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Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 132,038 Likes: 64
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 132,038 Likes: 64 |
I split the difference and carry a Para-Ordinance P45-14. Or, a S&W M&P in 40S&W.
Actually, I basically agree with the previous poster who put accurate and determined at the head of the list. I've talked to a few who have been in gunfights and that seemed to be the determining factors. A larger bullet and more of them may be helpful but they are superfluous if one does not hit the target. My nephew, a cop with the Phoenix PD, routinely grabs his AR whenever he's approaching a potentially armed encounter. He took a shooter out with one round from his AR just a few months ago. He was the first to arrive on a call about a guy wandering a neighborhood on foot shooting at random houses. Upon the command to drop the weapon, the guy turned his weapon on him, and he dropped him instantly with one shot, DRT. His policy seemed to work out well for him in that case. No handgun round can hold a candle to 5.56 in stopping power.
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Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 1,518
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 1,518 |
Weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon.
Wheres my weapon. Hand me my weapon. Hold my weapon. Look at my weapon. I bought a weapon. I need to clean my weapon.
What kind of weapon is that? I carry a weapon. I will shoot my weapon. I deployed my weapon. I holstered my weapon. I secured my weapon. I shot my weapon. My weapon comforts me.
Last edited by glockdoofus; 08/16/18.
I AM THE GOOD FRIEND OF RENEGADE50.
HE MENTORS ME.
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HE CALLS ME OUT WHEN I AM LYING.
HE CARES GREATLY ABOUT ME.
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Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 1,518
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 1,518 |
Arming law enforcement with a firearm that carries more and more ammo is certainly not the answer. Regardless of the caliber.
Only reinforces the spray and pray mindset that is already out there. There are civilians out there that are also in danger of the whip it out and mow them down attitude.
I AM THE GOOD FRIEND OF RENEGADE50.
HE MENTORS ME.
HE PUNISHES ME WHEN I AM WRONG.
HE CALLS ME OUT WHEN I AM LYING.
HE CARES GREATLY ABOUT ME.
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Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 132,038 Likes: 64
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 132,038 Likes: 64 |
Weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon.
Wheres my weapon. Hand me my weapon. Hold my weapon. Look at my weapon. I bought a weapon. I need to clean my weapon.
What kind of weapon is that? I carry a weapon.
What the hell??
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Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 11,730 Likes: 7
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 11,730 Likes: 7 |
Weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon, weapon.
Wheres my weapon. Hand me my weapon. Hold my weapon. Look at my weapon. I bought a weapon. I need to clean my weapon.
What kind of weapon is that? I carry a weapon.
What the hell?? What else would you expect from a doofus?
Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats.
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Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 1,518
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 1,518 |
I AM THE GOOD FRIEND OF RENEGADE50.
HE MENTORS ME.
HE PUNISHES ME WHEN I AM WRONG.
HE CALLS ME OUT WHEN I AM LYING.
HE CARES GREATLY ABOUT ME.
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 17,220 Likes: 9
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 17,220 Likes: 9 |
This reminds me of a 45-70 vs 257 Bee comparison for hunting. Everything has its place. If I had to choose an all around cartridge for LEO, I would go 357 sig, then 9mm, 45 and then 40. IMO.
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Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 1,518
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 1,518 |
Here is the address for 50 round drum magazines for a Glock handgun. https://www.gunbroker.com/item/780340130A couple,of those hung on the belt plus one in the WEAPON so it can be DEPLOYED with a line of fire that would connect with10 to 15 round would be nice. Where the other 40 to 35 rounds goes would be the fault of the person or property in the way.
Last edited by glockdoofus; 08/16/18.
I AM THE GOOD FRIEND OF RENEGADE50.
HE MENTORS ME.
HE PUNISHES ME WHEN I AM WRONG.
HE CALLS ME OUT WHEN I AM LYING.
HE CARES GREATLY ABOUT ME.
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Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 132,038 Likes: 64
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 132,038 Likes: 64 |
Here is the address for 50 round drum magazines for a Glock handgun. https://www.gunbroker.com/item/780340130A couple,of those hung on the belt plus one in the WEAPON so it can be DEPLOYED would be nice. Been there, done that. ![[Linked Image]](http://i176.photobucket.com/albums/w188/TheRealHawkeye/IMG_0416_zpsarh0hulw.jpg)
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Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 1,518
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 1,518 |
do you carry that OWB or IWB?
I AM THE GOOD FRIEND OF RENEGADE50.
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Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 132,038 Likes: 64
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 132,038 Likes: 64 |
do you carry that OWB or IWB?
LOL.
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 18,352 Likes: 1
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 18,352 Likes: 1 |
So in the 380 to 45ACP all being about equal, where does the FN 5.7 fit? Inquiring minds want to know.
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Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 132,038 Likes: 64
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 132,038 Likes: 64 |
So in the 380 to 45ACP all being about equal, where does the FN 5.7 fit? Inquiring minds want to know. Who knows. But the FN handgun that shoots it has a reputation of having iffy reliability.
