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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,205 Likes: 26
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,205 Likes: 26 |
Brad,
A lot of cranky old dudes also can't spell it.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.”
John Steinbeck
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,234 Likes: 27
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,234 Likes: 27 |
Any of the three will work--but I'll just note that the 6.5 Creedmoor does NOT just have an advantage beyond 600 yards. High-BC 140-147's in the Creedmoor started at 2750 catch up to typical 140 softpoints started at 3000 in the .270 at 300 yards--and drift less in the wind at any range.
I've hunted a lot with various 6.5's including the Creedmoor, .260, 6.5x55 and 6.5-06, along with the 7mm-08 and 7x57 (which is the same thing as the 7-08 in a different-shape case) and the .270. Have yet to see any difference in how they kill big game, but do know the Creedmoor offers lighter recoil and less wind-drift.
That said, why change horses now? As prairie goat suggested, the present 7mm-08 in an adult stock would work very well. I agree with you and half the other guys that suggested upgrading the stock.
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
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Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 21,916 Likes: 7
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 21,916 Likes: 7 |
Don't know if any one thought of it, but I don't think the PGC will let anyone use a 6.5 mm anything on elk in PA. If I remember correctly, must use a 270 or larger.
Suggest keeping that thought in mind when choosing. Yes, but you could easy spend two lifetimes trying to get an elk tag. I would worry about that bridge if you ever see it.
Parents who say they have good kids..Usually don't!
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Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 9,031
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 9,031 |
hell the walmarts here carry the creedmoor ammo. if walmarts has it, everyone has it
FJB
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 30,294 Likes: 2
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 30,294 Likes: 2 |
Brad,
A lot of cranky old dudes also can't spell it. John, so true... I fixed it 
“Perfection is Achieved Not When There Is Nothing More to Add, But When There Is Nothing Left to Take Away” Antoine de Saint-Exupery
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 17,491
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 17,491 |
Buy a high quality, adult-sized stock for the 7mm-08. Absolutely no need for a new rifle. Bingo
Sometimes, the air you 'let in'matters less than the air you 'let out'.
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 57,494
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 57,494 |
vapodog,
Mathman already pointed out that the 6.5 Creedmoor has been a "flash in the pan" (of "the latest fad") for over a decade now. It's already chambered in the majority factory bolt-action rifles in the U.S. but in Europe, and starting to become one in Europe. More ammunition factories start producing it all the time: I just got a press release from Sig Sauer on their new 6.5 CM ammo.
I'm no longer surprised to read posts where older shooters claim the Creedmoor is just the latest fad, because I've also noticed a lot of older shooters are unaware of rifle history, whether relatively recent or decades ago. But somehow the "Creedmore" seems to result in more examples of aggressive ignorance, as a friend of mine so aptly puts it. With all due respect Jphn, 1. This is not Europe....and lets pray that we never will be..... 2. While I do live way out in the "sticks"....you almost ,can't get here from there....I've yet to see any ammo of any kind marked "Creedmoor" anywhere I've been that sad, I'll keep my eye open for it and if I see any in the ensuing weeks, I'll post a retraction. A couple years ago I searched Denver for some.35 Whelen ammo to no avail.....My party had a spare gun so merely continued to our elk hunt in New Mexico. I shall always contend that having ammo is far more important than not having "better" ammo. Man I'd be willing to be against that statement as big as Denver is, you'd have had to had 35 whelen somewhere. Of course as liberal and anti gun as CO is lately, it could be true. I know in a town of less than 4000 as a youth, we had 35 whelen ammo on the shelf of 2 gun stores. And we'd have sure had the creedmoor ammo if it had been around as popular as it is.
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 57,494
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 57,494 |
think really hard about adding a .223 Another great alternative. Different enough from the 7mm-08 to open up some interesting opportunities. That would be my option, too. 1:8" twist .223 would give him everything from small game to Whitetail/Pronghorn if he so desired as well as some great varmint hunting and out around 600yd target shooting if he were to have a sporter length barrel. Ed Some folks have been known to target shoot 223s to 1000 and remain supersonic with a 20 inch barrel. FWIW. LOL
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
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Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,484 Likes: 12
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 10,484 Likes: 12 |
A of old cranky dudes don’t want to spell it.
I prefer classic.
Semper Fi
I used to run with the hare. Now I'm envious of the tortoise and I do my own stunts but rarely intentionally
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Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 5,197
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 5,197 |
A of old cranky dudes don’t want to spell it. That's right, they'd rather assume they know all about it, without ever having shot it, or seen it shot.... It's here to stay....trust me.
Luck....is the residue of design... ![[Linked Image]](http://i423.photobucket.com/albums/pp311/patrickgsinclair/96zvyt.gif)
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Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 5,197
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 5,197 |
And I don't even own one.....
Luck....is the residue of design...
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 16,512
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 16,512 |
In America, the adage, bigger is better, is deeply ingrained.
