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Joined: Feb 2001
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Campfire Tracker
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OP
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 3,008 |
anyone played with this cartridge much ?
looks like you could duplicate the 357 Sig or short barreled 357 sixgun without much trouble....and in a 1911 package
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 24,667
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 24,667 |
A 125 grain .38 Super will get you right about 1350 fps, which is downright respectable. It's my favorite cartridge in a 1911.
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 23,453
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 23,453 |
anyone played with this cartridge much ?
looks like you could duplicate the 357 Sig or short barreled 357 sixgun without much trouble....and in a 1911 package
The .38Super was designed to get close to .357 Magnum ballistics in a 1911 platform. It does just that. The .357SIG was designed to duplicate the Super, but in a double-stack semi-auto. It does just that.
America needs to understand that our troops are not 'disposable'. Each represents a family; Fathers, Mothers, Sons, Daughters, Cousins, Uncles, Aunts... Our Citizens are our most valuable treasure; we waste far too many.
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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 4,293
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 4,293 |
Never shot the sig or super.
Does either handle better in the 1911 format versus a 4" 357 magnum revolver?
Trump HAD the World, ", Trump saw our children, "
Trump saw a way to make a brighter day so he started giving
There was a choice he was making, he was saving our own lives
Its true he made a brighter day for you and me. --Trump WINS 2016
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Joined: Jul 2011
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 23,453 |
Never shot the sig or super.
Does either handle better in the 1911 format versus a 4" 357 magnum revolver? The Super is for 1911s, the SIG for double-stack .40S&W sized frames (think SIGs, Glocks, etc.). As for handling; it's all in what handles better for you. The SIG matches the Super and nearly the Magnum with 125s. It doesn't handle heavier well at all due to case geometry. The Supers can go heavier than 125 and hang back of the Magnum while doing it (though not far back at all).
America needs to understand that our troops are not 'disposable'. Each represents a family; Fathers, Mothers, Sons, Daughters, Cousins, Uncles, Aunts... Our Citizens are our most valuable treasure; we waste far too many.
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Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 15,867 Likes: 6
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 15,867 Likes: 6 |
RJM is our resident Super expert. I do not personally know anyone who is as well versed in all things Super, than Bob.
I think he is deer hunting, though he may be along before long.
THE CHAIR IS AGAINST THE WALL. The Tikka T3 in .308 Winchester is the Glock 19 of the rifle world. The website is up and running!www.lostriverammocompany.com
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 21,958
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 21,958 |
Friend just used one saturday on a little doe.
He has a EAA Witness that shoots very well and it gets fed either 125 lbt trunc cones or the 124 Remington Golden Sabers used on the deer in bulk.
With a supported chamber and mouth headspace, it does very well for a 9mm..
He really wants a Performance Center wheelie..
Its really a cartridge shrouded in the confusion of the 38 Auto.
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,244
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,244 |
The Super will match the .357 SIG (or pass it) with lighter bullets and surpass it with heavier bullets. Mine is in a 1911, and it's pretty much taken the place of my .357 revolvers for an outdoor carry gun; especially when I don't care about losing brass in the weeds and brush. I've also found it's an easy round to reload with good results.
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Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 1,438
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 1,438 |
HawkI - Like you I really dote on the .38Super. Have had several over the years. To me it's a well designed LEO "tool", going back to the 20's/30's, to shoot thru car doors, body armor etc.
Question for you folks - what is the difference between the .38Super and the 9x23mm ? Velocity, pressure??
Homesteader
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 22,274
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 22,274 |
The Super actually pre-dates the .357 Magnum by a few years, the latter arriving in 1934. It was a higher pressure version of the .38 Auto Colt, which arrived about 1902 (IIRC).
The ultimate performance potential really depends on whether or not you have a ramped barrel. Without it (like late model Colts) I'd probably stop at 1350 fps with 124's. With a ramped barrel (like Kimbers) you can go somewhat higher, but I have never pushed one hard. Brian Pearce published some loads out of a Kimber a couple years ago, which were pretty warm.
I have a lwt Commander in the caliber, and it is very satisfactory. But it can be hard to find good ammo for it. But I did score a bunch of brass and 124gr Gold Dots, so I am set.
A strong .357 Magnum revolver will drive 158's as fast as the Super, 9x23, and .357 Sig will drive 125's.
"...the designer of the .270 Ingwe cartridge!..."
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Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 7,920
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 7,920 |
If you can not deal with reality, reality will deal with you....
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 25,933 Likes: 6
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 25,933 Likes: 6 |
My buddy had a Witness in 38 Super. It shot superbly. We purchased about 500 rounds of cheap factory ammo and reloaded the brass for years.
A 38 super would be my 2'nd choice if I were purchasing a semi-auto. Just behind the 10 mm.
People who choose to brew up their own storms bitch loudest about the rain.
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Joined: May 2011
Posts: 56,319 Likes: 9
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 56,319 Likes: 9 |
_______________________________________________________
An 8 dollar driveway boy living in a T-111 shack
LOL
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 39,139 Likes: 24
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 39,139 Likes: 24 |
Ruger Commander in 38 Super would be DAMNED hard to ignore.
