I'm trying to come to grips with the Muslim mentality as well
I was thinking this morning - what religion has people believing they should blow themselves up taking out as many people as possible in the process
and I'm trying to differentiate that from peaceful Muslims who believe that Muslims cannot kill innocents.
But then I think about Christianity - and blowing up abortion clinics , killing abortion doctors, protesting at funerals of soldiers - and no one within Christianity (or outside for the most part) believes that all of Christianity should be lumped in with these extremists.
That said, it makes no sense whatsoever to increase your chances of a domestic terrorist attack by allowing thousands of muslims who really have no desire to assimilate and are only escaping war to relocate in your country.
You should not even hint at any equivalence between the two religions if you want to make an accurate and even handed statement. And I don't think you meant to.
But the numbers of these "Christians" who did these outrageous things is infinitesimally small compared to the jihadists, and the number of abortion doctors murdered is even at a greater disparity with the number of people worldwide that radical Islamists have murdered.
Nor do Christians circumcise, suppress, and stone women, rape little boys as a part of their culture, and follow a book that condones a totalitarian caliphate under Shar'ia law. In fact Christians founded the first hospitals, promoted higher education, and raised women from third class citizens, from some place just behind goats.
To your final point, the incidents in Paris show that a terrorist can and will come in as a refugee and this president has done nothing,..nothing, over the last seven years to make one think they could believe him when he says they will be adequately screened.
I think James Buchanaan is finally relieved in his grave...as he has been supplanted as this nation's worst president. This guy can't even act presidential.
the whole point was that there are extremists in both religions who warp the teachings of their religion to fit a purpose.
if the point you want to make is that muslims on the whole are buying into the ideas that are expressed by the radicals, so be it. That is a discussion that is on point.
There is no equivalence in my statement - I'm trying to point out that Christians don't claim extremists who say they are acting on Christian beliefs and I'm trying to gather if Muslims on the whole reject extremists who say they are acting on Muslim beliefs.
I realize now some people have the ability to comprehend that
others don't.
The problem with your moral equivalitist post is the compaction of time to fit within that narrow and misguided scope.
Yes, the Westboro Baptist and World Church of the Creator type bunches are as close to a Christian ISIS as we have right now and given the numbers and ability, they'd try their damnedest to do exactly what ISIS is doing. However, those bunches of lunatics have not (yet) hijacked an entire religion and have not had about a millenia of control of the same. In the Middle East, the nutjob Islamic equivalents of Westboro Baptist/WCC have been calling the shots, and killing their opposition, for over a thousand years and they control the entire belief system.
Therein lie very important differences. Deal with the nutcases in control first and worry about the nutcases on the fringe later.
Last edited by 4ager; 11/19/15.
Originally Posted by Mannlicher
America needs to understand that our troops are not 'disposable'. Each represents a family; Fathers, Mothers, Sons, Daughters, Cousins, Uncles, Aunts... Our Citizens are our most valuable treasure; we waste far too many.
I'm trying to come to grips with the Muslim mentality as well
I was thinking this morning - what religion has people believing they should blow themselves up taking out as many people as possible in the process
and I'm trying to differentiate that from peaceful Muslims who believe that Muslims cannot kill innocents.
But then I think about Christianity - and blowing up abortion clinics , killing abortion doctors, protesting at funerals of soldiers - and no one within Christianity (or outside for the most part) believes that all of Christianity should be lumped in with these extremists.
That said, it makes no sense whatsoever to increase your chances of a domestic terrorist attack by allowing thousands of muslims who really have no desire to assimilate and are only escaping war to relocate in your country.
You should not even hint at any equivalence between the two religions if you want to make an accurate and even handed statement. And I don't think you meant to.
But the numbers of these "Christians" who did these outrageous things is infinitesimally small compared to the jihadists, and the number of abortion doctors murdered is even at a greater disparity with the number of people worldwide that radical Islamists have murdered.
Nor do Christians circumcise, suppress, and stone women, rape little boys as a part of their culture, and follow a book that condones a totalitarian caliphate under Shar'ia law. In fact Christians founded the first hospitals, promoted higher education, and raised women from third class citizens, from some place just behind goats.
To your final point, the incidents in Paris show that a terrorist can and will come in as a refugee and this president has done nothing,..nothing, over the last seven years to make one think they could believe him when he says they will be adequately screened.
