Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Africa Largest game with .300 H&H Magnum?

The problem of 'not enough' more often than not, has to do with not enough shooting skills rather than not enough gun.

WDM Bell wrote of people he hunted with using big bores than couldn't get the job done, Harry Selby wrote of inept clients with big bores-same problem,
and in our present times I still hear of furious PHs reporting that clients can't hit a 5 ton target with their .500cal

On the other hand, Bell wrote of a Sikh officer and his son killing 90 lions with a 7x57 and Selby successfully guided his 14 yo daughter onto
a bull to kill it with 7x57.

I am convinced some novices purposely carry big bores in the even they might need a 'stopper' and want to be the hero to save the day. This despite
the fact they don't even have skill and nerve to make that happen. You can kit yourself out to make it look like to the world you know what you are doing,
but when things go south, end up drilling your PH with a .458 Lott rather than the DG...re; Tim Herald.

It makes sense to use a calibre you can actually handle and most importantly, to leave the professional work to the professionals.

I have been asked a few times is I am a "small-bore man" because of the posts I have written here and on a few other forums.

No.

In fact, I actually like bigger calibers and heavier bullets.

But I like them.
I don't need them. (I intend to kill my elk this year with a 6.5 Mann/Scho)

I have enough hunting experience in the last 50 years, and over a LOT of ground, in a lot of different places to know what works welland what is "so-so".

As Starman said, "too little" is usually about skill. It's not about tools.

I have killed some large animals with smallish guns. Some of them were quite large. If I use a bullet that holds it's weight, I don't need uber-power, power and neither does anyone else.

This is a 2 edged sword. If you insist on killing large game with tiny guns you should shoot those guns VERY well. The good thing is that it's easier to learn to shoot VERY well with smaller guns than it is with very powerful ones.

So if a hunter misses the intended point of impact with a 223 by 6 inches I will agree that he'd be better off making the same miss of 6 inches with a 300 mag .

But if he can't shoot well and has poor shooting skills he's likely to miss by more then 6 inches.

If he misses by a foot or more, it's proof that it's not the gun or the bullet that's the problem. In all likelihood if he had a 260 Rem or even a 308 he'd probably bring home a lot more meat and trophies. Men that don't flinch may not be able to shoot "Camp Perry Groups" but they can hit a deer chest. And they do!

As I said, I like my big guns. I am on the 2nd barrel of my 375H&H. That gives some indication as to how much I like some of the big guns. I also have fired more 30 cal and larger bullet than I can count, many of which were 416", 423" and 458 caliber. But as a hunter, and a guide for many years, I have to agree with many of my fellow guides and say a LOT of magnum shooters are not skilled enough.

That's from 2 factors.
#1 the guns kick them and they don't practice enough to overcome the flinch they have.
#2 The ammo is costly and they don't spend (or can't spend) enough money to acquire the level of skill they should have.

To the readers who are considering a new rifle I can give one piece of overall advice that I think is 100% solid.
Never buy any hunting rifles you can't or won't learn to shoot well.

If you want a 460 Magnum, understand that to make that rifle work you have to be able to hit what you need to, and if that means you need to fire 500 (or more) rounds of ammo (factory or handloads,--- you're call) then you must factor the ammo cost and the time off, and travel to shoot, into the cost of the weapon.
If you cannot afford the time and the ammo, you should be buying a gun for the collection, but not for hunting.

You can have a room full of 338s, and 375s and 300 Ultra mags and that's great, but when you come out to the mountains for that special hunt, bring the rifle that you shoot best. That means the rifle you can hit realistic targets with most often, under less then perfect conditions, from prone, sitting kneeling and standing, and in time limits that are realistic.

I would rather guide a man who can hit an 8" target every time with a 260 in 8 seconds or less, then some guy that shows up with a big magnum who NEEDS the bi-pod on it, and has troubles hitting an 8" target at 75 yards in 8 seconds of less. I do not exaggerate. Try it. Full mag, 3-6 rounds (depending on what your rifle holds) on an 8" target at 75 yards offhand, and you have 8 seconds for each shot to make the hits. Any miss counts as zero. Any hit that hits in over 8 seconds from the last shot counts as zero. You may be surprised.

Many lost animals are not lost because they are missed, but are actually lost because the guns these guys bring out are about as slow to get into action as an 81MM Mortar, (and by the time you hike with me from 5,000 feet to 10,500 feet, you'll swear they are just as heavy.) They rush the shot because it took so long to get lined up and they miss or shoot badly. In some cases I have seen they don't even get time to squeeze the trigger.

They are not as expert with their tools as they need to be when it really counts.

Shooting skill is not just about group size and has NOTHING to do with groups shot from a bench rest.

Speed and accuracy are equal in importance. Seems today everyone wants to come out ready for the 500 yard (or more) shot that they can take 5 minutes to set up but the real truth is that when I get them into an elk heard it's going to be at 200 yards or less, and they may have 15 seconds or so.
Not always, but if you train for that kind of shooting and you do get more time you will be just fine.

If you are smooth and skilled with the gun you shoot best you'll be a LOT better off.

Power is good, but never try for power at the expense of accuracy on target in realistic time limits. You often have 8 to 15 seconds and that's a lot of time if you are smooth. It's not a lot of time if you need 10 seconds to get ready.

A good 26 caliber rifle with "elk bullets" is powerful enough for elk and a good 223 with good "deer bullets" is powerful enough for deer. Bigger is fine if you are fine with it. If not, use the smaller gun and get your shooting skill level up.

I didnt quote anything from you mentioning rabbits and the 460WM
or mention those in my response.

In case you missed it, Szinh mentioned the number of clients that do not shoot their magnums to good effect.
To those who shoot it well .300HH is more than ample to brain or heart an elephant, and to those who don't
shoot it well, its user can make mess of any hunt.

200 gr. NPT at optimal velocity.........

DF

Which is ???

I use 300 WSM load data as a starting point now days. Current powders used unlike 300 H&H wich has dated powder info.

I would consider 2900 fps tops with the 200 gr Nosler Partition.

The .300 H&H is not legal for elephant in any country.

...The minimum is .375 H&H.

Besides like JJHACK says, your wallet is on the line at this point as well as the PHs ass.

I didnt quote anything from you mentioning rabbits and the 460WM
or mention those in my response.

In case you missed it, Szinh mentioned the number of clients that do not shoot their magnums to good effect.
To those who shoot it well .300HH is more than ample to brain or heart an elephant, and to those who don't
shoot it well, its user can make mess of any hunt.