Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters Mule Deer-->280 Rem. Velocities!!!???

Hi John and other members,

I have always noticed statements being made, in reloading manuels, about the .280 Remington velocities as being a twin to the .270 Winchester. However, when I have compared the two cartridges the .280 Ackley Improved does not seem to ever equal the custom 26" barreled 270 that I have hunted with for over twenty years. I have owned a .280 Ackley Improved with a 26" barrel that I gave to my youngest son. This improved .280 has done pretty good. BUT, the 26" .270 achieves 3,150 fps with a 140 grain Barnes X Bullet. I have also noticed the same thing with normal
barrel length(22"-24") for the two cartridges. HMMMMMMM?

Do you have any insights and experience that you can share with me on my observations of the two cartridges? Perhaps my experiences do not truly match up with everyone else who has experience with the normal .280 Rem. vs .270 Win. AND the .280 Ackley Improved. vs normal .270
cartridge with a 26" barrel.

Glenn

The SAAMI maximum average pressure for the 280 is 60,000 psi I believe. The 270 is 65,000 psi. If you are using factory ammo that may be the reason you are seeing the velocities you are seeing. When loaded to the same pressure and all else being equal, the 280 should equal or slightly better (due to the larger bullet diameter) 270 velocities.

roanmtn,

That hasn't been my experience with either the standard .280 or .280 AI. Was easily able to get 3100 with 140's in my first .280, a custom rifle with a 23" barrel, and almost 3200 with my present .280 AI's 22" barrel.

HI Mule Deer

Thanks for your speedy reply and also JayJunem. Will you share your loads for the .280 Ackley Improved? I really like RL22 but have also been moving all of my rifles handloads to powder not temperature sensitive. I will be working up loads for my younger son that does not reload yet.

Thanks

roanmntn

I had a 280 built on a Mauser action with a Douglas barrel that with 2 inches more barrel would not equal what my 270 did with 140 gr. bullets. I didn't load to a certain pressure just to the point I thought the loads were safe and the 280 just was not as fast with 140 or 150 gr. bullets. I don't know why but it was a nicely accurate rifle. My 280AI does live up to it's potential but it doesn't really put out enough more velocity to make much difference, though it is also a very accurate rifle.

roantree,

I've generally gotten very good results with 140-grain bullets in the .280 with H4831. Today either version, "short cut" or traditional, provides the same results within the normal variations of powder production. I used the 139-grain Hornady Interlock Spire Point with 60.0 grains in my first .280, a 23" barreled custom rifle by the late Dave Gentry, for just about 3100 fps. In my latest .280, a Sako A7 with a 24-inch barrel, I used 58.5 grains with the 145-grain Speer Grand Slam, also for just about 3100 fps. Both loads used Remington cases.

In the .280 AI I've gotten top velocity with RL-22 and Ramshot Hunter, around 3175-3200 in 22-24" barrels. In my experience Hunter is more temp-resistant and RL-22, but still not as good as some other powders. I'd try H4831, RL-23 or IMR7977.

One problem with the .280 AI is a relative lack of data, and what there is often is around 60,000 PSI, not much more than the standard .280's relatively wimpy pressure levels. As a result I've often pushed published maximums a grain or two, with never a problem.

As a side-note, I generally load bullets heavier than the 139-145 grain range in the .280 AI these days, due to higher ballistic coefficients, which make a much larger difference in downrange performance than extra muzzle velocity with lighter bullets. In my present 22-inch barreled .280 AI among my my favorite loads is a 168 at 2950 or so with 62.0 grains of Reloder 26.

here `s my thought about the standard 280 Remington : its a very fine cartridge,great accuracy just great hunting round. but here`s what a see as a FFL dealer ,a reloader and people who want a 280 Remington that`s not a reloader either. it seems most standard manufactures do not offer many if any models in the 280 rem. ,same with 280 rem. ammo not much to choice from if you can find 280 ammo. seem`s a dang shame that American standard rifle and ammo manufactures can dictate what you can use at a reasonable price in a way . It won`t be much longer and we as looneys if you want to buy a new just a normal priced decent rifle you will have a choice of about 5 or 6 different cartridges and it won`t be a 280 Rem. ,unless you want to do the custom rifle way for much more money for a different cartridge. look`s like if you want a nice 280 Rem. rifle you need to find a decent used rifle sometime. wish you all luck a got a couple 280`s for myself,Pete53

That looks like a very good load.

