Thanks .Main reason i asked was to compare what is available over there compared to what we can get here.Kreiger,Hart, Shilen and lilja are all available.Tobler barrels are not quite as popular as they once were in the bench rest or F class seen,just thought out of the above 4 there may be a favourite .I realise there is not much between them. Given the same cicumstances with a cartrige that is considered hard on barrels have you found one particular brand holds up better than the others.Maddco make excellent barrels over here but they are known to be reasonably soft.