Joined: Jan 2009
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 23,319 |
This thread calls to mind an episode of All in the Family shown many years past. In it, Archie had taken a small child into a church and baptised same in a fountain. He did this in a stealthy manner so no one would catch him. He was worried that the parents would not have the child baptised so took matters into his own hands. Not because he was christian, but he just new it should be done. As he was pouring water over the child's head, Archie exclaimed,"I baptise you in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit."
If that had happened today and had been reported in the news, would the baptism be valid regardless of the human element of the baptiser? Baptism, as defined in the Greek, means immersion. Sprinkling and pouring is not New Testament baptism as depicted in the New Testament. Archie was probably a catholic, so to him it was baptism.
"All that the South has ever desired was that the Union, as established by our forefathers, should be preserved, and that the government, as originally organized, should be administered in purity and truth." – Robert E. Lee
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