That said, lest I remind folks, Alan on the fire, dumped his elk at just shy of 1,000 yds, using a 6.5x47 Lapua.......
Shot placement with proper bullets thru vitals ends the discussion every time. Re: the BR and 47 comments above, those two have been the most enjoyed rounds of all I have shot in my lifetime, superbly accurate, and light recoil and blast. They kill with no fuss. And most would say those rounds are a smidge BEHIND the CM
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Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 2,499
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 2,499 |
Like most of the folks who have responded to the OP's questions, I would go with the 7mm-08 first and a .270 second. I would replace the stock of the 7mm-08 with a MacMillan, but one with the correct LOP.
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Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 2,499
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 2,499 |
The reason the Creedmoor is so popular is it does so many things so well... were I starting my kids out today they’d be equipped with rifles so-chambered.
Positives:
Extremely accurate, affordable ammunition available everywhere and is loaded to the gills.
(270 ammunition - and even some 7-08 ammo - is incredibly anemic).
Makes best use of the commonly used 2.8” SA magazine.
Twisted correctly from the factory.
Recoil is minimal.
Varmints to elk capability.
Negatives:
Cranky old dudes don’t like it.
Cranky old dudes can’t spell it. Does it mean that there aren't "super accurate" .270's and .7mm-08 rifles? I understand that gun makers must find the way to sell guns, and that specially some gun writers push the new guns, but in reality there are all kinds of .6.5's (.264's) that are just as accurate. Some even launch their bullets at the same speeds as the now "super accurate" 6.5. https://skyaboveus.com/hunting-shooting/65mm-Cartridge-Virtual-Shootout-Which-is-Best
Last edited by Ray; 04/04/18.
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 5,936
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 5,936 |
Let him pick, there are no wrong choices. If he likes his current rifle, get him an adult stock that fits. Take the extra money and buy reloading components. Let him shoot the barrel out practicing. Then rebarrel it.
If he shoots the gun enough to warrant a new barrel, everything he hunts with it will be in serious trouble for the rest of his hunting days.
Arcus Venator
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Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 43,971 Likes: 25
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 43,971 Likes: 25 |
I don't shoot enough(or far enough) to bother making the switch from a couple 270's to 6.5's.
Brad mentioned starting his kids on the 6.5, hell if I was starting over I'd start myself on one.
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Joined: Mar 2011
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 4,874 |
The cool thing about keeping the old rifle and changing parts out is that it is “customized” and special, not another off the shelf rifle that everyone else owns.
A Mcmillan swirly or Edge stock, money put into a quality scope, eventually a new barrel (whether in the same chambering or perhaps rebarreled to a 6.5 Creedmoor). A personalized rifle, all with the soul of the rifle (the action) still there to maintain the memory of all the days in the hills and dead animals it has helped the son take to the ground. Good points PG. OP - I'd take a 700 in a really nice stock over any factory budget to midrange rifle. Not sure what you had in mind, maybe a custom? Still, I'd restock, but if the kid has his heart set on something, I'd listen.
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,385 Likes: 3
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,385 Likes: 3 |
A of old cranky dudes don’t want to spell it. That's right, they'd rather assume they know all about it, without ever having shot it, or seen it shot.... It's here to stay....trust me. That may very well be true, but the few advantages are wasted on the majority of people that don’t need or couldn’t use that advantage.
I was thinking the other day how much I used to hate Bill Clinton. He was freaking George Washington compared to what they are now.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 23,660 Likes: 1
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 23,660 Likes: 1 |
but I'll just note that the 6.5 Creedmoor does NOT just have an advantage beyond 600 yards. High-BC 140-147's in the Creedmoor started at 2750 catch up to typical 140 softpoints started at 3000 in the .270 at 300 yards--and drift less in the wind at any range.
While that is actually correct as stated, it's somewhat disingenuous & not exactly apples to apples, in making a comparison with a High-BC 140-147 in the Creedmoor to a 140 softpoint in the 270. But using a 143 Hornady ELD-X in the Creed & a 145 Hornady ELD-X in the 270 at your stated velocities, & a 200 yd zero, JBM shows less drop for the 270 at 1,000 & a whopping 0.4 MOA more windrift in a 10 MPH, 90* wind than the Creed. And the 270's velocity is still higher at the 1,000 yard mark. Or run the 150 Nosler LRAB at 2950 in the 270 & the results are still the same. The Creed is a nice round & I like it & it has a lot of pluses in it's favor, but given better bullets in the 270, there's just no real performance difference from a ballistics standpoint according to the ballistic gack data that I see when making a fair comparison. MM
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Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 3,639
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 3,639 |
Does it mean that there aren't "super accurate" .270's and .7mm-08 rifles? I have a .270 Winchester featherweight that I put together from used parts I scrounged up on the internet....it has turned several dime sized groups using Swift A-Frames 130 grain. (yes...three shot groups) If one is a benchrest shooter, this don't cut it at all....but for a simple old hunter.....it's pretty darn good.
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