I think James Buchanaan is finally relieved in his grave...as he has been supplanted as this nation's worst president. This guy can't even act presidential.
the whole point was that there are extremists in both religions who warp the teachings of their religion to fit a purpose.
if the point you want to make is that muslims on the whole are buying into the ideas that are expressed by the radicals, so be it. That is a discussion that is on point.
There is no equivalence in my statement - I'm trying to point out that Christians don't claim extremists who say they are acting on Christian beliefs and I'm trying to gather if Muslims on the whole reject extremists who say they are acting on Muslim beliefs.
I realize now some people have the ability to comprehend that
others don't.
The problem with your moral equivalitist post is the compaction of time to fit within that narrow and misguided scope.
Yes, the Westboro Baptist and World Church of the Creator type bunches are as close to a Christian ISIS as we have right now and given the numbers and ability, they'd try their damnedest to do exactly what ISIS is doing. However, those bunches of lunatics have not (yet) hijacked an entire religion and have not had about a millenia of control of the same. In the Middle East, the nutjob Islamic equivalents of Westboro Baptist/WCC have been calling the shots, and killing their opposition, for over a thousand years and they control the entire belief system.
Therein lie very important differences. Deal with the nutcases in control first and worry about the nutcases on the fringe later.
I have no use whatsoever for the Westies, but they have NEVER set off a bomb, shot anybody or beheaded somebody. They are mainly just attention-whores who love to play the victim. They have never displayed any tendencies towards physical violence at all that I'm aware of.
I'm trying to come to grips with the Muslim mentality as well
I was thinking this morning - what religion has people believing they should blow themselves up taking out as many people as possible in the process
and I'm trying to differentiate that from peaceful Muslims who believe that Muslims cannot kill innocents.
But then I think about Christianity - and blowing up abortion clinics , killing abortion doctors, protesting at funerals of soldiers - and no one within Christianity (or outside for the most part) believes that all of Christianity should be lumped in with these extremists.
That said, it makes no sense whatsoever to increase your chances of a domestic terrorist attack by allowing thousands of muslims who really have no desire to assimilate and are only escaping war to relocate in your country.
You should not even hint at any equivalence between the two religions if you want to make an accurate and even handed statement. And I don't think you meant to.
But the numbers of these "Christians" who did these outrageous things is infinitesimally small compared to the jihadists, and the number of abortion doctors murdered is even at a greater disparity with the number of people worldwide that radical Islamists have murdered.
Nor do Christians circumcise, suppress, and stone women, rape little boys as a part of their culture, and follow a book that condones a totalitarian caliphate under Shar'ia law. In fact Christians founded the first hospitals, promoted higher education, and raised women from third class citizens, from some place just behind goats.
To your final point, the incidents in Paris show that a terrorist can and will come in as a refugee and this president has done nothing,..nothing, over the last seven years to make one think they could believe him when he says they will be adequately screened.
I think James Buchanaan is finally relieved in his grave...as he has been supplanted as this nation's worst president. This guy can't even act presidential.
the whole point was that there are extremists in both religions who warp the teachings of their religion to fit a purpose.
if the point you want to make is that muslims on the whole are buying into the ideas that are expressed by the radicals, so be it. That is a discussion that is on point.
There is no equivalence in my statement - I'm trying to point out that Christians don't claim extremists who say they are acting on Christian beliefs and I'm trying to gather if Muslims on the whole reject extremists who say they are acting on Muslim beliefs.
I realize now some people have the ability to comprehend that
others don't.
The problem with your moral equivalitist post is the compaction of time to fit within that narrow and misguided scope.
Yes, the Westboro Baptist and World Church of the Creator type bunches are as close to a Christian ISIS as we have right now and given the numbers and ability, they'd try their damnedest to do exactly what ISIS is doing. However, those bunches of lunatics have not (yet) hijacked an entire religion and have not had about a millenia of control of the same. In the Middle East, the nutjob Islamic equivalents of Westboro Baptist/WCC have been calling the shots, and killing their opposition, for over a thousand years and they control the entire belief system.
Therein lie very important differences. Deal with the nutcases in control first and worry about the nutcases on the fringe later.
I have no use whatsoever for the Westies, but they have NEVER set off a bomb, shot anybody or beheaded somebody. They are mainly just attention-whores who love to play the victim. They have never displayed any tendencies towards physical violence at all that I'm aware of.
Truth
We may know the time Ben Carson lied, but does anyone know the time Hillary Clinton told the truth?
