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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 46,245
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 46,245 |
If you are so paranoid as to feel it is necessary to carry a firearm while attending church services, perhaps you should stay home and watch one of the televangelists. After all a man's home is his fortress, I feel no need to make an armed fortress out of my house of worship. With that line of thinking you can throw out all your smoke detectors, fire extinguishers, home security systems and cancel your car and home insurance policies, as well as pitch your spare tires and jacks in the trash. Gunner
Trump Won!
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 27,500
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 27,500 |
As an ad on, I have quite doing business with several businesses including a physical therapy place that was providing good help to me, a couple of retraunts, and a nearby RV repair shop because of their no guns on the premises rules. And, I made sure to tell the owners/managers of each place why I was not ever going to set foot in thier establishments again. They have a right to be leftist and/or ignorant and we have the right to take our business elsewhere, and must.
One restraunt took down their no guns sign after I mentioned my offense to it, and they get much of our business as a result.
Last edited by safariman; 04/23/14.
LOVE God, LOVE your family, LOVE your country, LIKE guns and sports.
About 2016 team "R" candidates "We definitely need a crew with a sack of balls the size of hot water bottles, bloviated estrogen leaking feel-gooders need not apply." Gunner 500
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 15,680
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 15,680 |
Google 'church shooting'. You'll get quite a few hits. Yup, and in every one of them there were no lightning bolts flying around providing fire suppression, no divine intervention and no legions of angels to stop it. If they were stopped, they were stopped by an armed person. In Glock We Trust.
![[Linked Image from i.pinimg.com]](https://i.pinimg.com/originals/98/b6/d8/98b6d863a5f722b551cd8e1440bd2bd4.jpg) Z
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 10,278
Campfire Outfitter
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OP
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 10,278 |
Why even tell ANYONE that you are carrying a handgun? No body needs to know and should not know until you have to use it, which may never happen. Just keep quite about it. Couldn't agree more. I live in a state where I can open carry...I have NO intention to open carry, but I'm glad I have the option. Because carrying a concealed weapon in a place of worship is a felony in Ohio, unless you have permission. I trust God to protect me, yes, that is why he gave me the ability to fight back.
The older I become the more I am convinced that the voice of honor in a man's heart is the voice of GOD.
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Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,751
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,751 |
My pastor and I, along with our wives, went and took our CHL class together and I loaned them my extra Colt. The school principle went with us! Yes, I have a letter stating I can carry at church and have actually been asked to do so on several occasions - I don't make it a habit to carry at church as I really never felt the need to. I have several friends that do regularly.
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 33,856
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 33,856 |
My pastor and I, along with our wives, went and took our CHL class together and I loaned them my extra Colt. The school principle went with us! Yes, I have a letter stating I can carry at church and have actually been asked to do so on several occasions - I don't make it a habit to carry at church as I really never felt the need to. I have several friends that do regularly. Strange, I thought there was an increase in assaults in gun free zones and that there have already been several instances of killers doing their deed in churches. I would think that would be one of the more important places to carry one.
The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time by the blood of patriots and tyrants.
If being stupid allows me to believe in Him, I'd wish to be a retard. Eisenhower and G Washington should be good company.
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 27,500
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 27,500 |
My pastor and I, along with our wives, went and took our CHL class together and I loaned them my extra Colt. The school principle went with us! Yes, I have a letter stating I can carry at church and have actually been asked to do so on several occasions - I don't make it a habit to carry at church as I really never felt the need to. I have several friends that do regularly. Strange, I thought there was an increase in assaults in gun free zones and that there have already been several instances of killers doing their deed in churches. I would think that would be one of the more important places to carry one. Kinda my thinking on the topic. My pastor and friend specified that he preffered me to pack my full size 10mm vs my pocket 380 each Sunday and most Sundays I do. Jeff Cooper wrote about the silliness of not carrying to, in and from Church decades ago. And that was BEFORE the recent spate of shootings in houses of worship. If one could predict where tragedy or evil was going to strike we would either 1) avoid that time and place or 2) bring a good long gun to that same time/place.
LOVE God, LOVE your family, LOVE your country, LIKE guns and sports.
