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Joined: Sep 2009
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Sep 2009
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WCH,
I agree with Prairie G's comment above, re bullet failure, not cartridge inadequacy.
Curious, though, you go on to say you & a friend (She), shot an antelope, started tracking & then you say; "THEY looked till dark".
1 question & one more observation/opinion.
Why did you/THEY stop looking at dark ?
Afternoon hunt, surely you/they were equipped with flash lights, GPS, compass etc, needed for an end of day/evening recovery !
As to finding what was left of the animal the next morning, after the coyotes had had at it all night, I'd opine that it would be pretty hard to tell that it was the "good shot" you described.
Paul.
"Kids who grow up hunting, fishing & trapping, do not mug little old Ladies"
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Joined: Sep 2009
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Sep 2009
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 Yep, schidt happens, I'd just rather we manned up & owned up to our part in it, than blame the tools.
Paul.
"Kids who grow up hunting, fishing & trapping, do not mug little old Ladies"
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Joined: Feb 2011
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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99, the animal was not totally destroyed.. but ruined to the point it was not recoverable.. They did search after dark.. But you must realize in that part of the country, blood does not show up on the rocky soil like in the leaf covered forests of the east. I know these folks and they gave it their best.. the country behind the little hill, was a vast sage covered flat.. I believe this was a 100 grain Rem. factory also.. To me it is just too simply to say placement is all it takes, if so, why not a .22 lr?????
Molon Labe
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Joined: Sep 2009
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Sep 2009
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It's all cool, man !  I have a really bad habit of "playing the devil's advocate" ! 
Paul.
"Kids who grow up hunting, fishing & trapping, do not mug little old Ladies"
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Joined: Jan 2009
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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prairie goat, the bullet went the completely though.. I have had this experience more that several times with my 243's and 25's.. Mostly beyond 200 yards, this was the only one that acted this way on a close shot.. I admit a bone shot is a killer, that is mostly what I go for, but to me there is more than placement to consider when shooting game..
Oddly, I have never had this type of experience when shooting .22 calibers.. Most of the big game I shot with a .22 cal was with the .22-250 class of rifle.. But we also used the Hornet, .223 and 222. They always worked fine.. But with each shot I kind of held my breath. I was not certain of the out come.. I also never had an animal run like the one mentioned.. One of my favorite bullets was the old 55 grain Serria HPBT.. When I shot most of my game with the .22 calibers, I was hunting areas with lots of game, and I was under no pressure to take a risky shot..
It seems to me this is something folks don't consider when discussing caliber. In Montana with a 5 or 6 week deer season, you are probably under no pressure to take a marginal shot.. Same in Texas, or Alabama or other states.. Not all folks have that season.. I love fooling with all calibers.. In the future I am sure I will shoot some game with my .22's, but I would probably not carry my .22-250 as my only rifle when mule deer hunting.. I don't see enough truly big bucks to not want to take any reasonable shot.. I don't want to cripple an animal of any kind..
To me it is too simple just to say placement is the key.. It is important.. But what you put there is important also.. I have never had this kind of experience with a 7mm caliber or above..
Maybe others have, I know crazy things happen when a guy is shooting.. I also know you have reasons for your ideas also.. I can't look at it as a bullet failure when I did have an exit.. BUT I AM SURE IF I HAD MADE A HIGH SHOULDER SHOT SHE WOULD HAVE DROPPED ON THE SPOT.. NO DOUBT ABOUT THAT.. It has come to be my favorite shot.. Sounds like a possible pencil through. Bullets do weird things sometimes.
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Joined: Nov 2007
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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I have a very similar experience as yours, but it involves a 270 win. with 130 grn core-lokts.
'Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.' -Carl Sagan
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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There is not a doubt that could have happened, but I have had these experiences several times with my 243, 6mm, 250 Sav., 257 Roberts, the .25-06 and even the .257 Wea. BUT most were at longer distances when the bullet had cooled of considerably.. Animals were well hit, lungs usually, and ran an extremely long distance from the area where they were hit.. Never lost one.. I still have the .243, 25-06 and 250 Sav. Mostly they give fine performance.. But my faith in them has slipped..
Molon Labe
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Campfire Outfitter
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What bullets were you shooting? High lung shots?
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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99, not a problem.. some of the stuff that happens when a guy is hunting or shooting is unbelievable.. I have a couple friends who love the .243 for whitetails.. To my knowledge, they haven't had many bad experiences with then.. Most of the failures I mentioned were in the 1980's.. Not all but most.. Things have certainly changed since that time.. But when a guy has a failure, and you are sure you did your part, it is tough to forget it..
