,Every law officer I have ever met here in Fremont County WY has been a standup person, even though personality-wise a few of them are not Mr. Sparkle. They have a tough job here , being spread thinly throughout a very large rural county, and are much appreciated by the law-abiding portion of our citizens.
That made me laugh. They DO have a very hard job.
We may know the time Ben Carson lied, but does anyone know the time Hillary Clinton told the truth?
Immersing oneself in progressive lieberalism is no different than bathing in the sewage of Hell.
I can't speak about other parts of the country. In my area,cops doing shady things are the norm rather than the exception. I would say at least 80% are at least complicit in the cover up.
Of course there is corruption. Cops are human beings, subject to every human foible and failure. That doesn't mean it is rampant, nor as pervasive as you would make people believe.
As I have stated elsewhere, a fish rots from the head down. If there are corrupt cops, it's because the administration allows it Then, it's the citizen's job to change that administration. Granted, most LEO's are civil service, but they ultimately are guided by a politician, or politicians, who hire & fire heads of agencies. Remember Mr. Comey?
However, that "Thin Blue Line" that you sneer at isn't all about corruption, it's about being part of something you will never be able to understand. Just as I will never be able to understand the bond between some of our own Campfire members who served in combat together.
Take your hate somewhere else, Harry.
Ed
"Not in an open forum, where truth has less value than opinions, where all opinions are equally welcome regardless of their origins, rationale, inanity, or truth, where opinions are neither of equal value nor decisive." Ken Howell
Then I thank you good sir. I only wish there were more folks with such moral integrity.
There are. Tens of thousands of them wearing the badge and gun everyday. It's just that they don't get the publicity.
I never got up, put on my uniform and went out onto the streets so I could be recognized as some sort of "hero". I did it because I absolutely loved beating criminals at their own game and I love the thrill of the hunt and the satisfaction that comes when I got to make a difference, no matter how slight, in someone else's life.
One less scheitbag off of the street for a while, one less drunk driver endangering other people, one less dope dealer plying his trade for a while, one less burglar taking someone else's hard earned property away from them, one less person creeping around neighborhoods, one less call to have to respond to, one less assault. Those were the goals every day. If a LEO looks at all of the crime, all of the misery, all of the wrongs, he/she will get overwhelmed, so we take just one thing at a time, making one small difference at a time.
And we get back up the next day and do it again because it's who we are, not just what we do.
Ed
"Not in an open forum, where truth has less value than opinions, where all opinions are equally welcome regardless of their origins, rationale, inanity, or truth, where opinions are neither of equal value nor decisive." Ken Howell
I can't speak about other parts of the country. In my area,cops doing shady things are the norm rather than the exception. I would say at least 80% are at least complicit in the cover up.
Mr. Clark, if that's truly the case, then you have a lot of work ahead of you. It's your part of the country, it's your responsibility to make sure the right people are taking care of it, because no one else can or will.
Ed
"Not in an open forum, where truth has less value than opinions, where all opinions are equally welcome regardless of their origins, rationale, inanity, or truth, where opinions are neither of equal value nor decisive." Ken Howell
1. I do my job within the Constitution. It's not a hindrance, it is the standard. The people I work with are the same. The end doesn't justify the means if you break the rules and violate the Constitution on the way.
2. The thin blue line issue that people complain so much about is BS. As with any community, there is a bond between police officers. However, I have never seen nor would I allow anyone to violate a persons Consitutional rights, and not step in and say something. The people I work with are the same. We demand it of each other from the beginning of the hiring process, through the academy and field training, to daily life on the street. I wouldn't be apart of it, if things were any other way.
Now, that said...there are bad people in every profession. Welders, plumbers, doctors and judges. Occasionally, they slip through the cracks and are identified in some unfortunate and potentially embarrassing situation. That's regrettable but people are human. Generally speaking, you get what you pay for. If you're not happy with what you have, let your city counsel or county commission, etc. know that. But...dont bitch when your taxes go up.
Good answer to a truly idiotic and non-constructive question. In most jurisdictions you swear to protect and serve the US constitution and all its' amendments and those protected by it.
