Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire Army wants a harder hitting handgun

I have reviewed a lot of officer involved shootings in the course of the last 10 years or so. 45 ACP, 40 SW, 9mm, 10mm, 38 Special, 44 Special, 44 Magnum, 357 Magnum. Every one of those calibers has failed to stop armed felons before the felons could do more harm. I've debriefed a bunch of cops and military personnel who have given me their stories freely, and the common denominator is shot placement.

Unless you put your handgun bullets into vital anatomy, they won't do any good. Police departments that train their officers in anatomically correct shot placement have found caliber isn't as important as they thought it was.

45 ACP is not the answer, nor is the 1911. I think the 45 is a great cartridge and it would be my choice if I were the guy choosing it. A modernized update of the 1911 single stack concept such as the SIG P220 would be a good choice, but so would others.

The answer lies in training, not in hardware. Our SF guys know this, as do a lot of the better PD's in America.

I don't know about the small hands thing in a 1911. We had a lady on the pistol team and she was no giant. She shot as well as any man maybe better sometimes.

I have homunculus hands and the handgun that fits my hands the best is the 1911. If I can shoot a 1911 with my hands anybody can shoot a 1911.

A handgun is for self defense, a battle rifle is for fighting, and a machine pistol is for close in fighting. A handgun is not for fighting as such.

I recall reading the article about the LEO that was in this gunfight......he did land eight hits on the bad guy, not sure how many were "incapacitating" or not.

The gist of the article was that he was down to a couple of rounds in his last mag when he finally stopped the BG.....he ended up switching to a Glock 17 I believe and carries over 100 rounds for it now. He wanted more ROH for extended confrontations.......

If a soldier can't carry a rifle for some reason, then I suppose he would want a harder hitting handgun.

7 shot .357 Magnum S&W 686

I'm sure General Patton would agree....

I would want a machine pistol instead or at least a M-1 carbine.

The story was posted in detail here a couple months ago. The fight was finally stopped by a head shot.

It will be:

Polymer, with a tactical rail, tritium sights, double-stack magazine, and .40S&W.

Frankly, it probably will be the Glock and should have been the Glock back in the '80s. If it had been then, the change-over to another caliber would be child's play and cheap now.

Hey, I got an idea!!

With a thumb safety and a magazine disconnect.

I say just issue everyone SIG P220's and call it done.

There....saved millions of taxpayer dollars.

Jim;

I've heard more than once that those little carbines killed mo-better than they should have.

It was a great idea especially the M-2 model. I used the M-1 version and it was great for what it was designed for.

+1

They�re probably looking for any excuse to go to Glock�s because:

1. They�re on all the fashionable tv shows.
2. They�re taticool.
3. They will give the medics and corpsmen practice putting tourniquets on legs with bleeding femoral arteries that were shot on the firing line.

I know I�d be nervous standing next to Bubba/Snuffy Smith/gangbanger raw recruit on each side of me side-holding a pistol without a safety. I�ll believe the military really believes that�s a good idea when they remove the safety off the M4.

I agree it's still handgun ammo. Shoot 8 times and still have 8 more in the mag. Works for me. There is no miracle bullet. Maybe they need to use HP's. I think that would help a lot.

I was going to comment on this as well. The most ignorant sentence in that entire piece. Who has ever argued a pistol round has more than marginal lethality. It is the weapon of last resort. The Browning 1911 is #1 for a reason.

We don't agree on much but you are dead on on this one. I get nervous every time I see someone pull a Glock out of their range bag at the range.

While I carried a .45 caliber 1911A1 when I was in the Army, I'd recommend the Army opt for a double-action semi-auto shooting a .45 ACP cartridge to replace their M-9 9x19s.

While the .45 ACP does have a heavier recoil which makes it slower t bring down for a 2nd. shot at the same target, it's also a one-shot-stopper, so you don't always need a 2nd. shot.

Just my 2�.........


Strength & Honor...

Ron T.

I am thinking that there will be no change in caliber. The girls and nancy boys that are filling the service rosters now can't shoot anything with power, and as was mentioned, NO handgun cartridge is really a stopper.
I'm betting that they have been hoarding all the .22 LR ammo, with plans in mind to switch to that caliber.