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Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 1,518
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 1,518 |
With there being no advantage to the 40 S&W and the 45 Auto I wasted my time at the range this morning. I shot the 45 Auto and a few 10MM and i felt good about it. Now I am depressed and am going to try to cure that depression by stuffing myself with food so I will be miserable tonight after I go to bed. I must be punished someway. Especially for shooting the 10MM.
I am now going to crawl in a hole and pull it in on myself only to peak out just enough to breath. If i deserve that much.
I AM THE GOOD FRIEND OF RENEGADE50.
HE MENTORS ME.
HE PUNISHES ME WHEN I AM WRONG.
HE CALLS ME OUT WHEN I AM LYING.
HE CARES GREATLY ABOUT ME.
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 4,933 Likes: 1
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 4,933 Likes: 1 |
I believe I was reading post here in the Handgun forum about Bob Stash from Chicago PD and Tim Gramins police office involved in shoots seem to have come to different philosophy's after their shoot out.
Bob Stash has philosophy of using the biggest bullet you can shoot accurate with him being fan of 45acp. and likes the single stack Sig P220
Whereas Tim Gramins started off with Glock 21 in 45acp but after his shoot out and almost run out of bullets, he switch to 9mm due to capacity with extra magazines.
Interesting in regards to their different philosophies drawn from their experience.
Was curious where members here stand in their opinion? Carry the biggest round (45acp) you can shoot accurately with some reduction in capacity or are you in the 9mm high capacity camp?
This is probably a load and controversial topic but hoping to keep it somewhat civil and give your opinion as why you choose what you did. Thanks for humoring this question!
Lt. Stasch's shootings were part of undercover or tactical team operations actively targeting hardened criminals, with shooting at very close range. He carries an single-stack SIG P220 on duty but a double-stack SIG P228 off duty, so it looks like he takes both approaches. Those choices make sense for him, but there’s a big difference between what he needs and what the standard civilian concealed carrier needs. You also have to bear in mind that he joined the Chicago PD in 1981 and had his first shooting in 1983. Ammo has gotten WAY better since then. It’s interesting that in his interview with Mas Ayoob, they spend as much time talking about ammo as they do about guns. Okie John
If Montana had a standing army, a 270 Win with Federal Blue Box 130's would be the standard issue.
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Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 1,518
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 1,518 |
Wonder if the Liberty Civil Defense HP in 45 Auto at 1800 fps from a Glock M30 is as powerful as the 9MM?
I AM THE GOOD FRIEND OF RENEGADE50.
HE MENTORS ME.
HE PUNISHES ME WHEN I AM WRONG.
HE CALLS ME OUT WHEN I AM LYING.
HE CARES GREATLY ABOUT ME.
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 17,220 Likes: 9
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 17,220 Likes: 9 |
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Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 1,518
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 1,518 |
Yeah. Now we are headed somewhere. What can we get that will equal the 9MM? I have two. Little did I realize what I actually have. My 10MM's and 45 Autos now hold nothing for me. I now have on order a couple 50 round mags for my Glock. Now my life is fulfilled and I can now return to happiness personified as my now departed Mother used to say. 🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡🤡👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍😃😃😃😃😃😃😃😃😃😃😃😃
I AM THE GOOD FRIEND OF RENEGADE50.
HE MENTORS ME.
HE PUNISHES ME WHEN I AM WRONG.
HE CALLS ME OUT WHEN I AM LYING.
HE CARES GREATLY ABOUT ME.
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 10,194
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 10,194 |
I'm watching a video now of a cop that was shot several times with a 45 fmj and shot the assailant with his 40 cal 180gr Ranger sxt several times. Things I've taken away are; the human body is unimpressed with pistol rounds. A reload will cost you more than 2 seconds in a 6 second gun fight.
Do they make one of those 50 round mags for my Shield?
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Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 1,518
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 1,518 |
I'm watching a video now of a cop that was shot several times with a 45 fmj and shot the assailant with his 40 cal 180gr Ranger sxt several times. Things I've taken away are; the human body is unimpressed with pistol rounds. A reload will cost you more than 2 seconds in a 6 second gun fight.
Do they make one of those 50 round mags for my Shield? Did the Cop have a vest on? Where was he hit. Where was the perp hit by the Cop? Do you know these type of things? Were the 45 Auro FMJ rounds a RN style or a FN style? So now where do we go? Should we start carrying an Encore single shot in 223 or maybe 243 to have a capable handgun? Maybe learn to speed shoot with it using a wrist ammo holder and practice "speed" shooting with it? Would that work? Maybe someone could come up with a semi auto like the Kel Tech 22 Win Mag that will hold 30 to 50 rounds that we could use when we DEPLOYED our WEAPON and also offer 100 roind drum magazines for it as a more comforting option. 30 to 50 rounds of 22 Mag released in the general area of the bad guy after DEPLOYING our WEAPON would be confidence inspiring.
I AM THE GOOD FRIEND OF RENEGADE50.
HE MENTORS ME.
HE PUNISHES ME WHEN I AM WRONG.
HE CALLS ME OUT WHEN I AM LYING.
HE CARES GREATLY ABOUT ME.
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