Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters Hunting Knife Blade - Flat v. Scandi

Gents:

I was going to ask this on the blades forum, but this one gets a lot more traffic. When processing game, of the two (flat v. scandi grind) which blade edge do you prefer and why?

Thanks

RM

I'm no expert. I have to look up the grinds to be sure I'm naming them right. I have not used a scandi grind. I used a flat ground old Gerber A 425 that I believe is a chrome plated M2 tool steel. An old Buck 102 I bought in 1976 it is sort of a hollow ground saber. My favorite is my Beretta Loveless licensed drop point that is a full hollow ground. The old Gerber is also one heck of a knife. They are cutting tools though and aren't designed to do a lot of prying or hard usage like a Marine corp of Randal Bowie

When processing I use a couple of Havalons.

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It doesn't matter as long as the blade is thin. Most scandi grinds start with too thick a blade imho to be a real good game knife. In fact most knives are too thick at the edge for my taste. The makers have to leave room for idiots who will try hack through bone with a delicate, sharp edge or wannabe survivalists who try to split logs with a 4" knife and a club.

A scandi is usually easier to sharpen for beginners because of the zero, or near zero edge with very little secondary angle. I do however prefer a flat or convex with a thin profile edge and very small amount of secondary bevel which can be just as easy to sharpen as any scandi and slice a little better imho because of the longer more gradual angle.

I use flat, hollow, and scandi grind knives every year to process game. I remember the first scandi grind I received from Charlie May. I thought it would be nice for rough stuff but probably wouldn't do to well on game.....I was wrong. The edge is the edge...you cut with the edge, not what's behind it. Charlie's scandi grind comes to a fine enough edge that I can't tell a difference on game. I've used his scandi grinds on every thing from deer to pan fish...and done a lot of "work" with them as well. If the grind was obtuse then I'd guess there could be a difference but if the scandi angle comes to a fine edge it's going to cut just fine.

By processing, do you mean butchering? If so, I prefer actual butcher knives and now that I think about it mine are flat ground. I don't think it's the grind, necessarily that makes me like the knives so much as the actual shape and thinness of the blades. The handles are comfortable as well.
If we're talking field dressing, I like my Anza LP. 3.25 inch blade that happens to be scandi ground. For greasy stuff like bears and pigs I like my Cold Steel ATK. The blade is longer and has more belly and most important to me it has a sticky rubber handle.

Hey! Whatdya know! PHOTOBUCKET WORKED!

If you need a tool check out what the pros use and if you plan on cutting meat pay attention to the sort of blade butchers use

Thanks for all the responses. By processing I mean skinning, disjointing, removing backstraps, etc. mostly either in the field or cleaning rack at camp. I've used Havalon, Mora (you won't cry if you lose it or someone "borrows" it), Outdoor Edge, and a very inexpensive Gerber folder (which I used most of the time). The Mora is the only Scandi-grind blade among them, but it cuts very well. It is also pretty thin, not leaning towards the thicker bushcraft blade design. I was just wondering what most of you use since like guns, people have strong opinions about their knives as well.

The full flat grind or scandi grind seems like you are taking more steel off to re-sharpen them. If you never let them get dull and mostly strop the edge then not an issue. My preference is for hollow grind with a convex edge. These are easier for me to sharpen and faster to take an edge. The same as other grinds never let them get really dull and a leather strap is all you need. I usually use two or three blades and switch before they get dull. I use a clever, Bowie or other dedicated blade for disjointing or cuts that will hit bone. An actual skinning knife makes this task so much easier. I use a Dexter Russell or Victorinox skinner the most for this, the thin blades are easy to keep sharp.

My preference in blade shapes is very similar to Snake Rivers.

My field knife is a Swiss Army knife and a 52-100 blade 4" sheath knife made by Wes Whipple. Those are the only 2 I use and I have used the Whipple knife now for about 20 years and the Swiss Army Large Lock blades for about 40 years.

At home or in base camp, the best advice I can give was already given by 458Win;

"If you need a tool check out what the pros use and if you plan on cutting meat pay attention to the sort of blades butchers use"

I have a convex edge on my hunting knife, and can't figure out why I'd want a flat or scandi.

You're talking about the edge and we're talking about the blade profile. You can have a convex edge on a flat or a scandi ground blade Youper.

The biggest thing a man needs to skin and process a deer or other wild kill, is knowledge of how to do it. What to cut and when and where and sometimes, just how to make the cut, are the most important aspects of processing wild game, from birds to moose. And how one keeps the game clean also affects the final taste greatly. You can't ride the carcass around half the day showing it off in the hot sun and expect it to taste really great. Also, many tend to want to hurry the process up, and not wash out the interior body cavity, and even the exterior, properly and thoroughly. Their meat will be lower grade also, than those who just let it take however long it takes, and simply follows good proceedures.

As to the knives directly, a thin blade does indeed cut more easily when slicing any sort of meat or most anything else up. If the blade is thin enough (@ .030" is probably near the best - the same as most kitchen and "butcher" blades come from most sources) it'll slide through meat with less resistance than a thicker blade steel. That's measured at the spine, of course - the edge will be MUCH thinner. But .060" isn't bad, and is stiffer, which suits some purposes a little better than a strict slicer. I generally like a good bit of belly in my processing blades, because it spreads the load of cutting out over a longer portion of the edge, and thus, the sharpness lasts longer before having to resharpen. I have a really nice D2 custom knife with 5" long, 3/16" thick spine, and is basically shaped very Bowieish, with a lot of belly and a long clipped point culminating in a sharp point for piercing whatever needs piercing. I also have a Benchmade "survivalist"/Loveless style blade of @ 3/16" thick spine. Its edge has a fairly long straight section with nearly all the belly in the end 30% of the blade.

