Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunting Rifles Montana range report, good and bad.

RH, I know you are one of the good guys. As are many guys posting on this subject. A lot of good minds here and I know most of us care about accuracy, contrary to what a few have said. I thought Brad would get what I was talking about with my comment, but forget, many here don't realize I'm a left handed shooter because I only have right handed rifles . I see tons of potential in your rifle buddy and know you will (in time) fine tune it to get every last speck of accuracy out of it. Most here are shooters and rifle loonies, if we weren't we'd be out fishing or playing golf instead of being here commenting on threads like this...

BSA, never knew you were a lefty!

I appreciate the kind words. Yes, I'll do what needs doing to get accuracy. I haven't disagreed with any advice given, so I really don't understand the reason for hostility. Regardless, I should have tougher skin and not childishly return snide remarks.

I posted all my groups so that anyone considering a Montana could see the whole picture with my particular gun. You do have to take into consideration that some of those groups could be a reflection of my shooting as much as the rifle. I'm learning a bit about better bench technique while at the same time trying to sort out any issues the gun may have. I know me well enough to know that I'm not a perfect shooting machine. Maybe someone with sharper skills could come to a definite decision sooner, but I saw no harm is shooting a couple more groups over the next couple weeks to make sure most of the problems aren't just me. I don't know why that offends anyone to the point that they need insult me. I didn't post to brag or whine and I'm starting to wish I hadn't bothered in the first place.

You mean bass ackwards . I did have to shoot righty on the second to furthest shot (600 yards with my 300 wsm) I've taken on a big game animal though because at the time my left eye was phuuuuckkked up!!! Yes, I'm one of those guys that believes a hunting rifle better be damn accurate

That is quite a revelation! BSA should realize that harboring all those pre '64's will give him coordination problems and even a personality disorder. He should dispose of those pieces quickly in order to prevent any long term maladies.

I appreciate your posts regarding the Montana. I also follow what you are saying. Here's how I see it.

1. Follow SAS's advice on the thread he started regarding the montana.
2. Glass bed the rifle.
3. Remember your rifle is new, so it will continue to shoot better as the barrel breaks in.
4. Over time, you'll hone your skills in shooting a light weight rifle. This may take a little experimenting. Soft towel under the forearm where the front rest is, hold it like Brad suggested, hold it like you normally do, just a little experimenting goes a long way.
5. Fine tuned handloads go a looooooooong way as well. Hint

RH, don't beat yourself up. These new Kimber range report threads usually head to the shidder by page two anyway. Its the way of the world here. Your were being up front and objective - others used it as an opportunity to further an agenda.
I look forward to the next range report after you've worked some magic.

I agree. I also thought it was BS when the same thing happened to you in your Montana thread.

Is there a reason in general? I dont own one, but they seem to be pretty nice rifles.

Paulh
I really don't know. A lot of guys here really like them. You can also read a lot of reports about bad accuracy. From what I can tell, some of that can be attributed to some bad barrels a few years ago and some small issues like a mag box binding or improper bedding or crown. I posted all my groups because I wanted anyone to see the whole truth. You do have to take into consideration that being so light they are a bit harder to shoot until you get the hang of it, and I'm only using factory ammo.

Some people just dismiss them saying such an expensive rifle should be perfect from the start. I say you can find issues with any gun at any price point. The Montana is IMHO a very nice light weight package. I don't know of anything it's equal in all stainless at that weight. If a tiny bit of tweeking is necessary, then I accept that as part of the experience.

My main concern was the possibility of getting a bad barrel or sloppy chamber. So far I think it has shot well enough on some groups that that isn't the case. Worse case scenario, I will need to bed it. Best case, better ammo and learn to shoot a little better. All in all I'm happy with my rifle and will start saving for one in 223.

I did some "experiments" a couple months ago with my 7-08 Montucky regarding fore-end control. When I was working on my loads I realized it needed fore-end control but didn't know what "impact it" had ... so I shot one target with different holds one day when I was bored.

Although the felt recoil is very low, there is considerable muzzle jump compared to my other hunting rifles. If I don't control the Montana, it'll shoot willy-nilly all over, for me. Sometimes worse than others. With a tighter hold I get more consistent results from field positions.

Could be me and my technique, but I had four 300 Magnums that needed very little fore-end control in comparison. My main hunting rifle for awhile was a T3 SuperLight Tikkler shooting the 200gr NAB at 2900fps... roughly 7lb rifle all-up ready to hunt. I shot that rifle with my support hand on top of the scope. Recoil was significantly higher than the 7-08 Montana but it didn't require much control and it shot lights-out consistently.

