Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Elk Hunting .375 H&H for elk

I bought a Remington 798 (Mauser action) in 375 H&H several years ago from a gentleman in Washington. It was in excellent condition and he had used it for elk and bear. Killed several with this rifle before selling it to me. He used Nosler bullets.
So yesterday I went to Whitaker’s to buy up some 375 bullets to reload. To my amazement they had zero Nosler or Barnes or Hornady. All they had was the Sierra Spitzer BT 300 grains.
So I bought a box and went home and loaded up 20 rounds that are in the 2450-2500 FPS range.
I have yet to mount a scope so I shot it from 20 -75yds with iron sights.
Wow what a pleasant shooting rifle. Recoil was mild and it shot everything I aimed at.
So I would like to create a conversation for shooting a 375 out to say 600 yards with a dial up scope.
First has anyone done this? If so what was the bullet, FPS and scope you used? What eye relief would one need to use?
I’m thinking this could be a dandy elk rifle for timber or shooting across drainages.
I did a little research on the Sierra 300 grain Spitzer Gameking bullet and it appears to be a decent bullet.
What your thoughts or experience on the 375 H&H for shooting mid range?
Thanks

My buddy has a nice old ZKK 602 set up to shoot out to 400 yards with 260 grain Noslers. Should be a heck of an elk rifle.

I would look at the 300gr NAB and 270gr Barnes LRX for serious long distance work.

The 375 has almost the same trajectory as a 30-06 with a 180 grain bullet, so hits out to 600 yards are really not much of a problem.

I am on the 2nd barrel in my Mauser 375, and I have shot it quite a lot at longer ranges with that rifle, mostly for fun. I have killed a LOT of rock-chucks with it out to around 600-6540. (yeah I know, it's over-kill, but I didn't care. I had a lot of fun doing it, and really leaned to shoot it well)

My rifle has only a 1X-4X Leupold on it and with some practice I found hitting chucks at 400 was easy, and at 600 was something I could do a bit more then half the time when shooting over a good soft rest from prone. It must be remembered that a Rock Chuck at 600 yards through a 4X scope looks like one at 150 with iron sights. It's not near as hard as you might think.

You just need to give it a serious try and learn from the MISSES.
Log everything ------------- and in a few hundred rounds you'll find you hit more then you miss.

I load the 260 Nosler Partitions for my FN/Sako in 375 Mby and sight in for 300 yards. At about 350 it starts droping like a rock; it's not a great long range bullet, but it's a good bullet.

The 260 AccuBond is a pretty good longer range performer with a good ballistic coefficient of .473. If I were still using my 375s I would load this bullet, hands down.

Thanks guys! What scope in the 4-14 power range do you think has enough eye relief for this caliber?
I’ll get some Nosler bullets on order.
Does someone make a picatinny rail 20 moa for a Mauser action ? The 20 moa rail might come in handy for those longer shots.

I'm curious regarding to your desire for a 4-14 powered scope for a .375.

Mine wears a 1.5-6x42 Zeiss Victory. That's a lot of scope, sorta expensive, but I got it right. ER is great, 6X is all the power I'll ever need for a .375.

Lot of people use the Leupold 1.5-5x20, which is much lighter than the Victory, the Victory being better in low light.

DF

My .375 is a great rifle in a great chambering but there's no way I'd hump it up and down the mountains for an elk. Successful hunting is much more about the rifle than the chambering. I'm all about doing what works for you, let us know how it goes.

I would happily use my pre-64 375 with 300gr partitions at 2680 and a 1.5-5 leupold out to 400 yards for elk, a little more glass and some of the newer sleeker bullets will get you a bit more range if you think you'd need it.

This.

While the H&H isn't the best choice for true long-range shooting, it will do an honest 2,700 fps with 270-grain bullets so there's no reason to think of it as strictly a mid-range proposition.


Okie John

I have 2 scopes, with warne QR rings, for my 375 H&H (24" model 70 classic stainless). One is the leupold 2.5-8, sighted in for 300 gr. swift aframes. The other is a leupold 6x42, with the long range duplex reticle. This one is sighted in with 260 gr accubonds at 2800 fps.

With the accubonds sighted +2.25" high at 100, it's zeroed at 220, first dot is 310, second dot is 402, and the top of the post is 497. This trajectory has been verified, at the range, and a proven elk and deer killer.

The warne QR rings are very repeatable and keep the poi within a 1/2" at 100, swapping loads and scopes. One or two clicks, and I'm good to go.

