Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Elk Hunting Montana shoulder season ,poorly run

How much stupid can you possibly emit? You have no facts to go by, you are just emotionally upset with no clear reason. The grass issue has been debunked more than once on this issue and you continue to rant.

In Central ND

Always see plenty of grass when I go into the mtns.

Pete53 eat a dick stay the [bleep] out of Montana. Your an idiot

Haha that’s funny!!! Haha

Nah, It’s just your turn today. Tomorrow they will be bashing us “Liberal’ Colorado Elk hunters.

I just returned from a successful shoulder season cow elk hunt on a very large private ranch.
We did a 3/4 mile stalk on a small herd in howling wind, took a nice dry cow with two shots at about 175 yards.
Ranch is very active in taking kids and veterans on hunts.

I shot a cow the Saturday after Thanksgiving on public land. Great solo hunt that took me an hour each trip to carry out each quarter.



The grass on the mountain was thick and lush.
The federal farm bill payments are public record and easily found online.
Slob hunters don't just hunt the shoulder season. I have seen crazy hunters during the season.
And the only person I have known from Wisconsin has a very distasteful habit of telling everyone around her how Wisconsin does everything better.


How exactly is the sky falling and the end of hunting near?

He's just getting warmed up.

Well said KRAKMT.

Give him a day or two and he'll be over it. Until next month......

Pete53: I have Hunted the "high country" right in amongst "cows" in the fall and there have been countless times I have seen Elk feeding in the same mountain meadows as "cows", this over a period of 50+ years now!
"Cows" and Elk indeed both eat grass but I have never seen a public land leased area where "ALL" the grass was gone.
Now heres one I am sure you won't believe but I am going to relay it to you anyway.
Back around the year 2,000 I had occasion to be watching television here in SW Montana when on comes a 30 minute program describing a long term study that the U.S.F.S. and the Montana Department of Fish, Wildlife and Parks made addressing the issue of Elk vs. "Cows" on publicly leased grazing lands!
The study took place over many years and took place in one huge area north of Dillon, Montana in the Mount Haggin and Fleecer Mountain areas and in between!
The study was intended to reveal any harm the "cows" feeding on leases that were in traditional Elk habitat.
The biologists would alternate closing large areas to cattle grazing and then opening them and moving the "cows" to adjoining areas!
Without exception over the course of the study the Elk would prefer to feed on the areas that had been recently cropped off by cattle!
The Elk actually followed the cattle as they were alternated in areas and fed behind them.
Back and forth they tested this situation and it kept proving up - the Elk preferred to feed on areas the "cows" had fed on!
The theory was then put forth that the "cropped" (fed on) mountain grasses grew back with MORE protein in them after being "mowed down" by the "cows"!
The premise of this theory depends on the ability of Elk to smell/sense or some how tell that the cropped grasses have more protein in them when they start growing back!
It was interesting to watch this puzzling to me program but they actually filmed the collared (tracked) Elk following the "cows" to feed.
Now you can call B.S. on this premise if you wish but before you do I advise you to contact a game biologist of the Montana Department of Fish, Wildlife and Parks to see if they have views on "cows" harming Elk feeding habitat.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

close a mountain area of 50 square miles for 20 years,clean up the rancher`s cow mess`s 1st year, replant those mountains, fix the muddy streams ruined by cows then do 20 years no cows then do this study. the s cow/elk study these Montana biologist did is wrong way> do it like I said no cows for 20 years in mountains 50 sq. miles then show me the stats. your study sounds like RMEF study for the ranchers,guides and big money people with political influence to benefit themselves again,yes and they control Montana fish,game and parks who make the lease agreements in the mountains for cows and cover up any cow problems in the mountains and then give out elk control permits on private property . I got some real nice swamp land for sale too if you believe that crap .

Have you ever actually been in the mountains in Montana?

There are not grazing leases and cows on every square mile in our mountains. I've lived and worked in the Montana mountains since 1975, and the only problem that I've ever seen from cows is the introduction and spread of the weed "hounds tongue".

Specifically, what plants have the cows eliminated that need to be replanted?

What streams are muddy and ruined by cows? I've enjoyed fly fishing in Montana's clear mountain streams for the last 43 years, many of those streams are in areas that have cattle leases.

What proof do you have that RMEF does studies for "ranchers, guides, and big money people"? Like I posted earlier in this thread, I've been friends with the Montana FWP biologist who was in charge with the Wall Cr Wildlife Management Area south of Ennis. His studies WERE NOT influenced by ranchers, guides or big money people.

And finally, grazing leases on National Forest lands are NOT made by Montana FWP, they are made by the US Forest Service.

I suppose it would be too much to ask that you have any idea what you are talking about before posting?

I'm embarrassed that I've actually tried to respond reasonably in this thread rather than just calling it what it is. Forget the factual shortcomings such as the original premise that a shoulder season hunt ruined a bow hunt (different seasons), or the fact that shoulder seasons exist only on private land where you cannot apparently hunt, or ignore this new absurd idea that MT FWP regulates grazing on Federal lands. You cannot hunt and you blame it on every one else. Look no further than the mirror to find your problems. Sure, we had a tough bow season; the rut was weird and less predictable than usual. I blame the full moon that occurred at peak of rut. Yet many people still arrowed bulls while you could not. We shot elk in wilderness that is leased NF land in rifle season, but you could not. You sit and whine, blaming others for what you could not accomplish. The fact is many of us kill elk on public land every year and you cannot. If private land was made available to every goon it would get pressured just like current public land and you would not be able to kill elk there either. If elk numbers were 50% higher you probably still couldn't kill elk because 2x0 is still 0. And your failure is the root of this whole thread, right? If you had stumbled upon an unfortunate critter none of us would have been subjected to this nonsense.

By the way, why did you buy swamp land? Did you buy from ignorance, like a MT elk tag, and just assume it would work itself out?

I've seen this tactic before. Wisconsinite perch fisherpeople and pheasant hunters will do this to shortcut their scouting process in ND (probably other places too). Moan, whine, complain, tell you that everything your state's G&F dept is doing is all wrong, blah, blah, blah.

THIS IS A PLOY!!

The motivation behind this is to find someone gullible enough to "prove them wrong" and give up a honey-hole, or even better (in their eyes) take them hunting to a honey-hole AND show them how to hunt it. If successful, that's now "Their Honey-Hole" and they'll hunt it annually with a dozen or so of their closest friends, and the honey-hole giver-upper won't be invited, thanked, or acknowledged in any way.

Pete53 is looking for a giant sucker.

LOL, if ol pete worried about stuff like that, he'd have to stop posting altogether.

I can't speak to elk, but we've had 4-5 year stretches with no grazing followed by 4-5 year stretches with cattle. The cycles with cattle we see more of every kind of wildlife and have less trouble with invasive plants. I think cattle help much more than they hurt provided you dont' complely overgraze and run it into the ground which very few people probably do these days.

You both are clairvoyant.
The stupid is strong with this one.
Pete please explain where the elk go when the snow hits?

We had the experience of " mob grazing" second calf angus/sailers cross cattle.

We had a lot of lush feed new seeding ( clover, brome, orchard-grass, some Timothy ).

Them pot lickers would get their fill then start mowing down the dead crusty underbrush of unworkable ground that had had years of neglect.

U can't believe how it improved the aesthetics of the property! Properly managed they did us right proud!

Hopefully we get them back this year!

The only down side was they were crowded so tight all the bulls in the mob became tit suckers!

The most interesting observation was there was one cow that selectively harvested knapweed first!

I wanted to purchase that one!