Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Gunsmithing Torque on bedding screws

I hope someone can help me figure something out. Here's my story, kind of long but please bear with me.

This past spring I bought a Remington 700 xcr (30-06) from Hill Country Rifle. It comes with a 1 moa guarantee, and right away I was able to find a handload with 180 grn Interlocks and H4350 that I could consistently get 3/4" groups with. Over about a dozen groups I averaged right at 0.70" with the biggest group being just over 1" (all three shot groups).

I moved from the Texas panhandle to Cheyenne this past summer, and didn't shoot the thing for about three months. The significance of this move comes in later.

The first or second time I shoot it after moving, it puts up a 2"+ group, and I knew something was wrong. I checked the scope screws and sure enough they were loose. I tightened them well.

I got home and started thinking about it, and having an elk hunt coming up, I checked the two bedding screws. There were snug, but I went ahead and took down on them really good, maybe getting an eighth of a turn or so on each one. A friend of mine who knows a lot about guns told me if an action was bedded right, it wouldn't matter how tight the bedding screws were tightened.

Since then, the gun has been very inconsistent. Example: during one session it shot a 0.25" group, then with the very same load the next group was 1.5". I wanted to blame on the high wind that I always have to shoot in here. It's even worse than in the Texas panhandle, but deep down I suspected something else was wrong.

This morning, same crap. Very inconsistent groups. Then I take off the stock, retorque the bedding screws so that are just snug, and shoot a five shot 13/16" group, and it was windy as hell. Of course until I can shoot a few more groups, I won't know for sure.

So, should I have to be that careful about tightening the screws? Do I need to get a torque wrench?

Have you asked Hill Country?

No, maybe I should.

I forgot to mention it has a McMillan stock and they (HCR) bedded it.

But in general, is it true that a properly bedded action won't be sensitive to torque on the screws?

All I have ever done on any stock wood or synthetic is to just snug up the screws. Has always worked for me. I just read about a new torque wrench for $60 that is available from www.battenfeldtechnologies.com. This wrench can be used to avoid stripping scope ring & base screws as well. I intend to order one since I install a lot of scopes for my friends. As suggested, contact gun maker & determine recommended torque & with this inexpensive tool you are good to go. Happy holidays.

Torque can/will affect everything................

I'm with Big Stick, it makes a difference. I think it also could make a difference if you torque the front or the back ones first since it could cause the gun to sit slightly different in the stock. I'm sure HCR has a recommended amount of inch pounds and will probably even tell you which ones to tighten first.

Let us know what they say so we can all learn from it!

OK, I called HCR today and talked to a guy there. He said that the screws should be snugged, but not over-tightened. He had more concern about damaging the threads than causing a loss of accuracy, but did say that the manner they were tightened was important. He said to get them hand tight, then lean the rifle against a wall (muzzle up), lift if two inches then drop it on the floor to ensure that the stock and action were "settled in". Then he said to tighten each screw a bit, alternating between them, kind of like tightening the lugs on a wheel.

He said that at their shop they add a drop of Lock-Tite to the threads before tightening them. He also said if I had any concerns about the rifle to ship it back to them. I thought that spoke well of their service.

If you want consistency, buy a Seekonk inch-pound calibrated torque wrench. Find out what the manufacturer recommends - probably in the neighborhood of 65 in-pounds.

...buy a Seekonk inch-pound calibrated torque wrench...

Whoa! I just checked and those aren't cheap. Any less costly suggestions?

And in this case, who would be considered the manufacturer? Does Remington have a recommendation for their 700s? This gun has a McMillan stock.

I always use to just snug them up with no noticable dfference on point of impact also.
A cheap trick you might wan't to try is a trip to dewalt's website. They list the clutch setting on my particular 18volt drill as each click =23 inch lbs. It's seen some work so 3 clicks are probably under the 65 inch lbs recomended for my 700 Rem. but also works with no noticable change in POA.
Steve.

I have several seekonk t-handle torque wrench's, one I use mostly is 45 In Lb on the action screws.

Tried um all for a test, and didnt seem to matter, so I setteled on the 45 In LB. 65 seems over kill to me.

Am betting something else is the problem. Could be the scope or mounts, perhaps the bore needs a good sgrubbing, could be a poor bedding job.

My best guess, would be spending money on a torque tool, aint gonna cure your problem.

First scrub the bore, and try a different scope.

Try changing your load slightly, say 1/2 grain at the time. I've had loads to quit shooting in benchrest matches between matches (30 minutes) when the conditions seemed to be identical. If you can seat the bullets touching the lands but if you can't do that get them as close to the lands as possible.

Mr. Coleman, I am glad to see your reply because I have read your posts for a long time and have much respect for your opinions. Are you saying you have seen even benchrest guns that would shoot a load well, then something change that would cause them to stop shooting that same load, in the same conditions?

I've never used anything but Hoppe's on this gun before, but a friend suggested it might be copper fouling so I bought some Outer's bore foam and will try again after cleaning with that. If that doesn't work, I will start experimenting with other loads. For this gun, I basically started wtih a load I had developed for another 30-06 and then just tweaked it a little. It seemed to work for a while.

One more question, is it possible that the crown could be damaged such that I wouldn't be able to tell by looking down the muzzle, but still be enough to effect accuracy?

Thanks!

I have had times when reducing the pressure on action screws has helped grouping and I agree that 65 in lb sounds a little high and 45 in lb seems to be more of what would be needed. Craig Bottington once commented that most factory setting on new guns was too much and I have found he was correct. That's usually one of the first things I look at on a new rifle. Right after the trigger pull poundage of course.

Panhandlepr

Were you able to remove much copper from the barrel? I use WipeOut exclusively and the stuff is amazing. I tried their little test and cleaned my rifle religiously with Barnes CR10. The next evening, I tried WipeOut and got the taletell blue foam. It does sound like you may have an issue with copper fouling in your barrel. Remember, though, that when you use any copper remover, to use a nylon brush as the copper brushes will leave blue trace on the cleaning rags every time. I chased my own tail through a complete bottle of CR10 before I found out what I was doing wrong. Let us know what happened. Tom Purdom

I got some Swete's and cleaned the barrel. The patches did come out blue, but not as much as I expected. But accuracy has returned to normal. The next time to the range I shot two groups that were close to 0.75". I'm now guessing that was the problem.

What surprises me is that I have a couple of other rifles with well over 1000 rounds through them (the rifle I had problems with has only about 350), and I've never used anything on those other two but Hoppe's.

I guess some barrels tend to foul with copper worse than others - ???

No doubt. I'm glad you solved that riddle. Those darned action screws were thinking "It aint us fella! Clean the dang barrel!!" Seekonk had their fingers crossed, eh? It's nice when the solution is the cheapest one.