Andy3

I used a Mod 700 BDL SS .375 with Leupold 2.5x8 scope. I loaded the 300 Sierra to 2600. I shot a cow elk right at 200yds and it blew a 6 inch exit. I used WW 760 in WW cases. I then went to the 270gr Failsafe in the factory load as I was out of time before a hunting trip to South Africa. It was Steller.

I used my .375 H&H with 260 AccuBonds to take two very large bull elk during my 2006 and 2007 Colorado hunts. Both animals died where they stood, although one stood around long enough to take a second shot that wasn't really needed. A few months later I took it to Namibia on my first trip and used the same rifle/bullet combination to take all of my plains game, from impala to eland, all one-shot kills.

If I still had the rifle, I wouldn't hesitate to use it for elk again.

Thanks again guys!
Dirtfarmer I just threw those numbers out in regards to a scope. However if I’m going to buy a new scope why handcuff my rifle. I look at it like this. I shoot in local PRS matches on a regular basis. Most ranges around here are out to 500-600 yards. My precision rifle has a 5-25x56 scope on it. I set the power between 10-14 power for all stages except the KYL rack which I dial the scope to 20 power.
So I shoot 90% of the targets with the scope on 10 power.
So I was thinking why not buy a scope 4-14 or so for the 375. As with all my other rifles I set the scope on the lowest power and if something steps out at 450 yards I turn the power up some.
So I was thinking if I could find a variable scope with good eye relief why not on the 375.

As far as elk-guns" go, my 375 has been used more than any other firearm I ever used on elk.

I have used the 300 grain Sierra, but that's one bullet I never killed an elk with. I did kill a moose with one. The core and jacket came apart, but I can't say it was all that bad. The core exited and hit the water in the pond the moose was standing in front of. I found the rear of the jacket in it's ribs on the off side. Failure of a bullet becomes less and less important as the bullets gets bigger. A "failed" 300 grain .375 bullet still does a lot of damage and goes deep, unlike a failed 130 or 140 grain .264" bullet . Shear size can overcome lack of bullet integrity to some extent.

I would not choose one that I know comes apart just because there are so many other ones that don't come apart, but I have killed a number of elk with 270 grain Hornady SPs and they also come apart quite a lot, yet no animal I ever hit with one went far, and most just dropped. No animal I ever shot with one needed a 2nd shot either.

For elk I have used 270 grain Hornadys in both spire point and round nose.(The RN is a lot better) I have used 235 grain Speers. I have used 300 grain Winchester Silvertips (made in the 50s) and 300 grain Nosler Partitions,(old screw machine made ones) 300 grain Hornady solids and also 270 grain Winchester Power Points.

The two I'd rate the best of them all have been the Nosler Partitions and the old WW Power Points. Both made large diameter wounds the went clear through no matter the angle, or if they hit large bones or not. Just a large hole clear through in a straight line.

It can't get better then that.

But with a 375H&H, about any bullet (that's not made for the 375 Winchester) is going to be fine for elk I am sure. Some may be a bit better than others, but I don't think any will let your elk run off if you cna shoot well enough to place your shots. The beauty of the 375H&H is that it lacks nothing for about any use in America, and is still good for about 99% of all hunting even in Africa.

The "super-stoppers" are all just fine, but in modern hunting for American who do not live in an African nation, the chances of needing to stop a "blood-eyed charge" of an elephant is nearly non-existent, because the pro is there and has that covered. (at least he's supposed to.)

I have owned several rifles larger than my 375 and I still own one, a 404 Jeffery. But I have sold all my 458s, all my 416s, my 460s and my 505 Gibbs. Why? The 375 is a better rifle than any of them for the hunting I do. Yes, I said better. Power is not everything.

The 375 is slimmer, lighter, shoots flatter, is super accurate so I can use it at long ranges if I feel the need, doesn't kick much, so an accurate fast 2nd shot is ..... well.......faster.
So far I have NEVER needed a 2nd shot with my 375 on any animal, but I have another round chambered within a 1/2 second and am back on target in 1-1.3 seconds which is faster than I could do with any other more powerful rifle I had. So if ever I do need it, I like having round #2 in the chamber and back on target faster. That may be more mental masturbation then "real-world", but having shot against the timer with all my big rifles I can say the 375 and my 9.3X62 are as fast for me to make a 2nd hit on metal and paper targets as my 30-06 or 270. The kick of the 375 doesn't slow my recovery time at all, where my 416s, 404, 458s, 460s and 505 all did.

