Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters 260 Rem vs 308

Thanks for all of the suggestions guys. I ordered a box of the 130 grain TTSX in .308. I figure I can try them out for now and see if I like them. I was about to buy the .260 but might put it on hold for now. I have a couple other rifles on my wish list and may go in that direction instead, at least for now. (Specifically, a BLR takedown for backpack hunts ans snow tracking deer in the northeastern woods - Adirondacks, Green Mountains of VT).

As far as the bear story, here is a summary. I had been using Nosler Ballistic Tips for abiut 12 years. I have killed 8 or 9 bucks with them out of my 30-06. I did have one perfect broadside shot fail to pass through on a deer at 25 yards but he dressed out over 200 pounds and ran only 25 or 30 yards. I had 2 bucks drop in their tracks. I did lose one big buck that I took a bad shot at on Pennsylvania public land but that was my fault (I found the bones and skull the following season.). So, when my buddy gave me the .308 I went out and bought more ballistic tips. (I like my 30-06 but he got me the .308 in stainless because my natural stubborness means I will sit all day in the rain at times and figured it would hold up better).

I sighted the rifle in at 100 yards and it was shooting well. I have property in Vermont and I usually spend a week hunting deer up there. Last fall, I had work obligations that kept me from going. I looked at the PA seasons on the Friday I normally leave for VT and saw that the 4 day bear season opened the following day so I figured I could hunt Saturday. I went an bought a tag and headed to the mountains that night. I didn’t really think there was any chance that I would see a bear but it beat staying home. I got up before dawn and headed into the woods. I was wandering around a good sized tract of public land the abuts out property. I had no real plan except to spend the whole day looking for bear. I would stillhunt then sit. Eventually, I was getting close to the top of the mountain (2 1/2 to 3 miles) from the cabin where I started, I heard something big run away from me in a thick patch where a bunch of trees had been blown down. I couldn’t see the animal but figured it was a big deer but could be a bear. I quietly circled above the thicket onto a rocky slope near the crest of the mountain.

The rocky area gave me a good vantage point because it was too rock for many trees to grow. I sat on a boulder looking down at the thicket and waited a bit. It was around noon so I ate my lunch. About 30 minutes after sitting down I heard something big coming through the thicket toward me - the opposite direction as before. It was so noisy and clumsy sounding, I figured it was hunters. Sure enough, a bear popped out of the cover and started through the rocky opening. It was quartering toward me. At abou 35-40 yards I aimed for the front left shoulder (my right) so the bullet would pass through the vitals (mistake, should have waited for a clean broadside shot). At the shot, the bear dropped and I was starting to celebrate in my head. A second or 2 later, it got up and took off. It ran away fast and back into the thicket.

I spent the rest of the day looking. I couldn’t find hair or a single drop of blood. I couldn’t find the bear either. When dark was coming, I hobbled back diwn to the cabin. My knees were killing me from all the searching on sloped ground.

The next morning, I hiked back out but brought my bird dog with me. No hunting is allowed on Sunday so I wasn’t armed. I spent the whole day searching with the dog but could not find a trace. It had snowed about an inch or 2 overnight but that didnt help. No luck. I had to go home and work the week but I went back on the following Saturday. Again, no luck. I tried to convince myself that I could have missed but I know that I didn’t. I have come to the belief that the Ballistic Tip hit bone and failed to penetrate. I hadn’t put enough thought into bullet choice or shot selection. It was an impulsive trip and I had no bear hunting experience. Since then, I use bonded or all copper bullets for deer in case I get another shot at a bear. Even on the shot I took, I think a TTSX would have killed the bear cleanly.

I should mention this. I was not looking at the .260 because I think it woukd be more deadly on bear than a .308. I became interested because I learned more about bullets and realized that the smaller calibers would probably work just as well in my hunting situation with the right bullet with less kick. I also gave fantasies of moving out west one day. Plus, It’s fun to play with different cartridges. My buddy uses a .300 WSM for close range PA whitetails. I guess we all have our preferences.

Almost certainly hit the spinous process above the spine. You didn't say what grain NBT, however all of them will go through a black bear shoulder. What you described is what happens when you hit high and go above the spine- i.e. momentary paralysis and then they recover.

Many years ago, I walking to a farmer that lived in apart of the county that had a decent deer population. He casually mentioned that whenever he wanted one to eat, he took his 22 rifle and shot one. Now, I knew it was useless for me to tell him not to shoot them out of season, but I did tell him that he should at least use a bigger cartridge than a 22LR. I saw him sometime later, and he told me that he took my advice and got a bigger rifle, and it killed them a lot better. Fully expecting him to say 30-30, or something similar, I was surprised when he said 22 Magnum.

I know this post is about 260 versus 308, but I think we often overanalyze things, and often come to the conclusion that we need a bigger gun, bigger this, or bigger that. Most any cartridge will kill a deer The whitetail that was the B&C record for years, the Jordan Buck, was killed with a 25-20. As with any species of game, the key is always bullet placement, along with the right bullet. I sold my nephew a 223 rifle for his 6 year old son to use on deer, and he's killed 4 with it, all one shot kills. I'm no fan of the 223 as a deer rifle, but if it will work, then anything bigger will to. 260 or 308, I would think that it wouldn't really matter.

It was 165 grain. That’s good info. Hopefully that is what happened.

I love the .260 and have shot that exclusively over my .308 for deer for years. As far as I know the BLR isn't currently chambered in .260. But if you have one in your future, I'd consider the 7mm-08. That would get you pretty close to .260 performance with less recoil than .308. In a light pack gun for deer, I'd personally even be comfortable carrying a .243. Any cartridge in the .308 family is a great whitetail cartridge IMHO.

I've shot a 260 since about 1997-1998, I really like mine using the 120 NBT and the Hornady 129 SP.


