Home Forums Reloading Varmint Rifles 17hmr, 17wsm, 223, 222, 204 ???

Beaver10, my experience mirrors yours. I ran some ballistic comparisons using the Hornady online calculator and it validated what I had been experiencing. I kept the information and will be happy to share it with anyone who would like it but it's pretty easy to get.

no doubt the heavy 223's wil do what You say but I like light fast bullets and blowups. Also I can see way more hits and misses with my 204. Realize it is a heavier rifle,XR100 vs my Montana Varmiter in 223.

Wind makes it tougher for sure. Where I live if you don't shoot when it is windy You don't shoot. Plus it is fun when You dial it in. Ammo is cheap,

2 dogs into the wind..........

thats a windy day.........

never too many purfect dog days.........this pic.....

last summer was one of my few...20 Vartarg....kilt approx 175 dogs from this hay trailer

went back next morn....kilt another 100 or so.......no wind & 75*...story book.......

yes was a virgin field.......100-600 yds.......owner wanted them gone.........

Boatammo: When you live in Oregon and drive to Miles, MT for 5 days of Prairie Poodle hunting every couple of years. Like you said, I can’t cry about the high wind that will usually finds me 2-3 days out of 5 and stay inside hoping for no wind. It is frustrating for an hour or so until I get my windage figured out. But, I take a lot of ammo expecting to burn rounds relearning what I forget from 2 years before.

Gotta love a ranch owner who wants shooters versus those who just poison their fields.

Tikkanut, I've commented on your rig before but I'll do so again. Is the micro cloth rag over the barrel wet? Also, I really like shooting from an elevated platform. Even a trailer, such as the one pictured, helps. What optics are you using?

that my man is a 'Sham Wow'

yes.....keep one in the cooler on ice/water......one soak & azz wet over the barrel

rotate them when the one in use dries out in the hot Utah 9% humidity

and/or grab a cool '20' in the bed of the truck..or 223AI.......

yes...the elevated trailer is soooo nice...the added 3-4' gives you a much better view.....

glass on this 20 Vartarg is Vortex HS-T 4-16x44..19/H322 & 40 V max..sweet set up....

older Salvage s/shot w/Accue trigger/small shank high mileage Pac Nor

probably pushing 7500 rds..but the 20-222 still prob my fav..........

Nice. Just another great use for the Sham Wow...

I have the HST 4-16x44 on a 17 FB.

Why you boy OHHHH &AWWWWWW the 204, for those of us that have gone
and made a 20 Practical....you end up with the same thing.. not factory ammo
available granted... but it equals the 204 pretty much...

and brass is easily formed by necking down 223, which is a major economic
plus if you have plenty of 223 brass....

frequently I can pick up 100 to 200 pieces of brass during each range visit..

one a comparison of bullets on the 204 and 223, instead of the same bullet
weight... you are getting a fair comparison, as the 40 grain 223 bullet will
have less of a BC, so of course it will not have as good as longer range ballistics
and wind bucking abilities as the 20 caliber...

a more fair comparison would be picking a 224 bullet, that has the same as, or
closest too BC of the 40 grain 20 cal bullet... say a 50 grainer in 223..

then compare the wind bucking results and flat shooting capabilities of the 204
and 223 then....your results will certainly yield a different result...

bump the 224 diameter bullet up to a 53 grain Plastic tip... the 204 will take
the back seat to that one...

your comparison as it stands shows immediate bias to the 204....20 caliber..

in the 20 practical, I shoot 32 VMax, or 24 NTX Hornadys....

I always thought the 204 was an answer to a question that wasn't really being asked...

John, I thought I would see a different result when using the 50 grain VMAX. BC still isn't equal to the 40 grain 204 VMAX. Drift in a crosswind is still higher than with the 204. Even downrange energy isn't as good. One has to go to the 53 grain pill before you get a better BC and energy but the wind drift in a crosswind remains higher than with the 40 grain 204 although both are significant. I didn't intend to show a bias toward the 204 but the numbers sure do cause one to pause.

some one say 20 Practical ? my other fav 20 cal.......pic during load development...2007 ish

40 V max & H4895.....12 twist...whacked off my 204R barrel & rechambered to PT..never looked back

that's also how I ended with my 20VT.......I occasionally run 32's in the VT.....but 40's is the norm

Geez all this talk of dog busting & its only January !