About 2016 team "R" candidates "We definitely need a crew with a sack of balls the size of hot water bottles, bloviated estrogen leaking feel-gooders need not apply." Gunner 500
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 59,140
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 59,140 |
If you are so paranoid as to feel it is necessary to carry a firearm while attending church services, perhaps you should stay home and watch one of the televangelists. After all a man's home is his fortress, I feel no need to make an armed fortress out of my house of worship. Calling somebody paranoid for concealed carry is way over the top. A somewhat local pastor from a church a few miles away wrote a column in that town's newspaper denouncing anyone who might be carrying concealed - calling them 'frightened people'.. I wrote a letter back - asking him a simple question. If he and I were to be conversing on the street and some guy, that the pastor had inadvertently angered earlier, came up with the intent of great bodily harm should I intervene with my firearm to save the pastor's life or should I get out of the way so as to notify his next of kin? He wouldn't answer.. People who carry daily - like myself now - sometimes literally forget it's still on the belt when heading into church. Concealed, I leave it that way and obviously say nothing. Do I NEED to carry there? 99.999% of the time, of course not. But it's that one .0001 chance that some a-hole will think this church is a gun-free zone and try to take out a lot of my churchgoers. He'll find out that he's made a rather fatal error, if the chance arrives. Those parishoners are friends of mine - and do not deserve to be innocent victims of some a-hole..
Ex- USN (SS) '66-'69
Pro-Constitution.
LET'S GO BRANDON!!!
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Joined: May 2011
Posts: 2,190
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 2,190 |
After the shootings at the church in Colo. Springs a few years ago, I know of at least one church who has several CCW guys that do carry every Sunday. SO, this is not something knew to everyone.
Last edited by TRnCO; 04/24/14.
Laws aren't preventative measures. In other words, more laws won't prevent gun crime from happening.
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 17,800
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 17,800 |
Here's a question for you concealed carry proponents, are you prepared to accept the consequences should one of your bullets cause the death of of an innocent bystander? You can talk about all the CCW classes you want, how many of you have any real world experience bringing deadly force into play in a stressful situation? Are you prepared to lose your life in a gunfight with a career criminal with nothing to lose? Do you feel your handgun is adequate to go up against someone like the Arvada, CO gunman wearing body armor shooting an AR with 100 rd. drum magazine?
Last edited by gunswizard; 04/25/14.
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 33,856
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 33,856 |
I recently had a conversation with an elder concerning concealed firearms in church. In Ohio it is a felony to carry in a place of worship without there permission. What he told me was that those on the council stated that they would not be comfortable with people carrying concealed weapons, not even a select few.
So I wrote this on my Facebook page, which is read by many in the church:
Sitting here thinking about a recent conversation. Someone told me they and others wouldn't feel comfortable with people carrying handguns in church. They might even be afraid.
Really, that's funny.The thing is I go about my day, walking around shopping, talking to people, giving a smile and receiving one. Yes, just a pleasant person.
Except
I'm carrying a handgun, sometimes two, most of the time.
So do you feel different now? Are you afraid? Am I not still the good Christian man I always was? Am I less pleasant? If you hugged me and felt it, would you recoil in horror? What difference does it make really?
Well, one I guess, you'd be safer by me. Why you ask? Because I'm still the man who would fight for you.
You see, this gun does not make me evil, it has no power to do that. Nor is it evil, because it is just an object. It is a tool, nothing more or less. It just so happens that it is a tool I use very well. It means your are ready to KILL in the right circumstances, which makes you a potential KILLER. Didn't the Bible say to not kill   I think the wording is commit murder, not kill. For sure Tracks, but that is not the way many see it, failing to know the originals biblical translation. There are millions of believers who would look upon a gun carrier in church with the thought as I said. Many church goers will swear to God said not to kill. Many soldiers from the Gulf War fear they may be headed for Hell, with never having been told what you said.
The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time by the blood of patriots and tyrants.
If being stupid allows me to believe in Him, I'd wish to be a retard. Eisenhower and G Washington should be good company.
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 33,856
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 33,856 |
If you are so paranoid as to feel it is necessary to carry a firearm while attending church services, perhaps you should stay home and watch one of the televangelists. After all a man's home is his fortress, I feel no need to make an armed fortress out of my house of worship. Calling somebody paranoid for concealed carry is way over the top. FOR NORMAL FOLKS.
The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time by the blood of patriots and tyrants.
If being stupid allows me to believe in Him, I'd wish to be a retard. Eisenhower and G Washington should be good company.
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 844
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 844 |
If you are so paranoid as to feel it is necessary to carry a firearm while attending church services, perhaps you should stay home and watch one of the televangelists. After all a man's home is his fortress, I feel no need to make an armed fortress out of my house of worship. Paranoia? That is laughable! I would like you to explain this theory to a local Presbyterian church that was subject to an armed robbery during Sunday Morning Services! It happened about 5 years ago: three youths, wearing ski masks and armed with stolen pistols and duct tape, entered the church and robbed the congregation. They took wallets, purses and cell phones, and exited swiftly after experiencing an accidental revolver discharge. It was really more of an act of terrorism than robbery, since the congregants could reasonably expect to be bound (duct tape) and executed. Turns out it was some local dopers, about 18 to 20 years old, who had a grudge against the church.
