Home Forums Hunting & Shooting General Big Game when to shoot and learning lessons

EllieMae,<BR>I felt your orignial post on the other site was kind of insulting, after all, who are you to demand accountabilty ?<BR>You've called Indy a rookie hunter, and made all kind of insinuations about his ethics as a hunter. The fact is you don't know him, and you wern't there. <BR>I agree that there are way to many so called hunters out there who should never be sold a licence, but IndyJay isn't one of them.<BR>I spent a week hunting with him, and I can tell you that he is an experenced, ethical hunter who tried his best. He has tremendus respect for the animal he's hunting, and I know he feels bad about drawing blood but not harvesting the animal.<BR>Nobody would take you to task for starting an honest discussion about field shooting & a hunters responsabilty to make a clean kill, but all you did was to try to make yourself look bigger by belitteling someone else.<BR>I am hopeing to share a hunting camp with Indy next year, he's a great person to hunt with, I dought anyone would say the same about you.

Thanks to all who have supported me. Tim, Anaconda, et. al...<P>To Ellie Mae. Your point is well taken and one that needs to be taken seriously. We all need to respect the game we hunt and I think, by and large, we all do. <P>I learned a valuable lesson on that mountain that morning. One that I'll never forget. I'm a better hunter for it, too. <P>We all have the same goals, here. We just voice them differently. Let's all move forward. I think about that incident too much as it is. I don't need to see it in black and white every time I log on to the forum.

I was going to just drop this, but I guess I'll make one more post. I think Indy Jay understood my point. It was never to take him to task for his shooting. I've screwed up shots before, I admitted that right away, and I'm sure most of us can say the same thing. And all the generalizations and stereotypes that came out in THIS thread were definitely not directed at him personally. It was just venting about unrelated crap that we see out there every fall. On the other (original) thread I never made any accusations or insults towards him. In respnse to the hostile, and arguably juvenile, reaction I got, I did leap to the conclusion that the incident was the result of an inexperienced hunter succumbing to excitement or peer pressure or whatever, and taking a shot that he shouldn't have, and then not fully understanding the implications. Turns out I was probably wrong, at least partly, but it was in no way insulting, at least not to Indy Jay it wasn't. I did insult some of the others, and they deserved it.<P>What I hoped to do was discuss HOW and WHY it went bad, with the hope that we could all learn how to avoid it in the future. What kind of shots are the most risky, how target practice and actual field shooting are very different, the commitment to doing it as perfectly as humanly possible, even at the risk of blowing the opportunity, how there is no shame in going home empty-handed, cooler heads prevailing, etc, etc, that sort of stuff. What I often see is that sometimes people make mistakes, and instead of thinking about the why and how, they just let it go and don't think about it and leave open the possibility of making the same mistake again. That was honestly my intention. <P>And I do understand the anguish you feel after losing one. I've been there. I certainly didn't intend to rub salt in any wounds. That never even crossed my mind.<P>If my words were misleading, then I apologize to IndyJay for that, but I do still stand by my opinion that much of this whole mess was a result of some of the others leaping to conclusions about me, and in fact looking for a fight themselves, rather than thinking about what I said. It wouldn't be the first time.<P>Nuff said, okay? -al

[img]images/icons/crazy.gif" border="0[/img]

OKAY by me... now, I need to get out to the range and start working on a new elk load! Thanks Ellie!

HEY BIG SKY..... THAT HURT, from a friend I thought... [img]images/icons/crazy.gif" border="0[/img] (REALLY IT DID)!!!!!!!<P>To the OThers, glad it all worked out. ELLIMAE, Sorry that you got a BIT ruffled. I was Afield WOUNDING my own elk and couldn't step in (PS THAT WAS JUST A JOKE....).<P>-BOSS-MAN at the "other" (Jerry SPRINGER {As Rick Bin here calls it [img]images/icons/wink.gif" border="0[/img]) forum .......

I stand before you accused, but innocent of any such crime.<P>I like Mossie, I mean Moosie's place. [img]images/icons/laugh.gif" border="0[/img]<P>Rick

RICK... I know you like me ... (EVERYONE DOES) [img]images/icons/laugh.gif" border="0[/img] [img]images/icons/laugh.gif" border="0[/img] Just a conversation we had awhile back on the phone.. [img]images/icons/wink.gif" border="0[/img] ... [img]images/icons/tongue.gif" border="0[/img] <P>We'll talk soon !!!!<P>-J. SPRINGER

Jer-RY ... Jer-RY ... Jer-RY!<P> [img]images/icons/laugh.gif" border="0[/img] [img]images/icons/laugh.gif" border="0[/img] [img]images/icons/laugh.gif" border="0[/img] [img]images/icons/laugh.gif" border="0[/img] [img]images/icons/laugh.gif" border="0[/img]<P>Rick

I really hated to bring this to the top again. I dont think Indy did anything, that any normal first time elk hunter hasnt done. In the outfitting business we find MANY MANY elk every year dead in the trees , ungutted and the shooter had either not found the elk or had not bothered to look. It was my understanding from the origional post that they were hunting in two feet of snow. It is hard to lose a wounded elk in two feet of snow or one inch of snow if it is bleeding at all. The problem lies in the fact that sometimes there is no exit wound......and that means little or NO BLOOD, either gut shot or bleeding internally, for the most part, and that elk are very tough to get down. I preached and preached spine shots, and shoot till ya have yer foot on em, and this is one instance of many that happen every year. I dont know what Indy was shooting at the elk with or where the elk was hit, but genaerally you can track them down with enuff time and dilligent looking. We tracked a few down this year. It happens, and ya sure feel bad when it does, but lessons are also learned from experiance. Dont feel to bad about it Indy, I would bet around 20 percent of the elk that are wounded are never recovered. bcat

EllieMae&IndyJay,<BR>And most of you in between.<BR>I'm sitting here at this computer on the second day of Deer Season only because I am thinking about yesterday's LOUSY shooting.<BR>Just like Indy,I blew a shot that should never been taken. It was at a Whitetail Doe at about 100 yds in the Woods.She had been chased from the other side of the mountain,and was moving at a steady trot. I was sitting on a stone wall,and moved my foot onto it and rested my elbow on my knee.When she approached a litle "keyhole" in the Woods,I aimed right behind her shoulder,and fired. The shot rang out without that reassuring "solid" sound,and she showed no sign of being hit. She did a 180 turn and went back up and over the mountain. It was easy to see where she was when she jumped and turned,and there was no blood;no blood anywhere on up to the top,where I lost track of her. I circlued around,looking in vain for any sign.<BR>Thinking back,I know that I hurried the shot,Called it a hit too far back,but,in fact,it went way off the mark.<BR>Just a year ago,on Opening Day,within 100 yds of this spot,I shot a 6 pointer at 100 yds along the mountain,(different direction)and dropped him dead on the spot. That deer made the mistake of stopping,and looking back. For me,it seems that a moving deer at 100 yds is just as bad as a running deer,up close.<BR>I will be back tomorrow,but I WILL be more choosey,If I shoot.<BR>Frank