Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters Need Help Identifying the Maker of this Custom Rifle

I recently purchased this rifle at an auction and have been researching its background 1267063 NM 03 19 26 DCM RIFLE SALES 1922-42 H J RICHARDSON,MISSOULA MT

So its a National Match M1903 purchased by this gentleman in 1926 he was later in a Match at Camp Perry in 1938 I'm assuming the same gun was used. I would love to be able to identifiy the Smith that made it. Any ideas and all comments are welcome and appreciated

Receiver may be an 03 from the DCM, but I doubt that a custom hunting rifle was shot at Camp Perry. Looks like a nice old style hunting rifle.

Style is similar to Winslow Arms I think from Florida. Google them to compare.

That rifle looks definitely post WW II. It may have been customized then. It would not have been legal to shoot in the matches at Camp Perry in the condition shown in the photos. Or very effective either.

No doubt the "sporter" work was done after WWII, but that doesn't mean it wasn't shot at Camp Perry when in original condition.

I was only suggesting this rifle was shot at Camp Perry and later on in its life sporterized as Mule Deer stated

Yes thanks Tejano it looks like it!! Does anyone know if manufacturing data is available from these folks or what happened to them??

That is not a Winslow Arms product. More likely it was done by some obscure gunsmith. The stockwork is no different (or any more notable) than thousands of similar '03 sporters built back in the 50's and 60's.

If it were my gun, I'd be looking to restock the thing with something more appropriate to it's history, but that's just me.

I have seen and handled rifles by Winslow Arms, they were a much higher quality than your rifle. Besides the hundreds of obscure gunsmiths doing conversions of military rifles there were also many rifles like this produced as student projects by the various gunsmithing schools. For that matter gun owners could buy semi-inlet stocks from many manufacturers and create their own sporter. Most of the gunsmithing school guns were not checkered as this was a class apart from stockmaking, the lack of checkering would make me suspect the rifle was a student project. There not being any marking on the wood or metal, the origin is anyone's guess.

I would absolutely restore it if the first 2 inches of the barrel hadn't been cut off!!! Not sure what to do with it??

What were your thoughts when you bid and won?

Those old guns generally shoot pretty well.

Sorta heavy for today's tastes, but solid, good guns, made out of steel.

That looks like the OEM Springfield trigger. If so, a Timney would probably help.

See what it'll do at the range; give it a chance.

DF

Discus420 When first looked at it the name Al Besson (sp) one of his early jobs came to mind. Just a guess. Cheers NC

Too bad. I'd still restock it, in the classic style. There's little collector value at this point, although that NM shroud/safety/cocking piece assembly is fairly scarce, and worth a few $$. If you're thinking about installing a different safety (like a side-swing), I'd find some standard components to use.

Check out Al Biesen guns on line.

http://jamesdjulia.com/item/lot-1331-al-biesen-custom-model-70-featherweight-rifle-48842/

No way is this an Al Biesen piece. Not even close.

IMO.

DF

DF, in all fairness, Biesen did build some (very few) early stocks with inlays. But this isn't one of them.

The stock was made by some unknown Bubbasmith too ashamed to sign his name.

Discus420,

Was I right about it being an OEM trigger?

If true and if it's that good, what modifications were made, if you can tell.

Curious.

DF

its the Springfield National Match trigger what was done to it I don't know but it is smooth as silk and feather touch to fire . 1/2 MOA at 100 yards is not hard at all but I guess that's what you get with a National Match rifle I wrote to CMP to try to get the scores from the 1938 camp perry match and see if they list individual scores for the Montana team so Ill see what they dig up. As soon as I get the paperwork from CMP I will put it up for sale there has to be somebody that needs a National Match deer rifle!

Here are more pics with a few of the trigger http://s50.photobucket.com/user/billyandbrandon/library/M1903

Thanks PrimeBeef that was what first caught my eye as I had seen a couple of his with inlays. As I said that was the first thing that came to mind. Thanks for your support. Cheer NC

I would just enjoy it as a period piece and leave it as is. But I would also think about whittling down the stock to more modern classic line which you have ample wood to do so. Either way congrats and enjoy.

Those early Biesen stocks were pretty awkward looking, very amateurish. The first stock he made for Jack O'Connor even had inlays (and white spacers). O'Connor wasn't overly impressed and told him to try again.

Not a Winslow that's for sure, looks like it could be a Bishop done by someone that doesn't quite know how to do a recoil pad. The inlays are or were available from several sources back in the day. When I worked for Winslow we had boxes of them, not hard to inlay if you have a little woodworking knowledge and tools.

Herter's sold a stock blank like that but it usually included lightning bolt spacers. I think if you ordered one with the finest walnut available it was something like $25.

Here's a '60's vintage Herter's French Walnut stock, Springfield with McGowan .270 SS barrel. I know, I know, .270, but I was young...

This blank had a huge roll over cheek piece. I probably removed a half pound of wood, trimming to what you see. I did the '60's style rosewood inlays, bedded, finished and skip-a-line checkered it. All that was the style back then. Sorta crude compared to later efforts, but one of my early projects as a teen. Timney trigger, Jaeger safety. Had a buddy weld the aftermarket bolt handle. I ground and polished it. A tad heavy, but very accurate. Tough old guns, for sure. No plastic or aluminum on these, just steel and walnut.

DF

D F

Very Nice !! BTW, I'd give you $500.00 for that gay 270 , what you say ?

Jerry

Probably all it's worth.

But, I do have some sentimental attachment to it.

So, while not the prime piece in my safe, it's nevertheless a keeper, a keepsake of sorts...

DF

At least we identified the rifle maker for this one...

DF

D F

If you decide to move it OR upgrade, the offer STANDS.
I'd appreciate it for what it is plus because YOU own it.

Jerry

How's that for 'suck up' ?

Tejano nailed it! It is a Herter's "perfect" semi inletted stock, just like the one on my dad's Springfield sporter. They have styling borrowed from the Monte Kennedy school of gunstock design.

Mine looked more like that before I decapitated the roll over.

DF

Nice job DF and I would sure keep it. As a youth I spent many hours pouring over the Herter's catalog. We even had one in the deer camp outhouse for multi tasking.

well thanks for all the info very interesting stuff. Where would be a good place to sell it?? I didn't see a place to sell old hunting rifles on this site. I have been on armslist but that only seems to be tactical items anymore