This is an ugly target from the 7-08 but was the result of my test using the 120gr NBT at 3100fps. Shot prone, using a cheap Caldwell rifle rest, no sling. The first 4 shots were done loose, the next 4 shot with a firm grip on the fore-end, then the last 2 were shot like I'd fire my Tikklers (free recoil, little if any hold).

At that time the trigger was set at ~2.25lb. I think shots #9 & #10 are more a product of the light rifle getting pulled off target than anything and me being mentally done with trying to prove a point to myself

After shooting 10 rounds with the 120gr NBT (cheap practice load), I switched to the 120gr TTSX at 3000fps (hunting load). Fired two loose, then the last 3 with control on the fore-end. Just confirmed what I already knew.

For what it's worth, I never believed the claims that "light" rifles were harder to shoot when I owned the T3 Tikklers. They were easy to shoot, but nearly 1-pound heavier. After owning this Montana, I found that it requires a different technique for me to shoot well, but is a lot more enjoyable to carry

Next time out I'll try to take pics of groups using a sling.

4th,
Good post with pics. I think that with these lightweights, < 7 #'s, whatever is a "real world" shooting scenario is what you should practice. Whether its leaning against a tree or post, off the top of your pack - sitting and prone, etc..
The next heavier contour on the Montana would alleviate a lot of this. Let's say a .625" from a Tikka for example.
We look forward to your next range sessions.

Apparently 1.5 moa = minute of milk jug. Learn something new everyday.

BW,

I've gotten lazy the past few months and have been using a rest or sandbags more than I should from prone. Its been awhile, but last week I was shooting off my pack... in the huckberries, and through the brush at 480y. A regular bipod and squeeze bag wouldn't work here, unless I had a weedwacker

Its times like this, when I'm contorted on top of my Kifaru pack, with the spotting-scope/tripod in the pack jabbing me in the belly, binos poking me in the ribs, and rifle in a not-so-perfect position that a light recoiling rifle is a blessing. There were times I'd literally have to skip a week of shooting with my Magnums while shooting like this to allow the bruises to heal!

I just get a kick outta shooting like this though. A couple weeks ago I took my buds to a landing where I shoot 500y & 800y. They just worked up their rifle loads and were having decent luck on the 500y gong. After they were done I put the Kimber on their sandbags and hit the 8" 500y gong 3-for-3. They thought that was pretty cool, but off of sandbags its like cheating

Jason

I've had a few Montana's.I don't recall that any were terrible accuracy wise,if they liked the ammo. One 7mm WSM sucked if you fed it Federal Premium.With handloads loaded to normal velocity(not the hyper souped up over pressure factory stuff), it shot fine.

One 257 Roberts was stupid accurate.A match shooter at the range thought it was nifty,but asked how it shot.I told him it will put three shots into 1/2-5/8" at 100 yards.

He smiled and said "Show me". So I sat down and put 3 into 5/8" He still talks about that.Nice when you get "called" and a plan falls together.

IME nothing fancy is required; I don't hold the fore end down. My left hand is back under the butt stock controlling the rear bag....but I do put a soft towel under the receiver,and don't rest the rifle way out on the fore end. The front bag is back under the chamber.Light rifles will "bounce" off firm rests,and groups will go to hell.Controlling the bounce is key.

Very firm sand bags are a hostile environment for a light rifle.

I do tend to draw a light rifle like a Montana back a bit harder with my right hand.

Now Bob, that sounds like the way I'd try holding/shooting the Montana. However, Of course, I'd be drawing it back with the left hand instead of the right. Front rest placement only makes sense to me as well as the soft towel. It also cracks me up when I see guys at the range putting the front rest right under the tip of the fore arm or at the sling swivel stud.

bsa: Ever see the guys who put the barrel on the front bag?

Or in the "V" of a wooden block?

I was never curious enough to stick around and see how that worked.

Yes, sir it was a condescending post but only in response to a condescending comment. I have been nothing but cordial to those on this forum who have offered helpful advice, including those who have suggested the rifle would benefit from bedding. Several times I have stated that that is likely the next step and thanked the individual for the advice. [/quote]

I'm sure you are a good man...my point was why continue down a dead end road? When 4 or 5 men, tell you to bed the rifle first (These men, know rifles), continuing with the tweaks and turns are pointless. After bedding, then the tweaking will show the affects on the rifle, more betta!

I have two Montana's both bedded, both shoot MOA or better with just about everything I shoot through them.

I also, have a Classic in 7WSM that went through two members here, both said was a 1.5-2" rifle. I bought it, and Karnis helped with the bedding, my first load went 5/8"...and is repeatable over and over again!