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 18,300
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 18,300 |
If you are so paranoid as to feel it is necessary to carry a firearm while attending church services, perhaps you should stay home and watch one of the televangelists. After all a man's home is his fortress, I feel no need to make an armed fortress out of my house of worship. this is a fruitcake statement.
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 33,856
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 33,856 |
Here's a question for you concealed carry proponents, are you prepared to accept the consequences should one of your bullets cause the death of of an innocent bystander? You can talk about all the CCW classes you want, how many of you have any real world experience bringing deadly force into play in a stressful situation? Are you prepared to lose your life in a gunfight with a career criminal with nothing to lose? Do you feel your handgun is adequate to go up against someone like the Arvada, CO gunman wearing body armor shooting an AR with 100 rd. drum magazine? Better to have some chance than none. If someone goes on another Wendy's killing rampage I'd hate to go against them with a hand gun, but I'd rather that chance than none. The movie killer was most concerned with surviving his attack. Probably only a few would have died had someone been firing back.
Last edited by eyeball; 04/25/14.
The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time by the blood of patriots and tyrants.
If being stupid allows me to believe in Him, I'd wish to be a retard. Eisenhower and G Washington should be good company.
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 26,524
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 26,524 |
Here's a question for you concealed carry proponents, a) are you prepared to accept the consequences should one of your bullets cause the death of of an innocent bystander? You can talk about all the CCW classes you want, b)how many of you have any real world experience bringing deadly force into play in a stressful situation? c)Are you prepared to lose your life in a gunfight with a career criminal with nothing to lose? d)Do you feel your handgun is adequate to go up against someone like the Arvada, CO gunman wearing body armor shooting an AR with 100 rd. drum magazine? a) yes. b) I do. c) yes d) no. Now, with comments: a) yes. I would hope common sense and due diligence would reduce the possibility of this happening. b) I do. No comment c) yes. If it comes down to me having to engage in a "gunfight" than my life is already on the line. I don't go searching them out. d) no. but not all wing nuts are so armored.
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 18,300
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 18,300 |
Here's a question for you concealed carry proponents, are you prepared to accept the consequences should one of your bullets cause the death of of an innocent bystander? You can talk about all the CCW classes you want, how many of you have any real world experience bringing deadly force into play in a stressful situation? Are you prepared to lose your life in a gunfight with a career criminal with nothing to lose? Do you feel your handgun is adequate to go up against someone like the Arvada, CO gunman wearing body armor shooting an AR with 100 rd. drum magazine? What kind of fool knowing he was going to die would die like a lamb rather than a lion. Quit posting or change your name to guncoward.
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 69,325
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 69,325 |
Consider a hypothetical case of a minister who's counseling a woman in the church for marital problems, keeping it totally professional. Her husband gets the idea that the minister is hitting on her so he comes visiting with a gun one Sunday morning. Somehow being armed doesn't seem so ludicrous now does it?
“In a time of deceit telling the truth is a revolutionary act.”
― George Orwell
It's not over when you lose. It's over when you quit.
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Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 2,327
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 2,327 |
Here's a question for you concealed carry proponents, are you prepared to accept the consequences should one of your bullets cause the death of of an innocent bystander? You can talk about all the CCW classes you want, how many of you have any real world experience bringing deadly force into play in a stressful situation? Are you prepared to lose your life in a gunfight with a career criminal with nothing to lose? Do you feel your handgun is adequate to go up against someone like the Arvada, CO gunman wearing body armor shooting an AR with 100 rd. drum magazine? All the above scenarios you throw out are real world possibilities, heck even likely. But the thought of crawling around under the pews, terrorized and pissing myself, while my church family (and wife and child) are falling dead around me, with no means of protecting myself or anyone else.... is simply repugnant beyond words. Just slightly less repugnant, is the thought of killing another human, but if it comes down to him or me (and mine) dying in violence, I will do the ugly deed if possible and shoot to stop his actions. And I will live with the consequences, whatever they may be. I can't do that by throwing bibles and hymnals at a gunman. YMMV. So I will ask YOU a question. Lets say YOU are in a church and a gunman comes in and starts killing at random. For the sake of argument, lets say YOU are in a position with him 25 feet away, shooting targets at random. What are you going to do?If you prefer to cower in fear with no means to protect yourself, waiting to die, hey, that's your choice.
Last edited by snubbie; 04/25/14.
Gloria In Excelsis Deo!As far as gear goes.. The poorer (or cheaper) you are, the tougher you need to be. gpopecustomknives.com
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