Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Alaska .35 Whelen Rifle Question

raybass: Thanks. Hopefully, I’ll be able to find the right .35W when the time comes.

Happy Independence Day to everyone!

If I was going to be facing Brown bears it would be with a .375 H&H or bigger.

Brown bear wise, my buddy has guided since I can't recall when now...

His backup was 338 win mag and it worked all the time. He now runs 416 Ruger.

Just shot a pretty big bear for himself this year, first one for him ever. Said he wished he'd brought the 416. Not sure what that meant as I have not had time to talk to him since then. He has been busy and just sent a few pictures and htat note.

He has said before, that for some reason the only rounds he has been impressed with are 458 and 460, IF the hunter can shoot, those have been impressive stop/droppers.

Though many rounds kill.

Nothing said here on this thread would change my mind from 35 whelen as its what you want. Its why I went 338-06. Its what I wanted.

If specifically after big bears, I am likely to carry a larger round. Always wanted a 416 Rem and a 458 Lott for whatever reasons.
That said if it was a hurry up trip, I"d grab something smaller that I already had and realize my limits and just keep going.

45/70 lever for me

When guiding brown bears hunters my back-up rifle most of the time was a 300WM. Phil Shoemaker has plenty of pictures of very big bears he had to follow-up where he used a 30-06 to do it.

Back in the old days the 30-06 was considered the big stopper...

If not a cns shot all animals die the same way, a loss of blood big enough to drop blood pressure low enough to starve the brain and muscles of oxygen. An extra is breaking down running gear to make locating them easier.

Shock does not kill. The energy carried by the bullet was just handled comfortably at the shoulder and a lot was lost between the shoulder and the critter.

A bigger bullet means a bigger hole and a deeper hole means more tissue was disrupted and more blood is leaking. A leak on both sides means the blood pressure will drop faster. The exit wound is usually larger and the disrupted tissue points that way allowing more blood loss faster than the entrance.

All of this a drawn out explanation of why a single hole in the right place is critical. Taking the aorta off the top of the heart and leaving most of the rest of it alone will bleed an animal out in just seven heart beats. Destroying the heart muscle itself stops the positive side of the pump and the suction side. It strands a bunch of blood around the muscles leaving enough oxygen available for the critter to go amazing distances.

Simple answer is the bullet location is far more important... CNS shots are going to be pretty much same:same with any reasonable cartridge.

And what would you do if the bear you just hit at 40 yards was cresting the hill 250 yards away? Back-ups sometimes have to shoot a lot farther than ideal...

I was in a small gun shop in Fairbanks years ago and saw a box of Barnes Originals 35 caliber 275 grs. I grabbed them and am thinking if I ever get back up there to hunt Brown Bear that will be what I use. Maybe 52 grs of Varget? Just guessing.
Other than moose we don't have many big critters around here except a big black bear gets shot once in awhile by somebody. Fun reading about it though.

I'm building 35 W soon. But if I had to be in thick brush hunting bear and moose more than not 45/70 level will be just fine. I'm lookin at quick follow up shot if bear doesn't like the first one and decides to come at me.
If I have to shoot 250 yard with it, guess I'll have to aim 3' feet high

Picking a cartridge with severe limits in a reasonably likely scenario never made sense to me, but that is what makes the World go around I guess...

Thanks for the replies. For the most part, your replies confirmed my thoughts on the matter. My thinking is that if I were hunting anything up to and including brown bears, I could take the .35 Whelen/9.3x62 (whichever caliber I end up with) and have a rifle capable of taking any game I was after as well as one that would be adequate for defending against a brownie. (I differentiate between hunting and defending against brown bears as the latter is tougher). For non-hunting outdoor activities, I believe a .45-70 would be both a bit handier and have more than enough power (if that’s the right word) to take care of an encounter with a brownie.


I’ve wanted a .416 Rigby for quite some time. From what I’ve read and seen (I watched several mixed bag safari’s where the .416 Rigby was used) and I was impressed with the round’s effectiveness.


Although I believe either would be effective, for non-hunting defense, the .45-70 would be my choice as well.


Sitka deer: Thanks for your well-reasoned explanation; which confirms my thoughts that shot placement coupled with penetration is all important.

Hmmm. Like Sitka dumb fu ck said there's not such thing as knock down power. Why aren't you using a .223 Rem?

Has anyone considered a 7600 in 35 whelen? Cheap synthetic replacement stock, duracoat the steel parts($40) and you've got a fast repeater bear thumper!!

HN,have you thought about a .358 Norma Mag?

No such thing as stopping power in regards to shoulder fired hunting rifles. The only thing that matters is placing a good bullet in the vitals and doing sufficient damage to kill the animal. Stopping power is 99 1/2% shot placement provided one chooses a bullet that will penetrate deeply enough for the shot that is presented.

So we have everything from .223 to .416 awesome!
That really narrows it down.
I saw a gold miner with a Trappers Model 94 in .454 Casull. That might work?
whelennut

Here's a .460 Wby.

bsa: I realize your question was rhetorical, but, while I have no doubt a .223 pill to the brain would instantly stop a charging brownie, the odds of making such a shot are very slim indeed. I read about a fellow who shot a large feral hog at 40’ with a .35 Whelen and he stated that it blew fragments and blood 30’ feet out the other side of the hog. Can the same be said of the .223?

I am not an expert, but I have done quite a bit of reading on this subject and I do have some understanding of physics. My understanding of ‘knockdown power’ is that it’s largely an arbitrary term. If we define knockdown power as the ability of a specific cartridge to cause enough ballistic trauma to immediately incapacitate, then we should review Newton’s Second Law of Motion (F=ma), which summarized, states that the speed and mass at which an object travels determine the energy it imparts. A heavier object traveling at the same speed as a lighter object will impart more energy, and if we think of this energy as kinetic energy, or ‘shock’ as Sitka deer defined it, we must realize that this transfer of energy, in and of itself, is not a sufficient or reliable killer. Kinetic energy may stun, but cannot be relied upon to kill, in most cases. I think the potential to do enough damage to immediately stop a threat requires more than just energy transfer. A true one-stop shot will rely more on a combination of shot placement, penetration, and kinetic energy transfer rather than how much energy alone a bullet can deliver to a target. So unless we’re dealing with a howitzer, I think the term knockdown power has little true meaning, in terms of hunting cartridges.


mitchellmountain: I haven’t, but I can see the appeal.


Ken: Yes, I’ve definitely considered the .358NM. I read great things about this cartridge. The reasons I prefer the .35W and 9.3x62 is because they both have quite a bit less recoil and because I prefer a non-belted cartridge.


458: I wrote my reply (above) before I read your post. It sounds like we are on the same page.

Ken: I'm rather surprised that jack rabbit wasn't turned into a red mist, but then if you were using a stout pill, it probably passed right through without any deformation at all. Very nice rifle, by the way.

The .460 is loaded down to where it won't pound my trigger finger to a pulp.

Never understood the aversion to a piece of brass. If you want to shoot a .358 NM let me know.