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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13 |
I find the .223 a lot more useful.
Travis
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Joined: May 2012
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 1,705 |
I find the .223 a lot more useful.
Travis And that's pretty hard to argue with.
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Joined: May 2005
Posts: 14,104
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 14,104 |
Most useful in a variety of situations or on a variety of game? I could probably shoot everything I hunt from now on using nothing but the .308, but using it on some critters, both large and small, would properly be categorized as "stunt" shooting. For North America, I think that the .243 Winchester is probably truly more useful for a somewhat greater variety of game than the .308.
That said, the .223 is probably regularly used to take a greater variety of game these days than any other "short-action" cartridge, although it wouldn't be my first choice.
Ben
Some days it takes most of the day for me to do practically nothing...
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Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 5,932
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 5,932 |
Well ya the 308 is a very useful cartridge. I taken it to Africa three times and used it to take 33 animals. From jackels to Impala to eland on the high end all with the 165gr TSX.
Is it the most useful well that's debatable.
Beware of thieves, scammers and dishonest members on the "Fire" classifieds. Ya there is a thief here too. Whatever!!
They're all around the CampFire and everywhere.
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,829
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,829 |
Can't used the .223 to hunt in Alberta or Saskatchewan. Not sure about other locations. .308 would be my choice as a result.
ETA, I shoot a 7mm-08 and a .30-06.
SS
Last edited by SamSteele; 09/19/14.
"To be glad of life because it gives you a chance to love and to work and to play and to look up at the stars. To be satisfied with your possessions but not content with yourself until you have made the best of them." -Henry Van Dyke
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Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 10,896
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 10,896 |
I cast my vote for the 308 as well for its versatility via good bullet selection.
You better be afraid of a ghost!!
"Woody you were baptized in prop wash"..crossfireoops
Woody
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Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 10,833
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Apr 2010
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Maker of the Frankenstud Sling Keeper
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Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 15,867 Likes: 6
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 15,867 Likes: 6 |
Our own Brad's sig line about the .308 being a low drama cartridge, around since 1952, kicking little, yet killing a lot, pretty much says it all.
THE CHAIR IS AGAINST THE WALL. The Tikka T3 in .308 Winchester is the Glock 19 of the rifle world. The website is up and running!www.lostriverammocompany.com
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 78,300 Likes: 1
Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 78,300 Likes: 1 |
I like your sig line�..
Black dogs bark at night�.
"...the left considers you vermin, and they'll kill you given the chance..." Bristoe
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Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 563
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 563 |
And let's not forget the .338-08, which has become legitimized as the .338 Federal. An excellent cartridge for elk in the timber, and for whitetails.
Ymmv
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 20,901 Likes: 1
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 20,901 Likes: 1 |
I don't like the .308.....
P.S. I don't have one. WHAT? Whatchu just said???? I don't think I heared you right.
"I never thought I'd live to see the day that a U.S. president would raise an army to invade his own country." Robert E. Lee
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 20,901 Likes: 1
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 20,901 Likes: 1 |
Most useful short action cartridge(s)?
308 Winchester 300 Winchester Short Magnum
When people ask me what I shoot, I tell them a 308 Short Mag.
"I never thought I'd live to see the day that a U.S. president would raise an army to invade his own country." Robert E. Lee
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 12,140
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 12,140 |
I like your sig line�..
Black dogs bark at night�. ingwe; Good evening to you sir, I hope this finds you folks well. I recall exchanging some correspondence with MacKay about his sig line when I first started showing up in these parts. Somehow I recall the other part of the message to be something about John having a long mustache..... We've got a neighbor who is a retired Vancouver PD constable that takes in all manner of dogs now. He's stone deaf so it doesn't bother him that most of his dogs bark all night - only some of them being black. To the OP's question, while I really should have bought a .223 years and years ago, because of my relatively new relationship with the cartridge I can't say for sure it's the "most useful" quite yet. It does appear though that a decent .223 would get a whole lot of use at this point. Based upon what we have played with over the years a fair amount, I'd have to agree with MacKay and the posters who've voted for the .308. That said, there's no flies on a 7-08 either and our journey with the .250AI has been a smooth one for sure too. Anyway ingwe, all the best to you folks and good luck on your hunts this fall as well. Dwayne
The most important stuff in life isn't "stuff"
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Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 2,059
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 2,059 |
How's the 223rem more useful?
