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Joined: Nov 2007
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2007
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Why didn't they put this tip on the A-max first?
It's called the ELD-Match. That really doesn't answer the question though... And it's a good one. If they're saying that the polymer used in match bullets is melting then wouldn't they replace that component in their tipped match bullets at least simultaneously with the release of this new one? The new one has an interlock ring which means nothing for REAL match shooting, and the BCs are lower than comparable AMs which tells me the ELD-Match has that word in its name for the crowd who likes shooting target bullets at animals long range. Seems like a narrow crowd to support a whole new line, but who knows.
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 496
Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 496 |
Why didn't they put this tip on the A-max first?
It's called the ELD-Match. That really doesn't answer the question though... And it's a good one. If they're saying that the polymer used in match bullets is melting then wouldn't they replace that component in their tipped match bullets at least simultaneously with the release of this new one? The new one has an interlock ring which means nothing for REAL match shooting, and the BCs are lower than comparable AMs which tells me the ELD-Match has that word in its name for the crowd who likes shooting target bullets at animals long range. Seems like a narrow crowd to support a whole new line, but who knows. I must be missing something....it appears that the ELD-Match beats the AMax BC in every caliber offered...minor differences, but it appears to be an AMax with a new tip. In case it isn't clear: Hornady introduced 2 new bullet lines. The ELD-Match and the ELD-X....the X is the 'hunting' line with lower BC and interlok. The Match is basically an AMax with new tip.
Last edited by djp; 12/30/15. Reason: extra-special info.
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 29,628
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 29,628 |
Oh pardon me; I wasn't clear on the fact that match & hunting were different.
Thanks for that clarification!
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Joined: Apr 2010
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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The guys at gunwerks helped develop and test these bullets. The have taken a number of animals and most were longer ranges. The kills I have seen were pretty DRT and clean. I'm waiting for Bryan litz to test the bc of them and see what real numbers are. The 143gr 6.5 seems to be a great bullet and I'd like to try them once my new build is done.
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Joined: Dec 2009
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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Why is it that those who don't kill at long range are concerned about bullets designed for killing at long range, and worried because they expand rapidly at close range?
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Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 2,556
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Jul 2014
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These are going to be fine, as long as the shots are long. I think that for the average guy, they will be the same as an SST-very frangible. They tried to say that the SST is an interlock. That is pure crap. I have shot tons of Interlocks, and the SST cannot hang with them for performance on game at reasonable ranges. I think that polymer tip is great, but I believe that it has a lot to do with the destructive expansion, also.
You did not "seen" anything, you "saw" it.
A "creek" has water in it, a "crick" is what you get in your neck.
Liberals with guns are nothing but hypocrites.
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Joined: Aug 2006
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2006
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same reason they bish about FFP scopes on a hunting rifle?
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 33,694
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 33,694 |
I gotta laugh. I don't know if bullet manufacturers have us chasing our tails each claiming one bullet over another to ad nauseam, or if they're just incompetent.
It seems like the Hornady GMX would be a viable competitor to the Barnes ttsx, BUT, they can't figure out how to make it open up at long range. Why? The SST blows up. Again, why? ELD-X with and without a tip that does or doesn't melt, Holy Cow! The this the that to infinity, and beyond!
Why not make the perfect bullet, and stop production of all others? 100% weight retention, perfect full expansion at any reasonable velocity through any material likely encountered. Hint- tapered jacketed mono-metal with expansion initiating plastic tip!
Oh yeah, opinions sell bullets.
A jacketed mono-metal. That's the ticket.
Conduct is the best proof of character.
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Joined: May 2012
Posts: 1,705
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Campfire Regular
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So much obsession it seems about retained weight and small wound channels.
I've found in 10 000 plus head of game culled, that softer bullets kill way more quickly than hard ones.
I've used so many SSTs, Sierra GKs and various hollowpoints on game and though sometimes there is a LOT of meat damage, I'd rather see a dead animal with a huge exit wound than try to find the bloody thing in the scrub.
Aren't they designed to expand?
I'll be keen to use the ELDX.
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Joined: Jul 2014
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Jul 2014
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So much obsession it seems about retained weight and small wound channels.
I've found in 10 000 plus head of game culled, that softer bullets kill way more quickly than hard ones.
I've used so many SSTs, Sierra GKs and various hollowpoints on game and though sometimes there is a LOT of meat damage, I'd rather see a dead animal with a huge exit wound than try to find the bloody thing in the scrub.
Aren't they designed to expand?
I'll be keen to use the ELDX. True, unless they expand rapidly and don't penetrate well. That can lead to a bad follow-up or a lost animal. I, personally, don't want a bullet to dynamite.