Thinking I might build a 20 Practical for sage rats. Which is the prefered bullet? Thinking 32 zmax.

Good morning Cliff...

I'll concede to your point of the 204, with the 40s then...

having a 204 barrel on a Ruger, I didn't see anything that impressed me with the 40s
over the use of my 223s....so I took it off... and then put on one made in 20 Practical..
which I run the 32 grain plastic tips... and my favorite is that 24 grain NTX lead free...

MV is achievable at 4750 fps... don't know about distance in a cross wind...
but under 200 meters, which is pretty where I shoot most of my sage rat shots
it sure can decimate a nice fat sage rats....

After trying a 204 barrel for say 2500 rounds, I wasn't that over all impressed enough
to deal with trying to round up the brass for it... still have the barrel...

If I need more energy waaaaaay out there... I just move up to the 22.250, which despite
the comparison you see written about it.. I'll handicap myself with it, and just deal with
those inconveniences and enjoy myself...

They all will work... I just prefer the 32 grainers and then that 24 NTX....

if you build one, and have a 223 die set or two already...

all you need to get, ( or the way I do it) is a Hornady Universal Neck sizing die..in 20 cal
which I got for $20 from Midway I think, or maybe it was Graf's...

I neck 223s down with the full length sizing die, spindle removed..
then use the Hornady Neck sizing die...

I deprime with a universal Decapping die, from RCBS when reloading..
the 223 die without the spindle serves as a Body Die..

the 223 seating die, seats the bullets with no issues...

considered their might be some run out issues, but haven't seen a lack of accuracy
in the field...

instead of wasting ammo in the field on the shots pass 200 meters, I just live
with 200 meter and under shots when in the field...

24 gr Lead Free NTX at 4750 MV, I like those in the field on sage rats....
racks high on the splat factor in my book...

sadly a season run kind of bullet...

4750? Is that a typo?

Good morning Higster....

nope 4750 isn't a typo...

had a picture somewhere around here with that reading on the Chrony...
in fact several right in that range...

if I find it, I'll post it....

or more like "if it turns up" I'll post it...

the 24 NTX being lead free, is actually alittle longer than the 32 V Max...

and this was out of a 20 Practical, not a 204.....

I thought the load was starting to get "hottt" in the 4850 fps range..

and as the questions arise by the naythesayers... yes the bullet was seated just in the case
and crimped... which was no issues as the Smith, chambered the barrel for the 40 grain lead
free bullet, that I think Nosler was making for a short while...or someone...

had a box of them and then wasn't available...

mine is on a Ruger 77 Mk 2 action...which in a previous life from the factory was a 243...
changed the claw extractor on it..and that's about it...

plus added the campfire hated Hogue Rubber Stock to it..

Dang. I'd almost consider being CA compliant to see that.

Almost...


I've been reading up on the practical and I'm thinking I'll buy a Criterion for my TL3 and give it a whirl this year. I have Type S .223AI dies set up in a toolhead on the 550 already, so swapping a bushing and powder die is all it would take to be running it sounds like. Got a bunch of h335 and Brassman Rem brass ready to go. 32 Zmax are pretty cheap at Powder Valley too.

I've been shooting 40's with the .223AI @ 4,025 and they are pretty fun. I bet the 32's would be too.

I know John over at The Brassman runs a 20 Practical also...

he only lives 3 or 4 miles from my place...

Loaded him up a bunch of rounds last year..

he has a boat load of 39 grain Blitzkings, guess he 'knows' someone at Sierra...

charged them up with CFE223....load was 29 grains IIRC....

John's a great guy, and a real pleasure to do business with...

I like the 40's.......but then I've got a stash......

32's in the VT........splat factor.......

Higbean.....when you're ready for the PT we'll steer you in the right direction.....

for example I use a 204R Forster seater die......best $50 you'll spend !

powders.....H4895..IMR8208.....Benchmark..pic.....this barrel is pushing 9K rds......