Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Custom Rifles & Wildcats A potential new 7mm wildcat round?

As if the world needs another 7mm magnum round, but that said...

Many here and elsewhere have criticized the 28 Nosler round for its short neck (0.274"). I voiced the same criticism to the Nosler reps while at the SHOT Show a couple of years ago without much effect.



The body of the 28 Nosler case is 2.166" long to the shoulder junction. While glancing through the Nosler #8 reloading manual, I noticed that the new 30 Nosler's body is significantly shorter to the shoulder - 2.115". This got me to thinking...once 30 Nosler dies become available, passing 28 Nosler brass through a FL 30 Nosler sizing die (with the expander ball removed) would push the shoulder back 0.051". This should result in a 0.051" longer neck; i.e. 0.325".

And what about sizing the bottom part of the neck that remains 30 caliber? The 7mm WSM case has a 35 degree shoulder and a diameter of 0.528" at the body-shoulder junction - both identical to that of the 30 Nosler. It's possible that a 7mm WSM neck sizing die, especially a bushing die, could be used to complete sizing all of the neck down to 7mm.

Thoughts?

You could just trim .05 off the bottom of a 28 Nosler die.
Then have the smith go .05 shallow on the go headspace gage.
Actually not a bad idea.

dave

Dave,

That's true, good point.

I've had a serious hankering for a Mashburn, but this round eventually would have the benefit of readily available dies. And for those that it bothers, no belt.

A Redding Type S FL 30 Nosler bushing die would be another option for case forming. With the appropriate bushing, this should size the entire neck to close to the final dimensions. The same die could also likely be used as a body die with the bushing removed.

One option would be to use slightly larger than .308"-sized bushings in the 30 Nosler FL die. Then, as dave7mm pointed out, a shaved 28 Nosler Type S neck sizing die could be used to finish sizing the neck. This would also clean up the small part of the shoulder that might be missed by the 30 Nosler die.

As the 30 Nosler is a SAAMI round, a variety of dies from all of the major manufacturers will eventually become available, including bushing dies - no need to wait for custom dies or to pay their cost, and there will be many different options available for forming and resizing the cases. This is what makes this wildcat appealing.

Gasman,
The Nosler case is interesting for sure.But if you have a hankering for a Mashburn.
DO the Mashburn.
Redding has the Mashburn dies in stock or at least they did the last time I talked to them.Because of there order back log it took 3 months for them to ship them to me. ..They were on the shelf..so the dies can be had.
Thank Bob for that..
Like I said the Nosler case is interesting but I dont like the price.In the Mashburn I can run any 300 WM case from just about anyone, and get by just fine.
I like the 30 degree shoulder of the and the long neck of the Mashburn.
My Mashburn has been stunning for accuracy for a 8.5 pounder.
Running H1000 and 168g Berger classic hunting bullets.A little explosive for me.But dead is dead..
Art Mashburn got it right.
The first time.

dave

Dave,

All very good points and well taken. Now that Redding is reportedly producing Type S dies for the Mashburn, the round is becoming even more attractive, and it's likely that I'll end up building one.

Just to play the devil's advocate, though, I'm already paying $1.90 apiece for Norma 300 WSM brass (I've been less than satisfied at times with Winchester WSM brass), so the jump to paying for 28 Nosler brass isn't all that great. Also, Winchester 300 WM brass isn't easy to find at times; Midway is out of stock and lists it as "limited production" now. A quick search on gunbot only shows PRVI, Hornady, and Norma 300 WM brass being currently available.

A question (actually, I guess two) for you - what seater dies are there available for the Mashburn, and which one are you using?

7 Dakota??

Gasman
My dies are Redding s bushing sizing and the standard seater.I used Nosler cases.Excellent cases by the way.
I hope once the raghead is out of office.A person will be able to get brass again.
In the beginning I got ahold of a bunch of someones 300 Win cull brass and I had issues.Once I switched over to the Nosler Brass, was very happy.
My Barrel is a 1-10 twist so im limited.SO if you build run something a bit faster.
rcamuglia set up a Mashburn to run the 195g Berger.
If I was to do another id make sure to I could run the heavy stuff.
A good read for you.
http://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/10704338/1
Mashburn is the way to fly.
You would be stunned if the saw the groups mine shot at 400 yards.

dave

Gasman: Sgt. Beretz on here is using Hornady 300 Win Mag cases to form Mashburn cases for his rifle. No issues,and his charge weights/velocities are exactly like what I worked up in WW brass. I have 100 Hornady cases here, but am still using my supply of WW brass. Another friend is using Norma.

When I get around to it I intend to grab some RWS 300 Win Mag cases as well and try those. I'm told they are excellent,but expensive.

Dies are no problem unless you have to wait a bit for them;no big deal really.RCBS also makes them.


Someone mentioned 7mm Dakota. All I can say is "sure". Same/same. But I sold a nice custom 7mm Dakota and moved on to the Mashburn. Not only was the brass expensive but the stuff was splitting on me around the shoulder/body junction on second firing.Never had that happen with anything else in decades of hand loading.

Plus the head size is different and you can't really make it from any thing else,unless someone knows something I don't. So I was locked into one source of cases. As we can see I have more brass options with the Mashburn. Few magnum capacity cases are as ubiquitous as 300 Winchester Magnum cases.It's just easier.

No more boutique/one source of brass for me.With the Mashburn i can make what I need when I want and they can shove their seasonal runs where the sun don't shine.

It's nuts today. You have to watch what you build.

Good luck whatever path you take

dave7mm and BobinNH,

Thanks a lot for your input - it's very much appreciated. At this point in time, it looks like the Mashburn would indeed be the more practical route. If the Nosler rounds take off in the future and other manufacturers take up production of the brass, this wildcat may be worth examining again.

A couple of loose ends:

Dave - you're using a standard Redding seating die for the 7mm Mashburn, correct?

Bob - I thought I'd read somewhere that someone was having issues using RWS 300 WM brass with a 7mm wildcat (7mm Practical? 7mm Rogue?). Have you heard anything similar?

Gasman no I have not heard anything about RWS brass except that it's very good.

I have never used RWS brass before in any caliber and don't have any right now.

Yep, I bought the 2 die set.
dave

I'm sorry, but devil's advocate here; is this not the same complaint as there was with the 300 Win Mag? The same .300 Win Mag that many have very reliably used with incredible precision?

Neck length between the two seem relitivy close in reason based on ratio. The neck serves to aligned the initial starting path of the bullet, and for neck tension, correct? Then I would declare if the brass quality is reasonable, and your preparation and sizing methods aren't wonky you'll do just fine as it is.

A lot of people favor a neck length that is significantly greater than one bullet diameter. The factors that you mentioned come into play, but throat erosion in these hotter 7mm's can be minimized with a longer neck and a sharper shoulder angle (30-40 degrees).

Gasman,

You may want (before spending money on dies) to double check the shoulder diameter of the 7mm WSM.

0.538" for the 7mm WSM and the 300 WSM. The 28 and 30 Nosler's have a shoulder diameter of 0.528", so slightly smaller, but they all share a shoulder angle of 35 degrees.

dave7mm's right, though - the easiest thing to do for this wildcat would be to shave a 28 Nosler die down 0.05".