Molon Labe
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Joined: Feb 2011
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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prairie, yes for the most part you are right.. But one antelope took 3 100 grain Hornadys about the bottom of the lungs and never reacted.. He finally walked down the hill in to a little draw.. I was certain I was doing my part. Had a dead rest, all three bullets could have been covered with the palm of my hand.. Those could have penciled also.. That was over 40 years ago, and I did not look as closely at the wounds and bullet performance as I have in the last 30... I had at least one bad experience with a 100 grain Speer on an antelope, but it was at least 300 yrds. the bullet exited about the size of a nickle.. With the 257 Bee it was a 100 grain BTBT.. The ones I mention either ran and awful long way 200-250 yards, or in the case of the Speer, the antelope doe mingled in with a herd, and it was impossible to determine which I had shot.. That doe was on her feet for more that 5 minutes.. My wife timed it. I don't think I ever shot a game animal at over two hundred yards with my .22 cal. rifles, that could be why the success with them, and less than satisfactory performance with the others.. I don't know.. Maybe I have a jinx as far as those calibers..
Molon Labe
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Joined: Sep 2010
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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I edited this OUT, aka deleted, to replace it with one more specific. Just for clarity, the edit section said it was too late to delete. 
Last edited by jwall; 03/26/14.
jwall- *** 3100 guy***
A Flat Trajectory is Never a Handicap
Speed is Trajectory's Friend !!
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Joined: Sep 2010
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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I've had the same experiences, more with bullets than cartridge.
Just because you killed the game and recovered it/them does NOT mean the cartridge OR bullet performed properly.
+ 2
The only animals, I've had to seriously track to recover, where nothing to do with bullet or cartridge inadequacies. They were simply bad shots on my part ! "The nut behind the bolt". Think I may be the first person on this forum to ever admit that ! This response was the one I was responding to in the one I deleted.
You had a bullet failure there, not a cartridge failure.
I've seen the same darned thing happen with '06s, 7mm Mags, and a bunch of other rounds. If you're shooting crappy bullets, it doesn't really matter what you use. If you want DRT performance, shoot for bone. JFC people, this isn't that complicated.
Here P G was responding to WyoCoHu and I agree. There IS such a thing as 'bullet failure' even with 'proper' bullet placement. I know the difference. Over the years I've had my share of poor bullet placements AND other occasions I've had poor bullet performance = bullet failure.
jwall- *** 3100 guy***
A Flat Trajectory is Never a Handicap
Speed is Trajectory's Friend !!
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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I've enjoyed reading this thread the last few days. Too bad the site's official "turd in the punchbowl" has decided to show up and ruin it for everyone. This little guy? Laffin' ![[Linked Image]](http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v469/2439candace/Larry%20the%20Drunk%20pics/larryboy_zps99a999dc.jpg)
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Joined: Jan 2010
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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[/quote]
No, you're not the only one. I snuck up to within 15 freaking yards of a huge 190" muley buck, and completely whiffed 5 times, from 40-300 yds, with a 7mag. [/quote]
My grandpa always said "There's a lotta room around 'em."
P
Obey lawful commands. Video interactions. Hold bad cops accountable. Problem solved.
~Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla~
Member #547
Join date 3/09/2001
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 1,877 |
I've enjoyed reading this thread the last few days. Too bad the site's official "turd in the punchbowl" has decided to show up and ruin it for everyone. This little guy? Laffin' Good one, but boxer must wear boxers. No balls to hold up !!
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 3,893 |
What did you Do Nothing Day Dreaming Dumb [bleep] almost do today?
Laffin'!
You "hard chargers" are a [bleep] riot and the hour meters aboard your couchbound kchunts,is only surpassed by all the rounds you didn't shoot.
Bless your hearts.
Laffin'!
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Joined: Jun 2002
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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Posts: 11,953 |
What did you Do Nothing Day Dreaming Dumb almost do today? I did some fishin'. Caught a short one first cast.
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Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 3,893
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Aug 2011
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SuperKchunt,
You cain't even not catch you. Bless your heart.
Not that I don't enjoy your Whine,Imagination and Excuses.
Mebbe tomorrow will be the day,you pry your kchunt from the couch and shoot something other than your Pretend?!?
Nawwwwww...THAT ain't in the cards.
Laffin'!
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 1,082
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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Posts: 1,082 |
Not me�I've gravitated toward big and slow i.e. 358 Win, 9.3x62 and 45-70.
Start young, hunt hard, and enjoy God's bounty.
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 923
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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Posts: 923 |
wch,
Hit your space bar once in a while. It would make your posts a lot easier to read.
Like this...
Didn't hurt a bit.
Thanks!
Black Olives Matter!!
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