Here's another stupid question, is there another resident of Massofwhoshits as dumb as Harry M?
mike r
Don't wish it were easier Wish you were better
Stab them in the taint, you can't put a tourniquet on that. Craig Douglas ECQC
Experience hath shewn, that even under the best forms of government those entrusted with power have, in time, and by slow operations, perverted it into tyranny. Thomas Jefferson
Nice try, but no cigar. Another attempt to demean another person by associating them with something worse.
You fail.
Ed
"Not in an open forum, where truth has less value than opinions, where all opinions are equally welcome regardless of their origins, rationale, inanity, or truth, where opinions are neither of equal value nor decisive." Ken Howell
All these threads are good for is to reveal which posters have a problem with Law Enforcement Officers.
They actually expose the teat suckers....
Experience hath shewn, that even under the best forms of government those entrusted with power have, in time, and by slow operations, perverted it into tyranny. Thomas Jefferson
I'll toss on my flame suit and ask this question. I wish it could remain civil and factual but this is the 'fire after all. A few past and now some recent events have me pondering this question and I'm looking for honest information from our LEO and law professionals here.
We hear about the few bad apples when it comes to bad cops. Some say 1% others 10% or even more. What is your definition of a "bad cop"? It is your duty to enforce the law. You are not above the law although some of them pertain to you differently. As in any profession, that person is expected to have greater knowledge and understanding in their field. That does not seem to be the case anymore.
I cannot claim innocence to a crime because of my ignorance to the law. Why is it fair for an arresting officer to take a person into custody then try to figure out what law was broken? Why is it okay for them to arrest me then drop charges later? That arrest is on my record even though I was innocent. They are not held accountable for infringing on our rights and all they have to do is claim ignorance.
Anyway, back to the original question. To all the "good cops" out there or any professional of the law, have you ever looked the other way while one of your brothers have broken the law? I hear about officer discretion but why aren't you held to a higher standard?
Are you still considered a good cop if you follow everything to the book but let other LEO slide while they fail at their paid profession?
I live in a very rural area and the majority of folks are good honest people. Our ratio of LEO to population is absurd. I'm not sure how so many bad apples can fit in one barrel. We have some great officers but the ratio isn't good. Just recently we have a couple that have been fired for beating the crap out of people while on duty, one for shooting up buildings twice and a trooper that is deemed Giglio impaired. These are just a few of the instances that are public. There are many more swept under the rug by their buddies.
I used to always give the benefit to the LEO but it is now the opposite. In my opinion this profession is going to hell and it is up to the good guys to turn it around. Are you up for the task?
Your question sorta bounces a round a lot but I'll take a stab.
Historically speaking police in the United States are less corrupt than at any time in our nation's history. Reading about the prohibition era up through the 90's will shed a lot of light on just how corrupt the poleece can and have become. But most all of that has been mitigated about as well as it can be due to light being shed on the problem and a whole lot of whistle blowing. Renting Serpico is eye opening and so is Training Day. Both are based on real individuals. But watching The Seven Five is even more so and there is no artistic license in that documentary. It's all very real. It's safe to say those levels of corruption are largely gone. Exceptions always being exceptions.
The definition of a bad cop can be many things. From being outright corrupt in the classical sense and taking money in exchange for closing their eyes, or even being part of a criminal enterprise themselves. But many times a cop can be perceived as corrupt simply because he sucks at his job and should be doing something else.
Some people believe cops have become raging, unforgiving pricks in 2017 and that can be true. But that's more due to the officials we have elected and who they have chose to appoint more than it does the profession itself.
I think you'll see less and less discretion as things progress in this country. Meaning the days of getting a "pass" will be gone forever. It's funny to watch the show COPS. They'll often say "If you tell the truth... (insert bullschit here)..." There was a time this was actually true and that is why it is a widely used tool even today. But the liability of actually letting somebody go so you can catch a real problem in the area is so high, it has transformed into a charlatan type tactic used on everybody from a jaywalker to a rapist. None of them are getting a pass. Especially if one of the many mandated cameras (dictated by elected officials) is rolling.