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 25,107
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 25,107 |
Don't see anything the 243 can't do as well or better than the others.
An embarrassment of great bullets pushed at meaningful velocity. It's kinda a big deal that dont cause much of a fuss.
“Life is life and fun is fun, but it's all so quiet when the goldfish die.”
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Joined: May 2004
Posts: 56,155 Likes: 13
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 56,155 Likes: 13 |
You can't kill anything larger than elephants with the .223.
Like the .22 short, but this isn't about uber short, just plain vanilla short.
Carry on.
I am..........disturbed.
Concerning the difference between man and the jackass: some observers hold that there isn't any. But this wrongs the jackass. -Twain
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Campfire Outfitter
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OP
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 12,651 |
[quote=SansSouci]I have always thought that the .308 Win was one of the best cartridges -not just short action- ever designed. I.../quote]
Agreed. Not that I own one currently. Sold both of mine to fund my first AR in .3oo Blackout with an extra 5,56/.223 upper.
Hmmm.... 4 Merlots in Cody don't help my typing, but love this town...
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 3,624 Likes: 1 |
"Most useful" was the terminology. In that case, it IS the .358. Others are more common, slightly better in some aspects, but it will do more different things than the others, covering more bases of game and bullets....JMO. Yeah, the 358 is just the berries on a prairie dog shoot. It'll still kill a prairie dog as effectively as a moose or bear...was the point. Sure, its not optimal for prairie dogs, but prairie dogs ain't likely to kill you for merely pissing them off, either. I'm not arguing 'best', just broadest big game usefulness. Even a .243 isn't necessarily ideal for everything, though I own a few.;)
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 12,651
Campfire Outfitter
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OP
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 12,651 |
In terms of usefulness....
.22LR .30-06 ..223 Rem/.5.56 NATO .308W
Just MHO, YMMV.
The usefulness of the .223/5.56 and .30-06 are up for discussion, but I'll stick with the .30--06 first.
Even though the .30-06 is not a short action...
Last edited by Coyote_Hunter; 09/19/14.
Coyote Hunter - NRA Patriot Life, NRA Whittington Center Life, GOA, DAD - and I VOTE!
No, I'm not a Ruger bigot - just an unabashed fan of their revolvers, M77's and #1's.
A good .30-06 is a 99% solution.
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Joined: Aug 2006
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,225 |
For use on North American game the .308 is the obvious choice as the "best" short action cartridge. It is adiquite for anything from field mice to big bears if properly placed.
On the low side (varmits) it might be a bit more gun than is comfortable, but will kill a prairie dog just as dead as a high-speed .22 caliber. There is no such thing as "too deadly" so argument against the .308 based on varmit use just don't hold water.
On the other end of the spectrum, the .308 is getting very close to not being enough gun against the largest game animals. This is particularly true against the big bears which can bite back. However, a well placed .308 shot will definitely kill any bear that ever walked.....you just have to be careful.
It has the trajectory to be effective to 400+ yards....which is as (if not farther) than the "average" hunter should be taking game anyway.
The only legitimate challenger to the .308 (in my opinion) would be the .358. It would give up just a bit of range, but also give a bit more "whump" on the largest game.
Actually I have always felt the .308 was the most versitile ONLY because of the guns it is available in that won't chamber a longer round. If one is not limited to a short action rifle the .300 Magnums would be my choice as "best" for an all-around cartridge (the .30-06 would be almost as useful but I give the edge to the .300's due to being able to send the heaviest bullets with a bit more authority).
I've never really bought into the whole short action argument anyway. The .30-06 length cartridges are available in bolt, single shot, pump and semi-auto actions and I cannot see where a half-inch shorter action is any advantage. That is however my own opinion and I know lots of folks who spend big money to build short action rifles and believe they are superior. Confidence is such a big part of success so, for them, the short action IS better.
There is one argument that makes the .308 far superior to any .300 or .30-06. The Savage 99 cannot be made to handle anything longer than the .308.....so that makes it the "best" cartridge.
I hate change, it's never for the better.... Grumpy Old Men The more I learn, the more I realize how little I know
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