las- it was nice to hear your counterpoint. I'm not a gunsmith, and I can't say I've had a bad experience with getting any of my guns worked on. I just seem to have a bad run of luck with keeping a good gunsmith. The two very compitent smiths I'v used over the years have unfortunately passed away. Once again I find myself looking for someone I can trust to work on my guns. I can tell you that having worked as a rangemaster for several years at a popular local rifle range, many hunters are really upset when their rifles won't shoot MOA groups every time they plop down at a bench. Sometimes it's the equipment, but most times it's pilot error. Some people just can't admit they're not very good shots. I had the luxury of growing up the son of a WWII infantryman who taught me how to shoot the right way, and I can tell you, that from watching these guys at the range try to shoot, that bad habits, and lack of practice add up to bad groups. It's not the rangemaster, or the gunsmith's fault that the shooter can't hit the same quadrant of the target twice in a row at 50 yards, and that does happen quite frequently. They'd get upset because we'd refuse to make a scope adjustment until they shot some kind of group. They seemed to feel that we weren't doing our jobs, and that's why their guns weren't grouping. There needs to be a certain level of self accountability sometimes. Gunsmithing, or in my experience, rangemaster errors do occur, but sometimes the man behind the trigger needs to share in the blame too.