If you think the police to non-police ratio is skewed in your area, that's because of the people you elected. My brother lives in a liberal schit hole with little crime. There are cops EVERYWHERE. Same goes for the area my wife is from. So everybody tends to hate cops. They're not corrupt. They're just a pain in the ass with little to do other than raise revenue. I however live in a mostly conservative area and while the law enforcement around here can still make mistakes, their goal is not to bust balls and raise revenue for the city. They spend the majority of their time addressing issues that the citizens want addressed. This is mostly prevalent in small towns. You'll rarely find an Austin, Baltimore, or Chicago cop stopping a guy for speeding on his way to work at 0700. But you'll sure as schit find that in the wealthy suburbs.
Another issue facing LE in general these days is that they are narrowing their scope of recruitment to people that have never been in trouble in their life. They mandate zero tolerance on previous drug use and criminal record to include juvenile arrests. Polygraph's are pretty much the norm these days for all major departments and agencies. Of course everybody nods their head and smiles when these type of policies are put in place but just remember those type of cops won't have the slightest sense of empathy for whatever infraction you are alleged of infracting because they will not be the understanding "I was there once" type cop you allegedly remember from the 60's, or the hero Wyatt Earp types in the late 1800's and early 1900's. But also remember that these were the eras police departments have proven to be most corrupt. So pick your poison...
Sportcenter version to this answer? We all get the government we deserve. If the enforcement arm of your local government is corrupt, well.... you live in a corrupt area. If their end goal is to harass, well.... you elected their boss. Not me. Or the police themselves for that matter.
Dave
Originally Posted by Geno67
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual.
Originally Posted by Judman
Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit.
Originally Posted by KSMITH
My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
After reading through a couple pages I'm reminded of the case in Idaho, I think it was where the sheriff called a rancher to take care of his bull on the highway. Two staters arrived and killed the rancher, threw his wife and nephew to the ground and apparently got off Scott free. I think one had been fired for misconduct in another office. I used to wave and be friendly with police. I will be friendly if encountering an officer one on one, but don't respect them enough to wave to show my support anymore. It saddens me.
The idea they are a brotherhood is ludicrous to me. They are not like welders or carpenters. A bad welder can mess up a job and it probably is not very dangerous. Same with a carpenter. Maybe the wall is out of square. A cop messes up and someone gets falsely accused or killed with no repercussions. To me they are no better than politicians.
When my son-in-law was stopped the cop added not stopping in a timely manner. There was a bike lane where he could get a ticket for stopping so he went a block and turned on to a side street. His attorney took photos of the area to prove his case; which the judge would not allow. The cop lied and said there was no bike lane. (I know there was a bike lane because I lived on that street.) The judge told the jury not to go check because they were to use only the information presented in court.
They believe its "them against us".
If I'm wrong its their fault. They have not policed their own ranks.
"Only Christ is the fullness of God's revelation." Everyday Hunter
Look at officer pain from Salt Lake City, he coulda just got the blood sample from punching the bad guy in the nose instead of ruffing up an ER nurse, he deserves to be shot in the head.
LE at federal, state, county, and city level. I don't know how many officers are out there, but the vast majority are outstanding people trying to serve their communities while at the same time dealing with personal/family issues (like everybody else) that are magnified by the requirements of their chosen profession.
It would be nice if we could get LEO to answer the simple question of, "Do you consider the 4th amendment of the constitution as an impediment to conducting your work, or an essential right that trumps the added effort for you to show probable cause and get a judge to grant you a warrant"
To me that's the gold standard of good cop / bad cop. I'd venture to say if we could use that litmus test, issues of comply or be tazed, cops that never back down when challenged, etc., would for the most part go away as if by magic.
That's not difficult to answer at all. I swore an oath to support and defend the Constitution, and that document, as well as each amendment therein, contains individual rights that are absolutely essential to each and every member in society. The extra time and effort to obtain a search warrant has never been an impediment to doing my job...
The added bonus, if I've had a warrant signed by a judge, it generally saves a lot of time later dealing with various motions and hearings in court regarding the validity of a search.
Gentlemen: I can only speak for my own experiences in my community. Othre communities have other problems than ours.
Originally Posted by White_Bear
.
