Home Forums Hunting & Shooting General Big Game Nosler E-tips vs. TTSX's

Thanks for that info, Greg.

Interesting.

DF

She shot a coues deer in it's bed at 340 or something like that 2 years ago with the Etip. That deer just rolled over and kicked.

She had a freaking javelina double lunged at 80 yards with a 80 TTSX from her .243 at 3450 MV run 250 yards. That SOB didn't bleed until 10 feet from where I found him with an exit...Luckily I saw the direction he ran or I may not have found him in the cholla forests. This kinda stuff has happened a lot for me with TTSX.

Screw that crap.

That's interesting. I have not used E-tips or the GMX's but have had excellent results using the TTSX's but while penetration has always been excellent I will admit to a some times nagging doubt about very narrow wound channels especially at longer ranges. This is with the 140- and 150-gr 7mm TTSX's started at 3150 fps and 3000 fps respectively.

Does anyone have info on GMX vs. E-Tips...

I've always shot monos at high speed, use other type bullets in slower rounds.

Greg's observations have me thinking...

DF

Guys, I'm just reporting what I've seen personally. Go shoot some stuff and report back....

Ali shot a cow elk last year. At the shot the cow jumped out of sight. No impact heard. 390 something yards. She's real honest. I asked her if the shot was good. She said it was. I said ok.

I trudged through the snow to go check the area out. She's munching snacks....

I walk up to this cow stone dead about 5 leaps from shot sight having leaked like a seive. Exit, great wound channel, double lung....

It was a long day...

Had a similar experience with that same bullet on a whitetail at 75 yards.

There wan't a blood trail on the WT doe posted earlier. I knew which way she ran and we found her several hours later way in the woods. If she did bleed, we didn't find it; blood drops can be hard to find at night.

Not much fun, flashlights in the dark woods, looking for a deer. DRT is mo better...

OTOH, during primitive weapon season a few years back, I chest shot a doe with my .45-70, 250 gr. TSX at 2,550 FPS over max dose of Vihtavuori n-120. Now that bullet looks like an ashtray, blew a hole thru that deer. There was a fire hose type blood trail for 20 yds. or so, even some lung tissue on the ground.

DF

Periodically I see these threads and people pee down their leg about poor performance of this bullet or that one. With the Barnes, I have a sample base of right on 100 killed animals in calibers from .223 to 50 Muzzle loader and I have yet to see the first questionable wound. I did see a few deer not bleed a trackable quantity of blood, something that a person has to expect once in a while when you blow up the heart or take out the vessels above the heart. But... Those deer just do not go very far. ZERO lost deer. Out of A few dozen deer I killed, more than 1/3 tttand maybe 40% dropped where they stood. Some by design, some just because. I think 70 yards was the longest run, and that was from a deer with it's heart completely destroyed and no functioning lung tissue since the upper lungs were completely destroyed. The difference I see killing deer with monos vs cup and core is from either the cup and core coming undone or being deflected after impact. I have seen no difference between Barnes, E-Tips and GMXs. I have seen no difference between Barnes Xs, TSXs and TTSXs. And, while we are at it, I have seen no definitive signs from the deer as they depart that I can say tells me the deer was hit well or not hit at all. Missed deer can and do run away without flagging and deer that make it 30-50 yards have flagged right up until they ht the ground. I have spent more that two hours searching for blood without finding a single drop all the while having zero doubt that Bambi was dead somewhere nearby.

There is a very great deal of difference between the people standing behind the rifle. The is an equally large difference between the people behind the deer after the shot. IMO, that's a whole lot more significant than any difference between bullets as long as the bullet is even marginally adequate to the job at hand.

I hear you and your confidence about how you go about your business. Let me tell you that you ain't the only one to kill stuff nor be half educated about bullets or killing [bleep]....

You can yap all you want about your bullet. You shouldn't be so committed. It ain't worth it. I'm here to tell you that bullets and game performance of said bullets are a fickle bitch...

There's no poor performance of the TTSX, there's just better. Don't post [bleep] about how many more deer you've killed. There's always folks who scoff at it, including me...

You damn Barnes folks sure are sensitive. It's kind of funny....

we don't live in the 1970s or even 80s anymore.i agree with almost all I read.all these bullets and bullets manufactured today are damn good and solid performers for there intended design and use.i will agree that the barnes do hold together a little longer and can leave a smaller wound channel and exit especially at distance.i personally don't use them for deer hunting or thin skinned game that size or smaller.but they are a great bullet and for heavy big boned animals they are as good as any.just my opinion in this.i also wont use nosler partitions but many like and use them and for many years.to each there own.

All guns don't like Partitions. I do use Partitions in the guns that like them.

DF

Dude! Your slippies are getting full of piss. I have been loading all manner of bullets since '56. I have used most of what is available, and the Monos are the best I have ever had available.

Ive not experienced good blood trails with Barnes, but I put that down to stunt shooting with centerfire .22s...I haven't experienced good blood trails with ANY bullet in the .22s

That all being said the longest trail Ive had in score of kills with the little Barnes was 50 yards. Im sure the E-tips would provide about the same performance, but again I haven't tried them because Im so satisfied with the Barnes. ( A real stretch for me cause Im always fooling with something new....)

