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Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 34
Campfire Greenhorn
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OP
Campfire Greenhorn
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 34 |
I have 2 Portagual assembled BARs. I got a 7mm with a leupold for 600 and a LNIB 308 for 650. I feel good about those purchases. I have a opportunity for a 69 belgium 270 grade 2 condition 90% plus, with the elk and antelope etching. Price 900. Trying to figure out what kind of a deal this is. Gunbroker is kinda all over the place from 700 to 1200. I dont know yet the prices and worth of the old belgium ones. Any info would be great. Thanks for the time .
Give Doc the shotgun. They'll be less apt to get nervy if docs on the street howitzer ...
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Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 28,813 Likes: 4
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 28,813 Likes: 4 |
FWIW, my gauge on this stuff is what it's worth to me, not what I stand to make on it later on after I'm finished drooling on it. I like old Brownings and have a reliable supplier when I get the itch.
Maybe you should check with a collectors' group or forum instead of a bunch of shooters.
What fresh Hell is this?
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,582
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,582 |
Hey there Nugget, firstly welcome to "The 'Fahr" Your question is valid. Various regions price certain brands and styles of guns differently. When I traveled Utah and Michigan regularly to visit family...I could for example buy Auto 5 shotguns reasonably in Utah and sell one now and then in Michigan for a good bit more. While in Michigan I could buy Winchester 12s reasonably and my dealer friends in Utah were happy to take all I could bring in at a good profit... for both parties. There is a local and a regional best price for most used guns. Of course high grade Brownings with box and papers "ANIB" are always in demand...90% 'ers...not so much, unless you see several at your local range on sight in day.
Watch 'Yer Topknot!
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Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 34
Campfire Greenhorn
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OP
Campfire Greenhorn
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 34 |
Both have good points. Thanks for the input.
Give Doc the shotgun. They'll be less apt to get nervy if docs on the street howitzer ...
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 5,844
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 5,844 |
$900 sounds maybe a touch high but not too far out of line. It comes down to how much do you want the gun. I know I've paid a bit more than market average on a few guns over the years because they were ones I really wanted. I like BARs. My wife had one of the older grade 2s in 30-06 that we traded off back in our gun swapping days. I recently bought her a replacement, though not a grade 2. I don't think you'll get hurt at $900 on it.
Chronographs, bore scopes and pattern boards have broke a lot of hearts.
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Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 4,377
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 4,377 |
Dad bought one of the first Belgian made Grade 1 BAR's and we called it the one shot automatic. Those early ones only had one ejector pin in the bolt face to kick the case out and it wasn't enough in dad's .308. The thing stove piped the fired case most of the time. We sold it for what we bought it for which back in the late 60's they were going for $165.00 new. The later BAR rifles had two ejector pins and were better. I always thought that they were too heavy especially in the magnum versions.
My other auto is a .45
The bitterness of poor quality is remembered long after the sweetness of low price has faded from memory
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 26,337
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 26,337 |
love my '06 bar. made by FN, assembled in portugal.
had a 300 winchester. same thing.
sold it, kept the '06.
it's a meat gun.
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Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 34
Campfire Greenhorn
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OP
Campfire Greenhorn
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 34 |
Alright i like learning. When did the BAR go from a single pin to a double pin extractor. Was it when they are assembled in Portagual?
Give Doc the shotgun. They'll be less apt to get nervy if docs on the street howitzer ...
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Joined: May 2016
Posts: 3,736
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 3,736 |
I knew one gent ( I was 16 then) who had one in 30-06 that only worked right with the 180gr. This was on Texas Hill country deer and he didn't like it that much, most ran a long way after the shot. He tried a Model 100 Winchester in .243, but it was a jammomatic with everything. When I got out of the Army in '73, I bought a new BAR in 7mm Rem Mag. It was too heavy, and jammed regularly. Traded it off. Tnrough the years I watched the hewer ones that friends used (still Beligum made) work swell in .243 and .270, plus one guy had a 300WM. In 2001 I bought an older Beligum model in .270, had it cleaned thoroughly, reblued, etc and it was a gem. I had it until last year when Obammacare Tax Man almost ruined me, sold everything. I did buy an even newer one (Japanese I think) years ago for a friend, in .338WM, that had the side bolt release. ( I ddn't care for that lever at all!) I had the rifle Magnaported, a Decelerator pad added and it works just fine. He wanted a bonafide elk rifle ( he had no money then, I did...then) is very recoil sensitive. Its a kitten. So, as mentioned, in some parts of the country, people revere them...in others they are just one step above a good boat anchor!
Last edited by Jim_Knight; 11/04/18.
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Joined: Feb 2009
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 8,073 |
In my opinion there is a great difference in the two. The older made in Belgium is a much better rifle. I’ve owned both with the Belgium model being better made and more accurate. Hasbeen
hasbeen (Better a has been than a never was!)