Most custom "hunting knives" seem to have 3/16" thick spines, for strength. If I had to do mine over again, I'd likely make the blade a little shorter and the blade stock a bit thinner, like @ 1/8" stock.. Mine is flat ground and I think I'd go with a hollow ground blade now. Live and learn! Knives are like houses - you have to buy one before you really know what you want and really need.

I love the Scandis, and the Mora's are surely priced right and do a very good job of most things. ragweedforge.com is a great place to find a wide selection of them for many uses, including fishing and kitchen use. The comment above about folks trying to drive a knife through bone and other stuff is very much agreed with. I've done it, but it's never really satisfactory. A really good, sharp hatchet is MUCH better for splitting the backbone and even the sternum, and I'm just a deer hunter, but I'd assume for disjointing the big bones on game bigger than deer. Again, Mora makes a really good, sharp, tough hatchet that most will probably like a lot. And it's very reasonably priced, too.

The main thing, if you want to get the job done quickly, safely, and efficiently, is that the knife be made of really good steel. Here's one place the Scandi knives often beat much of the competition. I forget what steel they use, but it is hard, holds a really good edge, and lasts a good, long while, in spite of being so economically priced. I wish they had a version with a bit more belly, though. I guess it's like the Rolling Stones sang: "you can't always get what you want." Oh well ....

Another thing that really helps the dressing and cutting up of game meat, is a good butcher's steel. I just bought a new one branded "Accusharp," and it's been very good. Just a few swipes with the edge trailing, and it's very sharp all over again.

One last thing: If an edge is to last well, the angle of the edge needs to be constant and flat, unless you're hacking as much as slicing stuff. A convex edge can indeed hold its edge a bit longer, but it doesn't slice as readily or easily as a good, consistent flat angle. A butcher's steel also tends to work quicker and better on such an edge as well.

Every knife is a compromise of some sort, and one knife CANNOT "do it all," though most knives can be perform well beyond their design intent, if needs be. But a knife is one of our most basic, elemental and necessary tools, and using it beyond its design parameters does NOT do you any great favors!

It takes a good bit of skinning and cutting up carcasses to really learn what works best for you. I've skinned out and field dressed well over 300 deer, and I'm still a little ambivalent (or maybe I should say "tolerant?") about the knives at hand to use, provided it's SHARP. A dull knife will hurt you a LOT faster and worse than a sharp one, PROVIDED you keep your mind on your work. If you can't or won't concentrate on the job before you, it's probably best to pay a processor. It's a LOT cheaper than Emergency Room bills! I'll never understand women who can't or won't learn to use a sharp knife in the kitchen! Oh! And one more thought about knives - if you slice tomatoes and like stuff much, a serrated edge really makes you look like a pro, if you keep them sharp. I like Cold Steel's kitchen type blades for many things, and their aggressive serrations really make slicing tomatoes and the like child's play. They also work well for slicing up the meat after it's off the bone, too.

For skinning, a somewhat less than razor edged knife does best because it's hard to cut through the hide, and potentially ruining it, with it. But that's where less than razor sharp blades really lose a lot of their usefulness.

I have a couple of Helle knives with Scandinavian grind edges, and for field dressing and skinning I think they are great. They hold their edge really well, and are easy to touch up using a flat diamond hone the size of a credit card which I keep in my wallet.

For boning out and such however, I think a thin and slightly flexible blade works better, for me at least. The Helle's have quite a thick and stiff blade. What I usually do is gut the animal where it drops, and then get it back to camp and break out the knife roll, in which I have a folding gambrel and a couple of knives such as are sold to slaughtermen and butchers - a Wenger Swibo boner and a Victorinox Fibrox skinner. I also have a steel and a folding saw. I use these to break the animal down for the fridge.

Jeez you guys make it complicated, but once I did too. Except for field dressing I use a quality 6 inch semi-stiff ( ) boner like a Forschner. Same with my cousin who cut meat at Morrel's for ages. Have a quality steel, use often.

And a 10 inch curved slicer for long straight cuts like steaking. Great for watermelons too.

No saws except to split the pelvis and sternum and that's field dressing. Bone dust and marrow don't taste good.

PS: Never wanted a skinner. Trick is to let the carcass hang a day or so to let the hide loosen. Then you can almost pull it off.

I think the most important thing is to have a razor sharp knife for taking a critter apart. I carry a 3" custom hollow ground drop point fixed blade my wife gave me over 20 years ago. I don't even know what steel it is, but it could be ATS34 or 440C. It stays sharp a long time and has proven to be a tough little knife that works well on moose, caribou and bear. I also carry a 3" folding ATS34 Blade Tech that is about 20 years old.

I carry a Havalon with extra blades in my pack and like it also. I don't want to sharpen a knife after the critter is down as it is either going to rain or the skitters, no seeums, white sox, or some other horde of man eating insect invariably shows up in August or early September.

As I said, super sharp and thin is the most important thing and much of the rest is personal preference. Depending on who is taking a critter apart, a saw and ax may come in handy and one guy I talked to liked using a battery powered reciprocating saw on moose. He packed it in his monster truck.

My wife and daughter gave me a SOG Pillar for Christmas and it has a thin 5" clip point CPM S35V blade that I will try out this fall. If it works I may turn it into a drop point.

So many knife designs are available and there is more then one way to skin a critter, clean a gun and make bean soup!

Not sure I understand,
You recommend .030-.060 thick blades. That's thiiin!

You wish your knife was 1/8, that's .125. A goood bit thicker than pro butcher knives.

I talking about the blade profile as well.

I'm now trying to picture a convex blade.