I've had mixed results with Barnes as well. Haven't tried E Tips but will one of these days.

These discussions are always funny. The topic of Barnes bullets seems to bring the zealots out of the woodwork, on both sides of the debate. I think the reason for that is because opinions vary widely, and many people (though certainly not all) jump to conclusions without having adequate data. I have no dog in this fight, but I like to add my observations as a data point because I've witnessed a fair number of animals shot with Barnes bullets. I think between my own hunting and guiding others, the count is somewhere around 138 last I checked, ranging from pronghorn, BH sheep, moose, elk, WT, MD, bear, etc. My experience is similar to that of MILES58, in that all animals went down after the shot within typical distances. The farthest runner, a sample of one, went 200 yards after I personally made a bad shot and clipped the upper rear of one lung with a 100gr TSX from the .25-06. Shot distance was 115 yards. I had no problem finding that deer, though, because the blood trail was substantial, so tracking through the dense deciduous forest was easy. Aside from that one deer, the farthest any animal ran after being shot was right around 100 yards, which was only a couple of animals, and none were lost. The vast majority ran 50 yards or less with good hits, and most of those dropped where they stood because of high shoulder shots. There were a few cases where the blood trail was minimal, but the animal wasn't far away in each case, so was found with relative ease.

Unlike MILES, I have seen some difference in the terminal performance between the X/TSX and the TTSX, however, in that the TTSX seems to expand more violently and leave larger wound channels. IMO mono bullets are best used at close to medium range from high-velocity chamberings, where one expects the possibility of shooting with the animal at a difficult angle, and where penetration and bone-breaking bullet integrity may be valuable. I've not witnessed more than a couple of kills with the GMX or E-Tip, so can't comment much there, other than to say that so far I haven't seen any real difference between the way they work and the way the TTSX works.

Thanks for those thoughts, Jordan. I appreciate you sharing your experience and observations.

I've long been interested in velocity as a function of terminal performance with different type bullets. Ingwe's observation of little or no blood trail, stunt shooting small caliber Barnes, compared to my post of the "fire hose" blood trail from the Barnes 250 gr. .45-70, chest shot WT. Barnes all the way, size does matter, results differ.

I've read accounts of old timers, hunting big game in Africa, using big bullets at moderate velocity, generally in the 2,200-2,400 fps range. Those were and are very lethal but manageable loads. Cranking the speed may not always produce the anticipated result.

Monos seem to perform best, pushed hard, but a recent thread was questioning that. www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/12160469

One poster said monos can't be moving too fast. Maybe, manbe not.

How did the old classics, Swede, 7x57, '06, etc. become so famous? They were (are) quite effective killers of BG, have been for years, will continue to be. They have time honored ballistic balance, bullets/velocity.

OK, OK, what's the bottom line here. There are many variables in this business: game being hunted, skill of the shooter, POI, range, bullet design, velocity and how all those factors intermesh. Some conclusions can be made, but I don't think there IS a final definitive statement covering all contengencies. If it was that simple, we Loonies wouldn't have anything to argue about, anything to wake us up at night to ponder...

IMO.

DF

That little 25 cal 100 gr TTSX at 3250 wont leave you lacking, guessing, OR looking very hard for your hit critters.

And dang sure doesn't me at 3550.

Gunner, I know you're a mono loving shoulder punching, bone crunching kinda guy...

What's your take on the .257 Wby post (linked above) and the question that OP asked.

My experience with the .240 Wby, 80 gr. TTSX at 3,600 fps came to mind. I know, that's just a sample of one, but was enough of a deal that I now use 100 gr. NPT's in the .240. The fact that it shoots them so well helped with that decision, but the 80 gr. TTSX was almost as accurate.

And, the 100 gr. TTSX out of the .257R at 3,250 fps seemed to perform better. Again, not a number of examples to make a valid conclusion, just a curiosity.

Your thoughts.

DF

I generally push all monos fast. I have shot enough deer with fast monos at 25 feet or less to know that they work just fine at very high impact speeds. When I start with a new mono or one that I have questions about, I normally will seek to define a lower limit of acceptable performance. I use water jugs and look for the speed at which full expansion stops. It's not a correlation to what happens on game, but it is a good start. The Barnes bullets with the huge hollow points do pretty much what you'd expect. The 125 grain .357 will work nicely down below 900 FPS, 38 caliber range. 30-30 150 TSXs will fully expand down to 1100 fps, likewise with muzzle loader bullets. I have not seen a Barnes fragment. I have seen shed petals. The .25-06 100 grain at as high as 3450 is perfect. The 80 grain 25 caliber at 3650 holds together. 130 grain TSX and TTSX out of a 300 win mag at 3480 holds together.

What I have seen of Monos and bone in deer leads me to believe that up around 3000 FPS and faster, there doesn't seem to be much difference between bone and soft tissue. I have only seen one instance of proof of a shed petal with a mono, a 300 win mag hit at 25 ft

How are monos punching shoulders or other heavy bones with regard to meat loss? Seems like either mono or other type bullets, the bone fragments would tend to bloodshot the meat. I've never used a mono before.