I've used ballistic tips in 95gr 6mm, 120gr 6.5mm and 180gr .308 and while not bear I've never had one fail to bust a shoulder or even shoulders on deer, even larger bucks around 200lbs. A 165gr .308 NBT would punch a bear shoulder and keep on running.

James: I agree with you. My thought is about sizing down rather than up. I know a lot of guys out here using magnums (7mm and 300) for deer. I started as a bow hunter and had no idea what kind of rifle to buy when I first started (I’m not from a hunting family). I went with the .30-06 based on what other people were using. I have a bolt action .223 an I have no doubt that I could kill a deer with it. I know a hillbilly who killed a bear with a 22 LR (a head shot). As I said before, every deer that I have shot has been within 50 yards, most within 30.

Thanks for all the info guys. I should have posted here after the bear incident. The thought that it was a non-fatal hit makes me feel better about the ordeal. The area has bear but they are not especially plentiful. The high hit never occured to me but I was shooting down a steep incline - probably close to 45 degrees. That might have thrown off mt shot plus I was sighted to hit 2” high at 100 yards. The bear was around 40 yards.

I think you did an excellent job of convincing yourself to stay with the 308! For what you are using it for, seems to work perfectly..and the money you would have spent on a new .260. buy more 308 ammo!

Basdjs: I was planning to get the .260 in a Tikka T3 Hunter stainless bolt action. I was going to use it for deer here and antelope or mulies if I ever get the chance to hunt out west. The MPBR around 300 yards would probably make it a nice rifle for opn country.

I was leaning toward getting the BLR in .308 since I already have a lot of ammo for it. I don’t intend to put scope on it so the accuracy and ballistics are probably inconsequential. I am figuring it would be used within 75 yards. I tend to hunt thick cover and I like to track in the snow so quick target aquisition and follow up shots would be this rifles job. Right now, I am using a 60+ year old Winchester 94 in .30-30 for these trips. It fits well in a backpack. It was my father’s rifle so I hate to beat it up in bad weather when I am sleeping in a tent. A stainless BLR could fill this role nicely.

Maybe “cleanly” is the wrong word but if I hit where I intended (i.e. I didn’t hit high) I think I would have recovered the bear. I don’t expect to go back to BTs anyway unless long range shooting at smaller game. I like the added insurance of a bonded or copper bullet for when things go wrong. I screwed up with this buck last year (long story) but my accubond went through a sapling before dropping him. I was sold after that.

Several of the BT's have evolved over time. Jackets have been thickened, toughened for specific applications. So, the bullets you have today may not be the same when you buy them again. Unfortunately, Nosler doesn't publicize the information when the changes are made. We have to learn of it "at the back fence."

Like you, I have settled on the Accubond and have two lifetime's supply of what I shoot. Thus far, I have taken numerous animals with them and have yet to question them for any reason.

The .308", 165 grain Ballistic Tip is pretty stout. Since you're talking inside 300 yards you might consider getting some 4895 and loading to approximate old school Lake City match ammo at 2550-2600 fps. It takes the edge off compared to full throttle stuff at 2700+ from a 24" barrel, shoots well in most any 308 rifle, and will flat slay deer.

Theeck,

The 130 TTSX works fine on elk from the .308, so should do OK on close-range deer.

Having owned the 6.5x284 and .260 Rem for years, I'd agree with those recommending the 6.5 Creedmoor. More rifles to choose from and definitely a much better selection (and better priced) of factory ammo if you're ever in a pinch or just want to try a new bullet. A bit less recoil, too.

I have converted.

Theeck, Nice choices. I have the Tikka T3 Hunter in .260. You'll love it. I also do most of my treestand hunting with a T/C Encore in .260 because it's so light & compact. There's nothing not to like about the .260. My bet is that your current .308 will go into retirement if you get those two rifles.

If you own a 308 there is no "need" for a 26 cal.
SO WHAT?
We buy what we want because we want it. "Need" has little to do with it. Freemen buy what they want. Slaves are given what they need.

The 260 is the "American 6.5 Swede" and will match the Swede's performance on game with the same bullets going the same speed.
What's not to like?

If white tails are the only big game on the list, I can assure you the 26s will do all you'd every need them to do. And they do kick less, and can fly flatter, but the flatness of the trajectory is more a marketing ploy for a deer hunter, and had little to do with the real world. Even the 308 with a 180 grain flies flat enough for white tails, in 98% of the cases.

Instead of wrestling over the "need" just go get one and enjoy it.

If need for flat trajectory was really important to you the advice given above in this thread to just load your 308 at 3000-3100 FPS with Barnes 130 grain bullets is as good as any advice here. Works great and is less expensive then a new rifle and scope. But maybe not as fun.

The 110TTSX over 40 grains of 4198 is the "most for the least" that you're going to get in the 308. It'll kill anything that you want to shoot back East, and most of what you'll ever hunt out West.

As to flatness and recoil, the 260-120 does not have less recoil than the 308-130 load due to needing more of a slower-burning powder than the 308 loading. The extra flatness doesn't even show up until nearly 400 yards.

Having been a 260 user since 1997 when it was commercialized by Remington, and a 308 user alongside of it, it absolutely won't do anything inside of 400 yards that you couldn't do just as easily with a 308.

In other words, outside of a couple of niche applications at the extremes of the spectrum, they both do the same thing.

Thanks. I just ordered 2 more boxes of the 130 grain Barnes. As long as my rifle shoots them okay, it will fill the role as my soft shooting deer gun.
Once I get my money together, I’m going to buy the BLR instead of a .260. I’ll get it in .308 and use my leftover 165 grain Accubonds in it. It should make a nice rifle for snow tracking deer and as a compact, all weather rifle for backpack hunts in the big woods.