We hear about the few bad apples when it comes to bad cops. Some say 1% others 10% or even more. What is your definition of a "bad cop"? It is your duty to enforce the law. You are not above the law although some of them pertain to you differently. As in any profession, that person is expected to have greater knowledge and understanding in their field. That does not seem to be the case anymore.
( More to the point, what is your definition of a bad cop? There are lots of types of cops just like there are lots of kinds of people. The same can be said for organizations. Leadership sets the tone and affects the entire system. While your city might be lucky to get effective, dedicated, and professional cops, there are lazy cops, exhausted cops, overwhelmed cops, burnt out cops, inept cops, and those who try the criminal activities which they are supposed to protect society from. I call the last bad cops. )
Why is it okay for them to arrest me then drop charges later? That arrest is on my record even though I was innocent.
( I have to have probable cause, that is enough evidence to reasonably conclude a crime was committed, in order to arrest. Often charges are dropped for ridiculous reasons. Our county does not have enough money to prosecute 90% of the criminals that we arrest, so the DAs triage their case load and let many obviously guilty people walk free. Sometimes the evidence was there for an arrest but the D.A. cannot get a conviction due to "without any doubt whatsoever of innocence" standard at trials. We have a lot of liberals in the jury pool who watched Oprah/Sally Jessie Raphael/Ellen Degeneres juries that watch a lot of CSI and therefore demand $17, 000, 000 crime lab evidence, or else the cops were just lazy and arrested the poor criminal out of contempt. Sometimes the educated look down on dumb blue collar cops and, in order to be "cool" and to help the downtrodden man of color, let another obvious criminal go free.
Anyway, back to the original question. To all the "good cops" out there or any professional of the law, have you ever looked the other way while one of your brothers have broken the law? I hear about officer discretion but why aren't you held to a higher standard?
(Yes I am held to a higher standard, especially regarding the use of force in order to affect an arrest. "Discretion" is using a advisement instead of a citation. Looking the other way when a "brother" breaks the law? No; and there is a reason I will never get promoted in this town. In the corruption that is San Francisco, a bad cop is peanuts. But it is still intolerable. Often the "bad" ones are actually good ones that have been eliminated politically by the "special"category hires my city prefers.
Are you still considered a good cop if you follow everything to the book but let other LEO slide while they fail at their paid profession?
(I have lost that battle. It is for the supervisors to fix the failures. I often do a better job than the supervisors which gets me disdain and disrespect, until they need me for another dirty job.
I live in a very rural area and the majority of folks are good honest people. Our ratio of LEO to population is absurd. I'm not sure how so many bad apples can fit in one barrel. We have some great officers but the ratio isn't good. Just recently we have a couple that have been fired for beating the crap out of people while on duty, one for shooting up buildings twice and a trooper that is deemed Giglio impaired. These are just a few of the instances that are public. There are many more swept under the rug by their buddies.
( I work in a major city and I have my doubts about a lot of the people who live here. I am sorry your area organization hires those kinds of people for your department. I have heard horror stories other departments with nepotism or gang infiltration.)
I used to always give the benefit to the LEO but it is now the opposite. In my opinion this profession is going to hell and it is up to the good guys to turn it around. Are you up for the task?
(I have no problem with honest people holding their departments to the same standard. Just define your standards and insist they be reckoned with. We took the White House from the corrupt; why not the local law enforcement agencies? But please realize that there are a lot of good people and good agencies out there. You just don't hear about the good ones.)
Originally Posted by 458 Lott
It would be nice if we could get LEO to answer the simple question of, "Do you consider the 4th amendment of the constitution as an impediment to conducting your work, or an essential right that trumps the added effort for you to show probable cause and get a judge to grant you a warrant"
To me that's the gold standard of good cop / bad cop. I'd venture to say if we could use that litmus test, issues of comply or be tazed, cops that never back down when challenged, etc., would for the most part go away as if by magic.
I consider it one of the essential rights. There is a good reason for it. If I have the proof needed to convince a judge to sign his name to a warrant, I have a chance at getting the evidence needed for arrest and hopefully conviction.
But sometimes the belligerent criminal must be arrested. If I let one go free and he kills somebodies kid, how would you feel about my not tazing him? NB: Moot point as I don't have a tasers
You only have to watch to about 49 seconds. Thank God for good Samaritans.