You did not "seen" anything, you "saw" it.
A "creek" has water in it, a "crick" is what you get in your neck.
Liberals with guns are nothing but hypocrites.
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 35,900
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 35,900 |
Why is it that those who don't kill at long range are concerned about bullets designed for killing at long range, and worried because they expand rapidly at close range? I've scratched my head trying to figure that one out for a long time now.
The 280 Remington is overbore.
The 7 Rem Mag is over bore.
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 22,735
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 22,735 |
Why is it that those who don't kill at long range are concerned about bullets designed for killing at long range, and worried because they expand rapidly at close range? I've scratched my head trying to figure that one out for a long time now. Probably they are concerned over too much expansion and the loss of blood shot meat at short range. My read of the ELD-X is that they will perform very well at both ranges. End of anyones concern.
My home is the "sanctuary residence" for my firearms.
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 22,735
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 22,735 |
The summation in the NRA read shows how real science works. The Doppler data and graph showed something they didn't expect. So they revised their hypothesis and raised the melting point of the tip from 475* to something over 700*. Also the continuous data provided by the Doppler readout gave them real time data over the distance of the shot - something that hasn't been done, according to the author.
My home is the "sanctuary residence" for my firearms.
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Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 4,571
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Feb 2001
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Why is it that those who don't kill at long range are concerned about bullets designed for killing at long range, and worried because they expand rapidly at close range? I've scratched my head trying to figure that one out for a long time now. For the same reason fly-fishermen worry about whether there's a barb on the single-hook of my #1 Mepps....
You better pray to the God of Skinny Punks that this wind doesn't pick up......
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Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 2,259
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Aug 2008
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I'm waiting for Bryan litz to test the bc of them and see what real numbers are. The 143gr 6.5 seems to be a great bullet and I'd like to try them once my new build is done. Hornady is using Doppler radar. How would Litz obtain more accurate info with his system of acoustic sensors?
RLTW
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Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 4,278
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 4,278 |
Why is it that those who don't kill at long range are concerned about bullets designed for killing at long range, and worried because they expand rapidly at close range? I've scratched my head trying to figure that one out for a long time now. Probably they are concerned over too much expansion and the loss of blood shot meat at short range. My read of the ELD-X is that they will perform very well at both ranges. End of anyones concern. Exactly. Could care less about ruining meat...shoulder meat sucks anyway. I do care about a bullet blowing up on a shoulder and a rodeo to recover a elk running away on three legs. Had some of that this year. lefty C
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Joined: May 2011
Posts: 56,285
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 56,285 |
I gotta laugh. I don't know if bullet manufacturers have us chasing our tails each claiming one bullet over another to ad nauseam, or if they're just incompetent.
It seems like the Hornady GMX would be a viable competitor to the Barnes ttsx, BUT, they can't figure out how to make it open up at long range. Why? The SST blows up. Again, why? ELD-X with and without a tip that does or doesn't melt, Holy Cow! The this the that to infinity, and beyond!
Why not make the perfect bullet, and stop production of all others? 100% weight retention, perfect full expansion at any reasonable velocity through any material likely encountered. Hint- tapered jacketed mono-metal with expansion initiating plastic tip!
Oh yeah, opinions sell bullets.
A jacketed mono-metal. That's the ticket. Thinking about Hornady's advertising and using the jacket material instead of solid copper. Brainfart. Good catch.
_______________________________________________________
An 8 dollar driveway boy living in a T-111 shack
LOL
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 35,900
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 35,900 |
Why is it that those who don't kill at long range are concerned about bullets designed for killing at long range, and worried because they expand rapidly at close range? I've scratched my head trying to figure that one out for a long time now. Probably they are concerned over too much expansion and the loss of blood shot meat at short range. My read of the ELD-X is that they will perform very well at both ranges. End of anyones concern. Exactly. Could care less about ruining meat...shoulder meat sucks anyway. I do care about a bullet blowing up on a shoulder and a rodeo to recover a elk running away on three legs. Had some of that this year. lefty C Lefty: What happened?
The 280 Remington is overbore.
The 7 Rem Mag is over bore.
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 35,900
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 35,900 |
Why is it that those who don't kill at long range are concerned about bullets designed for killing at long range, and worried because they expand rapidly at close range? I've scratched my head trying to figure that one out for a long time now. For the same reason fly-fishermen worry about whether there's a barb on the single-hook of my #1 Mepps.... Mmmm.....not quite. I'm sure no one really cares what you use. That's up to you.  Wondering about it...and caring....are two entirely different things.
Last edited by BobinNH; 01/02/16.
The 280 Remington is overbore.
The 7 Rem Mag is over bore.
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