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Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 96,017 Likes: 19 |
As a child I was given this question: If you have to accept Jesus to be saved, what about the native in deepest, darkest Africa who is barely aware that there's an outside world much less Jesus. An otherwise good guy, does he go to hell? Is that the act of a mercirciful, loving and just god?
This sidesteps the most important question tho; why does God save ANYONE if He is just? We all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. God is a Spirit, infinite, eternal, and unchangeable, in his being, wisdom, power, holiness, justice, goodness, and truth. Man is by his nature fallen and sinful. The fact that God would come in human form and sacrifice Himself for ANYONE is amazing. As He said to Moses, He will have mercy upon whom He will have mercy. He did it because He made us in His image and loved us, as I know you are aware.
Ecc 10:2
The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but that of a fool to the left.
A Nation which leaves God behind is soon left behind.
"The Lord never asked anyone to be a tax collector, lowyer, or Redskins fan".
I Dindo Nuffin
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
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Simple logic demands that if there truly is only One God, any prayer made to any Deity will be heard by the Only Deity, regardless of the name applied by the one praying. That Deity, Jesus, will judge the sincerity of the request. ' Pretty close to Catholic doctrine actually, stated differently, So a Muslim praying to Allah is close to Catholic doctrine? Jesus is mentioned in the Koran but not as God. He's just a mere man. Praying to Allah will be heard by that 'mere man' and he won't be pleased.
“In a time of deceit telling the truth is a revolutionary act.”
― George Orwell
It's not over when you lose. It's over when you quit.
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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Bring back the German Pope. I'd like to share a beer and prayer with Benedict. This one is a loser. Yeah,the one who was in the Nazi Party.Good choice.
Its all right to be white!!
Stupidity left unattended will run rampant
Don't argue with stupid people, They will drag you down to their level and then win by experience
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Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
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Freaking unreal cult love by NH. Blasphemy.
Ecc 10:2
The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but that of a fool to the left.
A Nation which leaves God behind is soon left behind.
"The Lord never asked anyone to be a tax collector, lowyer, or Redskins fan".
I Dindo Nuffin
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Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 96,017 Likes: 19
Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Jan 2016
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Bring back the German Pope. I'd like to share a beer and prayer with Benedict. This one is a loser. Yeah,the one who was in the Nazi Party.Good choice. How about the ones who had fish on the Friday menus? 
Ecc 10:2
The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but that of a fool to the left.
A Nation which leaves God behind is soon left behind.
"The Lord never asked anyone to be a tax collector, lowyer, or Redskins fan".
I Dindo Nuffin
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Joined: Mar 2014
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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Also keep in mind that the Church of England wasn't founded for Christian reasons. Henry IIIV was essentially at war with the pope. He wanted an annulment from his wife and the pope wouldn't give him one. So, Henry started his own church for the purpose of violating God's laws. The church was created in sin from the very start. Cramer was the righteous reformer who forged the 39 articles. He was burned alive with Lattimer and Ridley... Their martyr blood made England Protestant for 300 years.
Done in Convention by the Unanimous Consent of the States present the Seventeenth Day of September in the Year of our Lord one thousand seven hundred and Eighty seven.
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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Also keep in mind that the Church of England wasn't founded for Christian reasons. Henry IIIV was essentially at war with the pope. He wanted an annulment from his wife and the pope wouldn't give him one. So, Henry started his own church for the purpose of violating God's laws. The church was created in sin from the very start. No disagreement there at all. The English Reformation goes way back BEFFORE Henry the 8th... Wyclif. And Henry was No Protestant... he had a war of words with Luther himself. To distill the English Reformation down to the divorce king does violence to the real truth. Straw man.
Done in Convention by the Unanimous Consent of the States present the Seventeenth Day of September in the Year of our Lord one thousand seven hundred and Eighty seven.
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Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
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When was this herasey rewritten into the catechism telling us moslems can go to heaven without believing in Christ?
Oh yes, pope John Paul in the 1992.
841.
The Church's relationship with the Muslims. "The plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Muslims; these profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind's judge on the last day."