For North America the 375H&H is in my opinion the best "big rifle" in the case you had just one rifle. For most hunters that's not realistic either, but the point still stands.

Even in those cases where you owned only 1 rifle, the 30-06 probably is going to be just as good for all the real hunts (not the hunts we sometimes have in our minds) but if you want a big rifle to cover everything from small deer to moose to buffalo and big bears, and if recoil in not something that bothers you much, I think the 375 "set the bar" over 100 years ago for versatility better than anything else made since that time. The one that I have seen that is probably the closest to a tie is the old 9.3X62.

If we tell the un-embellished truth, for the large majority of American hunters a good 30-30, 243, 25-06, 6.5CM, 260 Rem will cover every hunting need they will ever see in their life. Most American big game hunters (like 89%, if I recall US Fish and Wildlife's statistic correctly) hunt deer and nothing larger. The remaining 11% hunts everything else, from black bear, hogs, elk, caribou, moose, bison and Brown/Grizzly/Kodiak bears.

I personally take the stand of "so what'? I like shooting my big rifles and I have killed a lot of rabbits and rock-chucks with them. It's good practice. I like my big rifles. But I do not try to convince myself or others of any need for most of them, because for the most part I don't NEED them. I want....therefore I need. A slave is allowed what he needs. A free man gets what he wants.

I have made, owned and used many of the newer and more modern cartridges, and from my experience I have come to the conclusion (somewhat grudgingly at first) that the "new stuff" is not better, and in most cases not as good.

Sure, some are more powerful, faster, and look "modern", with slimmer bullets and higher BCs, but none have shown me any true advantage for killing game, and I base this opinion on about 40+ years of experience and killing a lot of game myself, as well as seeing a lot more killed with many other guns and bullets than I have shot myself. This especially true for elk having hunted and guided and packed for other hunters now for nearly 50 years.

The 375 is just outstanding. Load it up and use it. You'll find it meets or exceeds your wishes for all the tasks you'll ask it to do.

I can line up on stuff a lot smaller than elk at 450 yards with 6x.

Some years ago I picked up this nice Ruger Number One in 375 H&H and fell hard for the cartridge & rifle. As others have said, the recoil was far less than I'd anticipated, and I truly enjoy shooting the rifle. Mine is topped with the 1.5-5x Leupold, which has worked well. I've only hunted with the 260 gr Nosler Accubonds, a terrific bullet for my purposes. I've shot a lot of different bullets for practice though.

Have shot three black bears with this rifle and the 260 gr Nosler Accubonds. First one was at 306 yards, one and done. Followed a bear wounded by another hunter into the brush and finished it at about 15 feet. That was pretty intense. Shot another at about 150 yards. I've carried it for elk, but haven't taken a shot at elk with it yet.

I keep mine zeroed at 200 yards, and have no problems ringing the 300 yard gong time after time at the gun club.


Could the 375 make a good mid-distance elk rifle? I certainly think so! The 375 certainly isn't needed, but it's fun to use.

And no - I have no idea which more powerful scope would work best for you. I have considered using a 6x scope on this rifle, but haven't done so. I have tried a few other scopes on it, the most powerful being a 2-7x which worked well.

Enjoy that 375, it's a great cartridge and I think you've got a good rifle for it as well.

Regards, Guy

I personally think the 2.5-8 VX3 is the perfect scope for the .375. I have a buddy who has a long range .375 that's topped with a Nightforce 2.5-10. He's deadly with it out to 600 yards.

The smaller scopes with the 20mm objectives suck at light gathering. If it's bright out and you have an animal standing in the shadows, you'll have a hard time seeing it.

Great write up Szinh & Cascade. There is just something about the 375, provenance, nostalgia, performance or just plain mojo.

I have not shot Elk with mine but other similar size plains game. The Elk never cooperated when I had the 375. One friend uses the 300 Sierra for everything and I believe it was a favorite of Craig Boddington's and John R Sundra's. I am with Szinh on them and only use them for load work up as they match up well with the TSX. Not sure I have a favorite bullet. The 235 Speer perform out of their pay grade and are good enough for cow elk. The 260 Accubond is a good all a rounder for NA and shoots close to the 300 Sierra. Partitions are always good. Grand Slam's are good but haven't shot anything larger than a 350 lb hog with them. If I really wanted to push the range I think I would load the sleekest Hammer bullet that the rifle will shoot. This will help with windage some.