NRA Patron member Try to live your life where the preacher doesn't have to lie at your funeral
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 29,383
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 29,383 |
In my opinion there is a great difference in the two. The older made in Belgium is a much better rifle. I’ve owned both with the Belgium model being better made and more accurate. Hasbeen A gunsmith friend told me that the old ones would shoot their buttstocks loose. I shot my buddies 7mm Rem mag and not only was it deadly accurate, the trigger was better then any other BAR I have shot or owned. It was an old entirely made in Belgium model. I like the Wood better on the old models.
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 46,247 Likes: 1
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 46,247 Likes: 1 |
I bought a 1969 year model all Belgian BAR Grade II here in 2011 for 750 bucks shipped, beautiful rifle, I let a bud talk me out of it, have been thinking about buying another, fine, fine rifle, accurate too with 225 gr TTSX's at 2800 fps.
Trump Won!
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 10,383
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 10,383 |
I have Browning BARs: 1969 338WM 1980 300WM 1990 338WM Here is a pic of some BAR gas regulators. They are really a pipe plug with a little hole drilled in the end. But the diameter of the hole is important. One of the regulators is the old original one. One is a new one from Brownells or Midwest gunworks. One is a home made one that I made out of round steel stock on my lathe. From my notes: Quote: The regulator is just a 9/16-24 ultra fine thread bolt with a hole in it. If FALs have adjustable by pass gas, BARs have fixed jets. a) 7mm Mag is .066" hole b) 300 Mag is .077" hole [p/n B3176146] c) 338 Mag is .059" hole d) My home made is .078" hole e) recoil buffer [p/n B3176065] What does it all mean? You want to load hotter, use a bigger hole. You want to load wimpier, use a smaller hole You want a custom regulator? Buy one with a smaller hole and drill it out to match your loads. Don't fabricate one from scratch like I did the first time.
There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self. -Ernest Hemingway The man who makes no mistakes does not usually make anything.-- Edward John Phelps
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Joined: Jul 2006
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 4,829 Likes: 1 |
The BAR rifle has never been made in Japan, not that there is anything wrong with that. The early ones were made in Belgium, and the newer ones since at least the 80's are made in Belgium assembled in Portugal.
"Men must be governed by God or they will be ruled by tyrants". --- William Penn
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Joined: Dec 2006
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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This really makes me want to shoot mine and see what they are like. I have 4, 7mm Rem mag, .30-06, .243 and .338. I tried to sight in the .243 one time and found that it needed horizontal windage adjustment to zero, which I did not have at the range. They are neat guns, but heavier than I would want to carry in the hills, which is also where they would really shine with the barrel length and quick follow up shots. I need to work less, shoot more and have fun!
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Joined: May 2016
Posts: 3,736
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 3,736 |
The BAR rifle has never been made in Japan, not that there is anything wrong with that. The early ones were made in Belgium, and the newer ones since at least the 80's are made in Belgium assembled in Portugal. I didn't know that Pard, thanks for clearing that up. At any rate, that .338WM of my buddies has only shot the Winchester factory 200 NBT load. since my buddy is recoil sensitive, I saw not need to try anything heavier, and that 200 NBT ( coated Winchester) has a good rep here in Utah.
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 46,247 Likes: 1
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 46,247 Likes: 1 |
Well, Thanks to this thread, I done it yesterday, found and purchased a beautiful 1969 year model BAR Grade II in 338 WM, just like my old one , I have a cherry set of gloss Conetrol bases and rings for a BAR, I now need to find an equally clean gloss 1.75-6, 2-7 or 2.5-8 Leupold. Loaded up some nice medium powered handloads for testing yesterday evening featuring the 210gr Partitions over H-4350, cant wait to get this put together, then on too the bench and woods!
Trump Won!
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Joined: May 2016
Posts: 3,736
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: May 2016
Posts: 3,736 |
Congrats! I think you will find it is a great killer and doesn't 'tear up" as much game as many high velocity smaller rounds! It "really shines" on hogs! Want to test "penetration"? shoot a big hog lengthwise! have a ball pard!
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 46,247 Likes: 1
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 46,247 Likes: 1 |
Congrats! I think you will find it is a great killer and doesn't 'tear up" as much game as many high velocity smaller rounds! It "really shines" on hogs! Want to test "penetration"? shoot a big hog lengthwise! have a ball pard! Thanks Jim, have had a couple buds that don't like BAR's and ask me why, I can hear and feel the BAR's and A-5 shotguns working while firing them, I think it's cool as hell, plus, it's a testament to the genius of John Moses Browning and FN. I'll shoot up a couple boxes of the 210 NPT's then build a load with the 250 NPT's for everything else later. the 210's at an accurate and easy 2800-2850 should do fine for now.
Trump Won!
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Joined: May 2013
Posts: 1,520
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: May 2013
Posts: 1,520 |
I’ve got a Belgium .270 that I inherited about 10 years ago. Was my grandfathers only cf rifle since the late 60s and he would shoot probably 30-50 pigs, coyotes and deer a year with it. I’ve shot it probably 500 rounds since I’ve gotten it. Never had a jam and it’s as accurate as any bolt rifle I’ve ever owned. Other than a pre Garcia sako I think anyone is going to have a hard time finding more vintage rifle for the money they are selling for
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