Just more of Satan leading Gods children astray.
m
As a child I was given this question: If you have to accept Jesus to be saved, what about the native in deepest, darkest Africa who is barely aware that there's an outside world much less Jesus. An otherwise good guy, does he go to hell? Is that the act of a mercirciful, loving and just god? Jesus has always been the Agent of salvation, before and after His incarnation. Nowhere does scripture claim that the recipient of salvation must be aware that Jesus of Nazareth is that Agent. Simple logic demands that if there truly is only One God, any prayer made to any Deity will be heard by the Only Deity, regardless of the name applied by the one praying. That Deity, Jesus, will judge the sincerity of the request. It’s only the Power Hungry Priests and some Elitist Protestants who insist on adding sacraments such as baptism or being in Communion with a church to the simple Gospel message. The very idea that Jesus would place the fate of His movement to a fallible human, St Peter, and establish an unbroken line of subsequent Peters is the greatest farce in Christendom. It’s only the modern egoist who uses the Bible to support whatever his latest intellectual masturbation produces. This^^^, but those who were not appraised of Christ and the good news didnt have to pray to anyone for forgiveness or salvation. They just had to live within the parameters of their God given conscience for Christs intervention i would expect, though there are things of His business that will always be above our pay grade.
Ecc 10:2
The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but that of a fool to the left.
A Nation which leaves God behind is soon left behind.
"The Lord never asked anyone to be a tax collector, lowyer, or Redskins fan".
I Dindo Nuffin
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Joined: Jan 2016
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Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 96,017 Likes: 19 |
When was this herasey rewritten into the catechism telling us moslems can go to heaven without believing in Christ?
Oh yes, pope John Paul in the 1992.
841.
The Church's relationship with the Muslims. "The plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Muslims; these profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind's judge on the last day."
Just more of Satan leading Gods children astray.
As a child I was given this question: If you have to accept Jesus to be saved, what about the native in deepest, darkest Africa who is barely aware that there's an outside world much less Jesus. An otherwise good guy, does he go to hell? Is that the act of a mercirciful, loving and just god? Youve missed the entire premise of the ways to get to Heaven. 1. He did not say humans have to accept Jesus to be saved (man extrapolated and added that. No scripture says that). 2. He said to get to the Father its going to go through Jesus Christ. 3 He said you WILL be saved if you accept Christ. Thats a sure way, not the only way. You get there through Jesus Christ if : A)You know the good news, believe and repent B) Are a child and die and are predestined. C). Are one born ages ago who never heard the word and Christ decides you should go because you were predestined. Man is who said you have to accept Jesus Christ to be saved. Thats a lie on the surface because kids go to heaven wighout having known Jesus. We who have heard the good new after Jesus came have to accept the good news and seek repentence.
Last edited by jaguartx; 05/17/19.
Ecc 10:2
The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but that of a fool to the left.
A Nation which leaves God behind is soon left behind.
"The Lord never asked anyone to be a tax collector, lowyer, or Redskins fan".
I Dindo Nuffin
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Only if their names are written on the Lambs Book of Life.
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Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
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Oh I dunno, suppose it's that love and mercy thing. He made us in His image and likeness, we are his children AS LONG AS WE ACCEPT HIM AS SAVIOR AND DONT TURN FROM HIS WORD AND FOLLOW SOME PUFFED UP HUMAN POSING AS HIM. I don't find us as despicable as that, more that we come into being knowing nothing and with much to learn. He made us knowing our nature, He does only good stuff, so we can't be all that bad. FIXT THATS WHY HE SAID DO NOT BE DECIEVED BY FALSE PROPHETS OR THOSE COMING IN HIS NAME OF FATHER. He said none of us are good. He ssid we all deserve eternal fire, or words to that effect.
Ecc 10:2
The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but that of a fool to the left.
A Nation which leaves God behind is soon left behind.
"The Lord never asked anyone to be a tax collector, lowyer, or Redskins fan".
I Dindo Nuffin
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Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 96,017 Likes: 19
Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
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Christ is Lord. He can get people to the Father who died worshipping cats and building pyramids, Able or Noah or his kids, before Jesus Christ was ever born.
You think Able or Noah or Abraham went to hell for not calling on the name of Jesus?
Last edited by jaguartx; 05/18/19.
Ecc 10:2
The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but that of a fool to the left.
A Nation which leaves God behind is soon left behind.
"The Lord never asked anyone to be a tax collector, lowyer, or Redskins fan".
I Dindo Nuffin
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Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 96,017 Likes: 19
Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
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[quote=nighthawk]Sure, it's what the concept has been taken to mean. Look at this thread, a good part of the posts effectively say if it's not in the Bible it don't mean squat. I think John is advising us to be open to teachings not in the Bible.
Above quote from NK. I dont think John is telling us to be open to the teachings of mortal men who presume to have a special inside track to Him and add to what He said or contradict what He said in the Bible. You are saying He told us one thing in the Bible and whispers something else in the popes ear. IOW, your telling us God lied to us in the Bible. God said He was the same yesterday today and tomorrow. Youre calling Him a liar and saying He isnt the same all the time. He said dont add to or subtract from the Bible or youre in danger. Youre calling Him a liar and saying its ok. He said call no one else on earth father and you and Satan are calling Him a liar and saying its ok. He also said you would try to justify your sin and He didnt lie. You tried to justify your sin. When you tell your little kid not to cross the street and they did and they tell you a sucker in a white robe came along and told them the sucker said he knew you and you didnt mean it and its ok and the kid did what would you say? Thats what Eve did in the Garden of Eden.