CC balance be damned.
Me
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Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 7,920
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 7,920 |
HawkI - Like you I really dote on the .38Super. Have had several over the years. To me it's a well designed LEO "tool", going back to the 20's/30's, to shoot thru car doors, body armor etc.
Question for you folks - what is the difference between the .38Super and the 9x23mm ? Velocity, pressure??
Homesteader 9x23 vs. .38 Super Factory velocity: 9x23 125 Silvertip: 1440 9x23 125 Softpoint: 1460 .38 Super 124 (Corbon, Georgia Arms, Buffalo Bore): 1350 .38 Super 115 (CorBon, Buffalo Bore): 1450 .38 Super 125 Winchester Silvertip: 1250 .38 Super 130 Ball from most manufacturers: 1150-1225 SAMMI Pressure: 9x23: 55K psi .38 Super: 35K psi 9x23 is a tapered case. The head is the same size as a 9mm. Winchester brass is the only true 9x23 as the Starline is much thinner in the head. Winchester brass is ok to use in an unsupported chamber. Factory rounds using Starline brass should not be reloaded if fired in an unsupported chamber type barrel. Winchester brass can take a Hornady 147 as it is a boat tail design. Most bullets over 130 grains will bulge the case. Heavier bullets can be loaded in Starline brass but not to the pressure limits Winchester brass can be. .38 Super is a straight walled case. Bullets from 88-180 grains can be loaded. Very versatile and easy to load. Depending on the chamber dimensions 9x23 can be fired from a .38 Super with no more modification than a heavier recoil spring. For long term use a square bottom firing pin stop should be installed to further retard initial slide opening. At 55K psi, slide velocity has to be seen to be appreciated. Winchester factory rounds land 20+' from the gun if not properly set up. There are several great articles out there from Layne Simpson on the 9x23... Bob
If you can not deal with reality, reality will deal with you....
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Joined: May 2011
Posts: 56,319 Likes: 9
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 56,319 Likes: 9 |
HawkI - Like you I really dote on the .38Super. Have had several over the years. To me it's a well designed LEO "tool", going back to the 20's/30's, to shoot thru car doors, body armor etc.
Question for you folks - what is the difference between the .38Super and the 9x23mm ? Velocity, pressure??
Homesteader 9x23 vs. .38 Super Factory velocity: 9x23 125 Silvertip: 1440 9x23 125 Softpoint: 1460 .38 Super 124 (Corbon, Georgia Arms, Buffalo Bore): 1350 .38 Super 115 (CorBon, Buffalo Bore): 1450 .38 Super 125 Winchester Silvertip: 1250 .38 Super 130 Ball from most manufacturers: 1150-1225 SAMMI Pressure: 9x23: 55K psi .38 Super: 35K psi 9x23 is a tapered case. The head is the same size as a 9mm. Winchester brass is the only true 9x23 as the Starline is much thinner in the head. Winchester brass is ok to use in an unsupported chamber. Factory rounds using Starline brass should not be reloaded if fired in an unsupported chamber type barrel. Winchester brass can take a Hornady 147 as it is a boat tail design. Most bullets over 130 grains will bulge the case. Heavier bullets can be loaded in Starline brass but not to the pressure limits Winchester brass can be. .38 Super is a straight walled case. Bullets from 88-180 grains can be loaded. Very versatile and easy to load. Depending on the chamber dimensions 9x23 can be fired from a .38 Super with no more modification than a heavier recoil spring. For long term use a square bottom firing pin stop should be installed to further retard initial slide opening. At 55K psi, slide velocity has to be seen to be appreciated. Winchester factory rounds land 20+' from the gun if not properly set up. There are several great articles out there from Layne Simpson on the 9x23... Bob Thank you for sharing your knowledge.
_______________________________________________________
An 8 dollar driveway boy living in a T-111 shack
LOL
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Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 7,920
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 7,920 |
U R quite welcome...and that is a VERY nice Super you have...Swenson was one of the early maters....
Bob
If you can not deal with reality, reality will deal with you....
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 1,792
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 1,792 |
Starline Supercomp brass in 38 Super is the best I,ve
found. Price seems right and is very strong. Barstow
barrel solved several problems with my Combat Commander.
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 22,274
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 22,274 |
a new production lwt Commander ![[Linked Image]](http://i712.photobucket.com/albums/ww127/tex_n_cal/DSC_0223_zps8y8gl0ex.jpg)
"...the designer of the .270 Ingwe cartridge!..."
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 21,697 Likes: 1
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 21,697 Likes: 1 |
For reasons unbeknownst to me, I covet those TALO commanders chambered for the Super 38 cartridge.
One of these days, I will own one.
"The number one problem with America is, a whole lot of people need shot, and nobody is shooting them."
-Master Chief Hershel Davis
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![[Linked Image]](http://s1186.photobucket.com/user/Weather223/media/38Super004_zps4d6c5b20.jpg.html)
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