24hourcampfire.com
24hourcampfire.com
-->
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Hop To
Page 2 of 4 1 2 3 4
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 8,088
Campfire Outfitter
Online Happy
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 8,088
Originally Posted by Jim in Idaho
If 125 tags are available for 762 people, each person has a chance of 125/762 or .1640 on the first draw, which can be expressed as 16.4%. Remember that if 125 tags were split between 125 people then each would have a chance of 125/125 = 1 which is 100% chance of winning.

Or look at it the other way, 762 people with 125 tags, 762/125 = 6.096, or about 6 people vying for each tag. 100% success divided by 6.096 = 16.40 or again 16.4%.

I suppose there is some algorithm that shows your odds decreasing with each unsuccessful (for you) draw. When the first ticket is drawn, then 124 people are vying for 761 tags, or 124/761 = .1629, then 123/760 = .1618, etc. until there is one tag left for 638 people or 1/638 = .0015.

Not sure how 6 applicants vying for one of 762 tags would be calculated, I left college to join the Army before we got to that part of the class. wink


This is the correct answer, unless you're using a 270.

GB1

Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,098
I
iddave Offline OP
Campfire Tracker
OP Offline
Campfire Tracker
I
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,098
Originally Posted by BuzzH
Odds are, you and the 6 others that are applying are going to fall in with the other 637 people that aren't going to draw...plan accordingly.

Maybe try "hooking" a kid by taking them every year versus only hunting a top end tag (NOT saying you aren't doing that very thing). IME, most kids couldn't give a chit less if they're shooting a cow, spike, or 6 point for their first few elk. Hell, lets be honest, many adults are the same way. As long as unrealistic expectations and undue pressure is put on a kid to kill a whopper, I have no problem with the tag transfer.

However, these glory tags and tag transfer schemes have a lot more to do with stroking the ego of the parents and less about "hooking" kids.

Took my 12 year old nephew on a 100% draw odds cow hunt that receives very little hunting pressure on a tag he put in for. A quality hunt is more about the experience than the size of the rack, in particular when trying to "hook" kids in the sport. Many times, chasing inches of horn and antler turns into a cluster-shag, for all kinds of reasons, and could have the exact opposite effect on kids.

My nephew was pretty darn happy with how his elk hunt went, very controlled situation, lots of elk, decent weather...perfect shot with his 7-08 at 70 yards. Reasonable pack out, plenty of time to show him how to quarter an elk for packing, just a great experience. He's going to be a life-long elk hunter...no doubt in my mind.

[Linked Image]

Good luck in the draw...



I do plan accordingly, but thanks a bunch for the lecture I didn't ask for. I bet your neighbors love hearing you tell them about why the Yen fluctuates against the Dollar when they come ask for a cup of sugar. WTF is WRONG with people that they feel compelled to interject their "feelings" into every damn discussion on this site?!

Want to tally which of us has taken more kids on public land, OTC hunts? Hint....you'll come up pale by comparison. My son's first two elk were public-land cows, one a draw and one an OTC hunt if that helps sooth your soul regarding my son's welfare. Same, same for half the neighborhood I've introduced to shooting/hunting.

Last edited by iddave; 05/23/17.

If you're not burning through batteries in your headlamp,...you're doing it wrong.
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,201
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,201
66%

Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 26,337
G
Gus Offline
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
G
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 26,337
i have no problem gaming the system if that is at the root of what we are talking about here. so long as it's legal of course. i doubt ethics enter in, and probably shouldn't. to each his own.


Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 4,671
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 4,671
I still can't get it. You are saying that he should draw a tag 2 out of every 3 years?

IC B2

Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,201
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,201
Yes. With 6 names in the hat, he will pull one (or more) tags approximately 66% of the time.

Last edited by K1500; 05/23/17.
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,098
I
iddave Offline OP
Campfire Tracker
OP Offline
Campfire Tracker
I
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,098
Originally Posted by Steelhead
What happens if everyone in your clan gets lucky?


I don't know for sure what the "law" is on that one quite honestly. I'm ass-U-MEing he can only receive one tag as a gift.

If more than one family member drew though, I can definitively tell you is my son would only take one of them as that's all that would be "prudent" for my immediate family...for a variety of reasons I won't bore you with. I'd happily assist whichever other family members drew if they were so-inclined to go of their own accord, but that seems like a 50/50 bet at best.

If they decided they didn't want to hunt for themselves, the tags would go unclaimed which would then make them available for the second-chance drawings.


If you're not burning through batteries in your headlamp,...you're doing it wrong.
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,201
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,201
No, it's better than 50/50, it's a 66% chance you draw at least 1 tag.

Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,098
I
iddave Offline OP
Campfire Tracker
OP Offline
Campfire Tracker
I
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,098
Originally Posted by K1500
No, it's better than 50/50, it's a 66% chance you draw at least 1 tag.



hahaha....I mean that it's only 50/50 they would WANT to go hunting if they drew a tag and Rowdy didn't want/need to take it.


If you're not burning through batteries in your headlamp,...you're doing it wrong.
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 4,671
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 4,671
Ok. I'm getting a headache now----Good luck on the draw. Let us know how it turns out.