Immersing oneself in progressive lieberalism is no different than bathing in the sewage of Hell.
Rather amazing that some choose to pick out a nit, ignoring the entire post, rather than contemplate the fullness of what was said.
So fast to rush to the defense of any perceived slight to anything "christian" as to go RIGHT past the point and the crux. Carry on.
Originally Posted by Mannlicher
America needs to understand that our troops are not 'disposable'. Each represents a family; Fathers, Mothers, Sons, Daughters, Cousins, Uncles, Aunts... Our Citizens are our most valuable treasure; we waste far too many.
the whole point was that there are extremists in both religions who warp the teachings of their religion to fit a purpose
A Christian extremist is one who turns the other cheek if struck. an extremist Christian is one who loves even his enemies. An extremist Muslim is one who will go out of his way to strike someone. An extremist Muslim is one who makes enemies and hates them before he makes them enemies.
"Only Christ is the fullness of God's revelation." Everyday Hunter
I'm trying to come to grips with the Muslim mentality as well
I was thinking this morning - what religion has people believing they should blow themselves up taking out as many people as possible in the process
and I'm trying to differentiate that from peaceful Muslims who believe that Muslims cannot kill innocents.
But then I think about Christianity - and blowing up abortion clinics , killing abortion doctors, protesting at funerals of soldiers - and no one within Christianity (or outside for the most part) believes that all of Christianity should be lumped in with these extremists.
That said, it makes no sense whatsoever to increase your chances of a domestic terrorist attack by allowing thousands of muslims who really have no desire to assimilate and are only escaping war to relocate in your country.
You should not even hint at any equivalence between the two religions if you want to make an accurate and even handed statement. And I don't think you meant to.
But the numbers of these "Christians" who did these outrageous things is infinitesimally small compared to the jihadists, and the number of abortion doctors murdered is even at a greater disparity with the number of people worldwide that radical Islamists have murdered.
Nor do Christians circumcise, suppress, and stone women, rape little boys as a part of their culture, and follow a book that condones a totalitarian caliphate under Shar'ia law. In fact Christians founded the first hospitals, promoted higher education, and raised women from third class citizens, from some place just behind goats.
To your final point, the incidents in Paris show that a terrorist can and will come in as a refugee and this president has done nothing,..nothing, over the last seven years to make one think they could believe him when he says they will be adequately screened.
I think James Buchanaan is finally relieved in his grave...as he has been supplanted as this nation's worst president. This guy can't even act presidential.
There is no equivalence in my statement - I'm trying to point out that Christians don't claim extremists who say they are acting on Christian beliefs and I'm trying to gather if Muslims on the whole reject extremists who say they are acting on Muslim beliefs.
Look at it this way. I think the culture has pretty much turned into a sewer. Say I go off my rocker and decide to get all my Christian buddies together and kill all the abortionists, atheists, secularists, rappers, crappers, liberals, and all other various and sundry ne'er do wells and establish a Christian theocracy where we "do things God's way". I have a problem. I CANNOT point to chapter and verse in the teachings of Jesus Christ while I try and raise my army. He pretty much taught the exact opposite of what I want to do. Most of my potential recruits can read. I either wind up in jail or marginalized like Westboro.
If I am a mythical "moderate Muslim" who wants my people to get along with the rest of the world I AM THE ONE WITH THE PROBLEM! The so called "radicals" are the ones who can get a Koran and point chapter and verse to support what THEY are doing and are likely to tell me to get with the program if I want to keep my head. My personal opinion is that "moderate muslims " are either scared, sympathetic to the radicals, or hamstrung by their own doctrine which supports the "radicals" whom I prefer to call "orthodox". I view them as a typical American Christian Sunday morning pew sitter. They don't have the depth of faith to live like Mother Theresa but they sure think she was a swell gal. Do the people in Mosques all over the country view Bin Laden that way? Good chance of it IMO, otherwise they would not be in a Mosque.
"Men must be governed by God or they will be ruled by tyrants". --- William Penn
Rather amazing that some choose to pick out a nit, ignoring the entire post, rather than contemplate the fullness of what was said.
So fast to rush to the defense of any perceived slight to anything "christian" as to go RIGHT past the point and the crux. Carry on.