Last edited by jaguartx; 05/17/19.
Ecc 10:2
The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but that of a fool to the left.
A Nation which leaves God behind is soon left behind.
"The Lord never asked anyone to be a tax collector, lowyer, or Redskins fan".
I Dindo Nuffin
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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No matter how many times and ways I say nobody in the Church worships the pope and to do so would get you excommunicated instantly you insist otherwise. I give up.
The post immediately above this one is rhetorical blather.
Last edited by nighthawk; 05/18/19.
The key elements in human thinking are not numbers but labels of fuzzy sets. -- L. Zadeh
Which explains a lot.
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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No matter how many times and ways I say nobody in the Church worships the pope and to do so would get you excommunicated instantly you insist otherwise. I give up.
The post immediately above this one is rhetorical blather. The RC church thinks it’s the only True church. Salvation is individual and not dependent on church membership. (It’s why the church does not recognize evangelical Christianity.). The pope has added his own twist of Biblical legalism by espousing that salvation depends on faith AND good works. Pope should not be considered God’s highest earthly authority.
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Campfire Savant
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Campfire Savant
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They have a lot of money!
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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I do not believe that when you commit a sin that a man can tell you to say three Hail Mary's, and you will be forgiven of that sin. There is only one way you are forgiven of your sins, and it ain't through a Pope or a priest. Another misconception. God forgives sins. He does that through the priest. The blood of Jesus cleanses us from ALL sin. 1 John 1:7 (Doesn’t say a priest is needed for this!!) We don’t have to confess doodly squat to a priest or beg to be restored to perfection. God is quite capable of forgiving us without the help of a priest. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 1 John 1:9 (doesn’t say to confess our sins to a priest) Our sins were cleansed at the cross by Jesus. By one sacrifice he has made perfect (sinless) forever those who are being made holy. Hebrews 10:18 (This is also what Martin Luther was truing to say.)
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
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No matter how many times and ways I say nobody in the Church worships the pope and to do so would get you excommunicated instantly you insist otherwise. I give up.
The post immediately above this one is rhetorical blather. I've heard that about Mary, too. However, I was in an RC church and saw a stature of Mary with a bunch of children at her feet, heads bowed, praying to her. The RCC calls her a co-redeemer with Christ. That's pure invention as the Bible says nothing of the kind. She was honored by being the mother of Jesus, but beyond that, she was nothing more than any other believer, saved by Jesus' blood.
“In a time of deceit telling the truth is a revolutionary act.”
― George Orwell
It's not over when you lose. It's over when you quit.
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Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 96,017 Likes: 19
Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Jan 2016
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I do not believe that when you commit a sin that a man can tell you to say three Hail Mary's, and you will be forgiven of that sin. There is only one way you are forgiven of your sins, and it ain't through a Pope or a priest. Another misconception. God forgives sins. He does that through the priest. The blood of Jesus cleanses us from ALL sin. 1 John 1:7 (Doesn’t say a priest is needed for this!!) We don’t have to confess doodly squat to a priest or beg to be restored to perfection. God is quite capable of forgiving us without the help of a priest. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 1 John 1:9 (doesn’t say to confess our sins to a priest) Our sins were cleansed at the cross by Jesus. By one sacrifice he has made perfect (sinless) forever those who are being made holy. Hebrews 10:18 (This is also what Martin Luther was truing to say.) This^^^, but according to that scripture, no renumeration to sinful men is involved, so not all men will agree with thee or He. 
Ecc 10:2
The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but that of a fool to the left.
A Nation which leaves God behind is soon left behind.
"The Lord never asked anyone to be a tax collector, lowyer, or Redskins fan".
I Dindo Nuffin
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Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 96,017 Likes: 19
Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
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Posts: 96,017 Likes: 19 |
Christ is Lord. He can get people to the Father who died worshipping cats and building pyramids Able or Noah or his kids before Jesus Christ was ever born.
You think Able or Noah or Abraham went to hell for not calling on the name of Jesus?
PS. This was not directed at you, Ricky, but to what i consider common modern misconceptions.
Ecc 10:2
The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but that of a fool to the left.
A Nation which leaves God behind is soon left behind.
"The Lord never asked anyone to be a tax collector, lowyer, or Redskins fan".
I Dindo Nuffin
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