IC B3

Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,201
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,201
It's a fairly straight fowward prob/stat problem as laid out above, however unless you are fresh out of a prob/stat class, it may be a bit tough to wrap your mind around. If you don't understand the math, think of it this way. If single name has a 16% chance of drawing, it doesn't seem like a stretch to believe that 6 hunters combined have a 66% chance of at least one of them drawing. Just don't get too excited and book airline tickets, there is still a 33% chance no one in your family draws.

Last edited by K1500; 05/23/17.
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 29,786
J
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
J
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 29,786
Originally Posted by JSTUART
Originally Posted by colorado bob
I way I think it is-----Your son has 6 chances. 6 divided by 762= ..0078% chance of getting drawn. Then at the end of the draw 6 divided by 638= .009% Long odds--but someone has to get drawn. Bob



762 divided by 125 times 6 = 36.576


Actually;

762 divided by 125 = 6.096 which is roughly 16.404%


Now the question is can one simply x 6 to get the result one is looking for, somehow 98.425% does not seem kosher.


These are my opinions, feel free to disagree.
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 26,337
G
Gus Offline
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
G
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 26,337
no wonder the state lotteries such as mega-million, powerball, etc. are bringing in tons of money to help support higher education. lot's of folks are willing to play the lottery for personal benefits.


Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,750
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,750
Well, the reality of it is, you have a 50/50 chance - either you'll draw or you won't. There are no other possibilities.

Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,201
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,201

[/quote]


762 divided by 125 = 6.096 which is roughly 16.404%


Now the question is can one simply x 6 to get the result one is looking for, somehow 98.425% does not seem kosher.


[/quote]

No, you cannot. This is easily demonstrated by assuming he has 7 names in the hat. Your method above would give him above a 100% chance of drawing, which cannot happen. The correct way to calculate the odds of the OP drawing one or more tags is given above in my first post.

Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,201
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,201
Originally Posted by BRISTECD
Well, the reality of it is, you have a 50/50 chance - either you'll draw or you won't. There are no other possibilities.


Just because there are only two outcomes doesn't mean it is a 50/50 shot. You can either win the powerball or not, but it sure isn't a 50/50 shot despite the fact there are only two outcomes.

Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 29,786
J
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
J
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 29,786
Originally Posted by K1500




762 divided by 125 = 6.096 which is roughly 16.404%


Now the question is can one simply x 6 to get the result one is looking for, somehow 98.425% does not seem kosher.


Quote


No, you cannot. This is easily demonstrated by assuming he has 7 names in the hat. Your method above would give him above a 100% chance of drawing, which cannot happen. The correct way to calculate the odds of the OP drawing one or more tags is given above in my first post.



You are correct as once one tag is drawn the next has 761 divided by 124 = 6.137 which is 16.292% chance, and each subsequent drawing lengthens the odds...assuming one of the six doesn't draw early.

Last edited by JSTUART; 05/23/17.

These are my opinions, feel free to disagree.
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,750
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,750

Originally Posted by K1500
Originally Posted by BRISTECD
Well, the reality of it is, you have a 50/50 chance - either you'll draw or you won't. There are no other possibilities.


Just because there are only two outcomes doesn't mean it is a 50/50 shot. You can either win the powerball or not, but it sure isn't a 50/50 shot despite the fact there are only two outcomes.


I try to be an optimist - I live in an area where it hardly rains, so I don't like the weatherman saying "the chance for rain today is...". I like "either it's gonna rain or not" a lot better, LOL.

Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 10,727
Campfire Outfitter
Online Content
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 10,727
You have a 16% chance 6 times. Although it is probably a little worse than that because they alot several tags for outfitters and out of state'rs. And don't forget that was last years applicants, could be way more (or less) applicants this year. Stick your name in, pay the $6.50 and see what happens...

Last edited by centershot; 05/23/17.

A true sportsman counts his achievements in proportion to the effort involved and fairness of the sport. - S. Pope
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,201
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,201
He does not have a 16% chance times 6.

Page 2 of 4 1 2 3 4

Moderated by  RickBin 

Link Copied to Clipboard
AX24

573 members (12344mag, 007FJ, 02bfishn, 160user, 10gaugeman, 16gage, 63 invisible), 2,478 guests, and 1,297 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Statistics
Forums81
Topics1,191,437
Posts18,470,834
Members73,931
Most Online11,491
Jul 7th, 2023


 


Fish & Game Departments | Solunar Tables | Mission Statement | Privacy Policy | Contact Us | DMCA
Hunting | Fishing | Camping | Backpacking | Reloading | Campfire Forums | Gear Shop
Copyright © 2000-2024 24hourcampfire.com, Inc. All Rights Reserved.



Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5
(Release build 20201027)
Responsive Width:

PHP: 7.3.33 Page Time: 0.078s Queries: 15 (0.003s) Memory: 0.8993 MB (Peak: 1.0545 MB) Data Comp: Zlib Server Time: 2024-04-26 18:20:36 UTC
Valid HTML 5 and Valid CSS