Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters Jack O'Connor's Pet Loads

I was giving this all some more thought overnight. I've been watching a lot of Youtubes in the evening. Particularly, I've been watching a lot of British comedy. In the middle of all of these, I watched some vintage American comedy-- stuff from the 50's mostly. Something hit me.

So much of comedy in America going back to the Depression seems to have been dominated by feuds. Hope had Crosby, Jack Benny had Fred Allen, and these were all somewhat mean-spirited in flavor-- if not in real life then at least they were portrayed that way. Hope and Crosby both hired writers to write zingers at each other. A classic Benny/Allen feud was Allen trying to get Jack fired from his show so he could grab the timeslot. It might or might not have been playacting, but it often broke out through the fourth wall and had the actors appealing to the audience-- even in the middle of a film.

That's something that the British comedy that I was watching didn't have. There was a lot of meaness going on, but it was all character to character and you never got the idea that Peter Cook despised Dudley Moore or Graham Chapman thought John Cleese was a git or any of that. I'm not criticising either comedy tradition here, I'm just making the observation. Obviously this animosity sold soap and cigarettes and rifle ammunition, so who cares?

Now we come to Keith vs. O'Connor. Look, I was a bit young to really appreciate the rivalry. As I said, my first exposure to all this was about 1965. However, looking back on it, I see this as a fairly common trope from those days. If you had two popular guys, you HAD to somehow make them rivals. Furthermore, there had to be a counter-plot where they were "really the best of friends and were just playacting." And third, there seemed to be a need to make the rivalry somehow spill out into real life. Being a child of the Sixties, I never got the joke. I was just seeing a bunch of old farts dissing on each other.

It did have a direct effect on my life, however. Being around all that feuding left that little kid in the barber shop certain that he had to take sides. To this day, I have a completely unreasonable and irrational dislike for the 270 Winchester.

Oh, and one other thing: I asked Angus' opinions on this. He was born in 1998, so he can give a representation of what a millennial thinks about all this:

Keith who? Jack what?
30-06? Best all all-around cartridge out there.
270 Winchester? Isn't that what women shoot?



As The Buddha says:

"You too shall pass away. Knowing this, how can you quarrel?"

And holding SHOTGUNS ! ! !


Jerry

You beat me to Larry Kohler and "Shots At Whitetails", one of the best books on deer hunting I've ever read.

Growing up and reading the "big 3" hunting and fishing magazines.......Warren Page was the gun guru at Field and Stream, Pete Brown at Sports Afield, and of course Jack O'Connor for Outdoor Life. Being a JOC fan, and because my father took Outdoor Life, I didn't read other two magazines all that much. I do know that Page championed the 243 Winchester quite a bit.

I think that the time period following WW2, and lasting maybe until the 1970's, was what I would call the Golden Era of hunting and fishing, and the magazines. It didn't cost a lot to go on a hunting trip, and it was easy to get permission. That's not the case anymore with hunting leases, and the way it's changed things.

Yeah, and I don't like SLOW BULLETS ! ---<Sig Line>




Funny, looking back how some people/things have deep affects.

Jerry

Thanks for the tip. I just ordered a copy off ebay for $6.

Jack Seville was some sort of boating writer from Florida.

Edwards wrote at least one book on Antique Guns.

Very true and stated very well.

I'm sort of a double fan of Larry Koller, for his writing and for the fact that he was the most well known proponent of the Savage Model 1920. About 30 years ago I stumbled across a Model 1920 that Larry was reported to have owned and was later able to confirm that bit of history from his son, Paul. Paul and his wife, Karen, lived in Bozeman, MT, and operated Missoulian Angler at that time. Paul and Karen were as nice a couple as your could ever meet. Funny thing is that despite living in Montana for over 20 years, she never lost her NYC/northern New Jersey accent.

That ain't a 50 Keith is holding. Looks more like an 1895!! probly in 30-06. Be just like him to endorse it as being just about right for tame mallards using head shots.

Guessing a LOT of 7X57 data was kept at mid level to be safe in the thousands of Mauser 93 and 95 surplus rifles extant .....

PrimeBeef-
This sounds like an interesting story. Where can I read more about it? Just curious.

Was he banned from NRA competitions, or was his membership in the NRA suspended? Both?

I'm away from my library for a bit, but I do recall that he wrote almost monthly in the 70s and 80s for American Rifleman, which seems odd for a banned member.

Thanks.
--Bob

Good read.. I read them all.. Charlie had one heck of an interesting life.. Maybe not something most folks would want to try, but darn interesting. I read O"Connor , but realized he was a writer first and shooter second.. Someone said he made a career of telling the average guy how great the .257 R. 270. and .30-06 were.. He made few if any contributions to the shooting world other than writing.. Keith was a big bore man first, last and always.. To me he was the real McCoy.. He had been a shooter since he was in knee pants and made several lasting contributions to the shooting world.. My favorite of all during those years was a modest man named Bob Hagel..

Didn't Larry Koller do most of his deer shooting with the 250/3000??

The 250-3000 and 30-40 Krag were two of his favorites.

Paul told me that when Larry died, he had over 1,000 rifles, and both liked and shot a variety of rifles and cartridges.

I remember Larry writing the 30-40.. I may even have it some where.. I think he cut the loading box off the Krag and it limited it to 3 rounds, I am not sure of the other modifications, but I remember that.. Also he wrote of wanting a single shot .25 Stevens.. Pretty cool guy.. Another article of his was Magnum Mission in Montana.. I know I have that one.. Nice thinking about the greats of the past..

Paul gave Larry's custom mannlicher stocked Krag to the hunting club that Larry belonged to in southern NY, the Eden Falls Hunting and Fishing Club, that at one time had a clubhouse/hunting camp somewhere along the Neversink River in Sullivan County, NY. There are some good pictures of Larry and his Krag in the 3rd Edition of SAW.

Besides gun writing and gunsmithing, Larry also designed a series of bass flies that now sort of collectible by people who collect such things. They show up on eBay from time to time.

Here's some good stuff to read again.

Excellent post. I agree.