Been shootin' my current 280 Rem for the better part of 20 yrs. I started out with H4831 and 140 gr bullets. Over the yrs I've tried just about all of those 4350 - 4831 burn class powders. My favorite powder for a good many seasons was RL-22. REALLY good results with 150-160 gr bullets. Many, many deer with that combo.

A few weeks ago I found a really good deal on some IMR 7828. 15 per lb. I bought all they had. Been working on a load with it. Finally settled on a load after shooting today.

https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/galleries/12865885/imr-7828

Thanks Mule Deer

I just ordered & received a one lb container (and other powders) of Rl23. from a reloading supply house near Chattanooga, Tn. Rl23, H4831 and
IMR7977 may be the just the ticket I need.

I live in Johnson City, Tn and have had had a terrible time finding H4350 Powder. I've been following all the conversations on this forum about the disappointment everyone is experiencing while searching for H4350. Mule Deer, I owe you and the other people on this forum a BIG THANK YOU
for telling me about IMR4451. I am ordering a small supply and will experiment to see if it works for me as it has worked very well for all of you.

Mule Deer, the most important magazine story that has totally influenced my shooting was your story about Loads That Really Work. This was a continuation/update of one of your earlier stories. I didn't even know that new powders were on the market that were not temp. sensitive. I had taken a many years vacation from my beloved reloading addiction and was not current on this when I read your article.

Thanks for helping. I'm looking forward to you and all of the other people here commenting on the 280 Ack. Imp.

YOU"RE RIGHT WHEN YOU SAY THERE IS A SCARCITY OF RELOADING DATA FOR THE .280 ACKLEY IMPROVED. I can't locate many loads for the .280 Ackley IMP.

roanmtn

280AI load data:

http://www.hodgdonreloading.com/data/rifle


https://load-data.nosler.com/load-data/280-ackley-improved/

The data for the 280AI on the Hodgdon Reloading site is pretty anemic. Nosler's 280AI data is a much better representation of what the 280AI is capable of.

WiFowler

Just checked out the Nosler site and you are right about the loading data here being better.

Thanks

roanmtn

I have bought the last two versions of the Nosler reloading manuals. They are excellent manuals. I’ll probably by the next one that comes out also. I hope they expand their powder selections to include RE 26 and some others.

Tag

The 280 A1 will replicate 257 Weatherby velocities with the 110gn TTSX
The mid range 150-160 grainers will replicate 7mm Remington Factory ammo

This is not a slander upon the the 257 or the 7mm but rather a separator as it leaves the wonderful 7mm Remington open for use with the 175 grain Partitions which is a very competent place to be for a traveling hunter.

My own 280A1 is a Winchester parts rifle put together with a 22" XTR 7x57 barrel rechambered to 280A1 into a new OEM Winchester Featherweight composite stock. Weighs 6.8 pounds neat and under 7.8 scoped and loaded. My best loads achieve:

110gn TTSX - 3353fps
120gn TTSX - 2218fps
140gn TSX - 3200fps
145gn TTSX - 3040fps
150gn Nosler BT - 3076fps
150gn Nosler Part - 3000fps
154gn Hornady SP - 2923fps
160 Accubond - 2966fps
169gn Partition - 2958fps
175gn Accubond - 2774fps
175gn Partition - 2782fps

John

And though the numbers are good there isn't an incredible performance edge over the 270 other than at the heavy bullet end.

The 270 Winchester is NOT the standard by which all others are measured. Hate to disappoint.

True that would be the 30-06. However the 270 is certainly the cartridge to measure the 280 by.

The higher BC’s of the 7mm bullets is where the edge is!