Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Winchester Collectors Range report -- 1949 M70 .257 Roberts

I took the 1949 Model 70 .257 Roberts to the range today

This is the gun with a period correct Weaver K2.5

I was all over the paper at 25 yards. So I decided to take the scope off and try the iron sights. It turned out that the Weaver rings and the Weaver bases were both very loose. I had forgotten that I had most recently mounted the Weaver k2.5 very loose only for the purpose of some photos. I did not put the Weaver back on and went to the irons.


The first set of 8 rounds at 100 yards with Nosler polymer tips are below. I was aiming at the bottom of the bottom target. I am quite high and a bit off to the left. But the iron sights, even though with my 61 year old eyes I could barely see the rear leaf, gave me a group of about 5 inches. Three of the bullets made one hole.


Then I went to Winchester ammo. 5 shots at 100 yards with the irons, again aiming at the bottom of the bottom target. Again quite high and to the left. About a 4 inch group:


My plan to is find a scope, mount it well and see what the gun can do.

That'll work man! I bet it'll be a shooter when she's scoped up. Beautiful rifle you got there.

That rifle is not showing its full potential with that 2.5x scope or iron sights. Put a 2-7x Leupold on it like I have on mine and it'll shine, I had a similar vintage Roberts and it was very accurate.

Great shooting for iron's! I am betting with a good optic on top it'll shoot like crazy.

Beautiful rifle!

I went down the period scopes road too and missed a cuople great shots at deer and coyotes, put good glass on and you'll be way happy! gunswizard knows what he's talking about1

It seems we all have our own ideas about what to do with old rifles. I'm speaking mostly of Model 70's here. I guess to a large extent it depends on the condition of the rifle and how you change the value by doing whatever you choose to do.

I am not a collector. My interest in old rifles is to learn about them and try to leave them alone so people will have an "intact artifact" to learn about after I am gone. But I don't use them as my primary "hard use" hunting rifles. I have more modern rifles for that (although they are M 70's and it seems they are now increasing in value as well.) My point is it is easy for me to leave an old rifle alone. If it was my "go to" hunting rifle I would likely be willing to make more changes.

I try not to do anything that is not "reversible."
I won't cut an original butt, but I do like original stocks as I believe that is a big part of learning about them as they were made back in the day. So if I want a pad I use a stock someone has already cut.
If a barrel is worn out, it is worn out. Sometimes you can find a decent original barrel.
Having said all that, I am happy to use modern scopes. Those are "add on's" that are easily changed.

But I can see the allure of using period correct irons or glass as part of the "learning and experience" process. However, at my age open sights severely limit my range. Who needs a fifty yard .270?! I can do better with a receiver sight, but even then I have some issues. I can do pretty good work with a receiver sight and a Lyman 17A front using the correct insert. I guess that is still period correct, even if a bit unconventional.

I have period correct scopes on my rifles that I only punch paper with, all rifles I hunt with are equipped with modern Leupold scopes. Period scopes for the most part were not fog proof, don't need a fogged scope spoiling a hunt.

gunswizard, I couldn't agree more. That's why I am happy to use modern scopes. If that buck of a lifetime steps out, I won't be handicapped by my 69 year old 1949 .270. But I sure wouldn't want a scope that old!

I just hope that he isn't too far away if it is the day I decided to "go retro" with the old M94 .30-30, no matter how much I have optimized the iron sights!

Best,
Gun Doc

Hunting's not for me. My fun is punching paper with vintage guns. There is definitely a certain nostalgia to using a period scope on an old rifle, but they sure don't help me hit the target!

I hope to find a modern 1-4x20 parallax free at 100 yards that will do double duty on the Model 70 and my 5.56 black rifle.

I wish good hunting and/or good shooting to all!

If paper punching is the sole purpose of a vintage M70 or M54 and "period" optics are desired, there is an alternative solution- do what our fathers/grandfathers did in that situation and mount a Unertl/Fecker/Targetspot scope on it and go to town. There are target scope blocks (bases) that attach by using the factory holes in the receiver ring and pressed into the rear sight dovetail, which negates the need for non-factory drilled and tapped holes. Optics on those old target scopes were excellent, far better than the glass found in vintage hunting scopes, they for the most part offer infinitely variable parallax correction, high magnification to allow putting the crosshairs on a small aiming point (8x-20x typically), and positive micrometer windage and elevation adjustments (which also coincidentally allow for easy swapping around between different rifles, just make a note of the calibrations before taking it off the gun). One scope can service several rifles.

The downsides are both minor and major. They are large (long), but hey, if you're only lugging it to the range and not into the deep dark deer woods who cares? They are also getting expensive- since they're no longer made, pricing is subject to the whims of the used scope market. Expect to pay at least what a higher end Leupold costs (I bought my most recent Unertl in March, an 8x 1 1/4" for $500), and up into the upper $hundreds. But like any other quality optic it'll literally last forever if taken care of, and like I said one scope can be swapped around onto different rifles.

I too am mostly a paper target shooter anymore and love the old stuff for that purpose. Those that never see the rigors of the hunting fields are equipped with vintage target scopes (and/or aperture sights when I'm feeling like a challenge). Those that are dedicated toward hunting use are equipped with either aperture sights or decent modern optics (and sometimes both). My pre-64 M70 hunting rifle, a .30-06, wears a 3-9x Leupold and a Lyman 48. My M54 hunting rifle, a .30-30, wears both a Lyman 48 sight and is shot on the range with a 12x Fecker target scope.

I acquired my '53 257 Roberts model 70 with the stipulation it was to be hunted with. I shot 1 deer with the old Weaver K4, but I elected to upgrade the glass to a Vortex 1-4, for my son. He's taken four deer with it. I was able to find a lefty 257 Roberts so now I have my model 70 back. No regrets of using modern glass on a classic chassi.

I put a Swarovski Z3 on my 1953 Mod 70 it’s they are a killing team. Low light, any light, or bright light. No regrets putting good glass on a great rifle and it extends hunting time by 30 mi utes on both sides of the day. We can hunt legally 1 before/after sunrise/sunset. Could never do that with a period/vintage scope. The older scopes were revolutionary in their time but seeing is everything when hunting. Punching paper... whatever you enjoy because that’s why we do it.