You chose to post an inaccurate comparison. Half of your post was right, talking about Abortion Clinic Bombers. The other half is a totally inaccurate because you're comparing violent, suicidal terrorists to people who are basically so non-violent that they are pacifistic. They hate homosexuals no doubt, but they are not violent and violence here is the key. Sorry if you think it is picking nits. The Westies are a convenient foil because they are roundly hated due to their wanton disrespect of our service persons. That's your right, but don't be like the other side and spread inaccuracies or untruths. I know where the Westies are at, have been by their compound, etc. I have posted many times on here that almost their whole game consists of getting others to attack them, hopefully physically, so they can be martyrs and get press. Muslims don't just hate people, talk about people or even just talk about hurting or killing them. They kill them in the most violent manner possible in order to cow others and create the most press. Both the Westies and the Muslims seek publicity to further their aims. In a sense, they go about it exactly the opposite of one another. The Westies use words which can be combated with words. Islam uses extreme violence which can only effectually be combated with the same.
Rather amazing that some choose to pick out a nit, ignoring the entire post, rather than contemplate the fullness of what was said.
So fast to rush to the defense of any perceived slight to anything "christian" as to go RIGHT past the point and the crux. Carry on.
You chose to post an inaccurate comparison. Half of your post was right, talking about Abortion Clinic Bombers. The other half is a totally inaccurate because you're comparing violent, suicidal terrorists to people who are basically so non-violent that they are pacifistic. They hate homosexuals no doubt, but they are not violent and violence here is the key. Sorry if you think it is picking nits. The Westies are a convenient foil because they are roundly hated due to their wanton disrespect of our service persons. That's your right, but don't be like the other side and spread inaccuracies or untruths. I know where the Westies are at, have been by their compound, etc. I have posted many times on here that almost their whole game consists of getting others to attack them, hopefully physically, so they can be martyrs and get press. Muslims don't just hate people, talk about people or even just talk about hurting or killing them. They kill them in the most violent manner possible in order to cow others and create the most press. Both the Westies and the Muslims seek publicity to further their aims. In a sense, they go about it exactly the opposite of one another. The Westies use words which can be combated with words. Islam uses extreme violence which can only effectually be combated with the same.
You're wanting to pick yet another meaningless fight, finding some implied insult where there is none, avoiding the totality of the message because you choose to do so. I have no interest in that. Carry on.
Originally Posted by Mannlicher
America needs to understand that our troops are not 'disposable'. Each represents a family; Fathers, Mothers, Sons, Daughters, Cousins, Uncles, Aunts... Our Citizens are our most valuable treasure; we waste far too many.
Rather amazing that some choose to pick out a nit, ignoring the entire post, rather than contemplate the fullness of what was said.
So fast to rush to the defense of any perceived slight to anything "christian" as to go RIGHT past the point and the crux. Carry on.
You chose to post an inaccurate comparison. Half of your post was right, talking about Abortion Clinic Bombers. The other half is a totally inaccurate because you're comparing violent, suicidal terrorists to people who are basically so non-violent that they are pacifistic. They hate homosexuals no doubt, but they are not violent and violence here is the key. Sorry if you think it is picking nits. The Westies are a convenient foil because they are roundly hated due to their wanton disrespect of our service persons. That's your right, but don't be like the other side and spread inaccuracies or untruths. I know where the Westies are at, have been by their compound, etc. I have posted many times on here that almost their whole game consists of getting others to attack them, hopefully physically, so they can be martyrs and get press. Muslims don't just hate people, talk about people or even just talk about hurting or killing them. They kill them in the most violent manner possible in order to cow others and create the most press. Both the Westies and the Muslims seek publicity to further their aims. In a sense, they go about it exactly the opposite of one another. The Westies use words which can be combated with words. Islam uses extreme violence which can only effectually be combated with the same.
You're wanting to pick yet another meaningless fight, finding some implied insult where there is none, avoiding the totality of the message because you choose to do so. I have no interest in that. Carry on.
I'm not picking a fight and I saw no insult either implied or outright, other than the implication that I and another poster were "picking nits". You demand absolute accuracy on threads such as the Rancher one, with no "speculation". I'm not fighting, just clarifying.
the whole point was that there are extremists in both religions who warp the teachings of their religion to fit a purpose
A Christian extremist is one who turns the other cheek if struck. an extremist Christian is one who loves even his enemies. An extremist Muslim is one who will go out of his way to strike someone. An extremist Muslim is one who makes enemies and hates them before he makes them enemies.
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