Wow! Lots of passionate words for the 375 H&H. Love it! Thanks for taking the time and responding. There is a lot of experience speaking on this topic and I Thank you.

the 375 H&H , if loaded with the correct bullet, makes a superb elk rifle in my opinion,
I'm certainly not the only one who thinks its a great choice with a well proven track record
varget and WW748 are both extremely accurate in my and jacks 375 H&H
I would avoid the Sierra Spitzer BT 300 grain bullet they shed the jacket rapidly on impact in my experience.
Jack and I both had much better results with the hornady 270 grain and a 215 fed mag primer

https://www.hornady.com/bullets/rifle/375-cal-375-270-gr-interlock-sp-rp#!/


while this is NOT my 375 H&H sako carbine, in the picture posted above,
My SAKO CARBINE is almost an exact clone except, that my stocks about 5 shades darker, so its about as dark as walnut gets.

I also have a fibermark WBY MARK V in 375 H&H, thats especially and consistently accurate,
but the sako carbine gets more use as its handy and very accurate
one other guy I hunt with used a remington custom 700 bdl he swears by
he never is bashful at relating how he killed a real nice 6 point elk with a single shot from about 400 yards,
and he swears that elk looked like it ran into a solid glass wall , at the shot, it dropped so fast with a shoulder and spine destroyed

I would look not further than the 250-gr TTSX, the 260-gr Accubond, or the 270-gr TSX, etc., depending which your barrel liked the best. Then depending on your optics and yourself, go get some elk.

I have used the 260 Accubond on moose and elk.. The elk was probably 400, maybe a bit more.. Lots of drop, but when the bullet hit, she dropped..

Like Ben, I have taken two bull elk with a 375 H&H using the 260 gr Partition. Both "fell" to the shot with one, running balls out downhill, taken 20 or so yards to tumble. The first was a 50 yard shot, the second, maybe 25 yards.

I do a lot of "plinking" at 5-600 yards with a 375 Ruger and it works great once you figure out your drops. I've shot a couple hundred of the 300gr Sierra BT at 2630 fps and I just started playing with the 300gr Partitions at 2570 fps. Before that it was the 270gr Hornady SP at 2730 fps. My hunting load is a 275gr Sledge Hammer from Hammer bullets at 2655 fps and it shoots about the same at those ranges as the 300gr bullets, but they're too expensive to plink with!

All of the loads shoot 1.5 MOA or better at 550-600 yards when sitting with shooting sticks and it's just good fun! I've used the same 2.5-8 VX-3 for years but threw one of the Leupold S-1 dials on there about 2 years ago just to play with longer ranges with this gun. All of these loads are what I would consider too light for elk past about 400 yards but I'm sure they'd kill one just fine with good placement. Plinking at 600 yards with the gun makes 300 yard shots pretty easy though.

No one will ever say that you didn’t bring enough gun!

I have a model 70 that looks identical to Mule Deer's except for the fluting. It wears a 3-9x40 conquest in Talley QD rings. Also own a no 1 that shoots so well its ridiculous. Good Lord willing i'll be in CO end of oct/first of nov chasing one. Hadnt decided if i'll take the Winchester or the new to me no1A in 30-06. That 375 gets mighty heavy after awhile.

BTW mine love 260gr partitions and 270 Hornady's over 69gr of RL15

I have handled a no 1 375 at a not so local dealer and love the feel immensely. It was used with hardly a mark and I believe he wanted 950 or something along those lines. I think about it a lot

The 375 H&H shoots basically the same trajectory as a 30-06. Use that as a guide to how it reaches out. My 375 Wby chambered Sako/FN wears a 2.5-8 VX3, and it's always been adequate, plus it keeps the gun trimmer.

Thanks again for the reply’s! When I get back from vacation I’ll scope mine up and get busy with it out to 600 yds.

If it doesn't quite give you what you really want, have it reamed out to the 375 Weatherby ( or 375 Ackley Improved). You will gain at least 100fps, probably a whole lot more if you load it to 65K. Weatherby loads their factory ammo up around 74K ( according to their Rep told to my smith awhile back!) so yeah, one and done, ha. But man what velocity!

When I see these threads like this, makes me realize I need to shoot my 375 H&H model 70 stainless classic one of these days.

I agree.

But look what this young hunter toted up and down mountains. Don't know the round, but for sure that rig is a lot heavier than my .375 H&H.

Phil (458Win) says his daughter uses her .416 Rem to kill everything, including sheep.

So, I guess you gotta be young and fit to qualify. I sure don't....

DF

The SS Classic I posted has been shot only at the range, have never killed anything with it. I guess I have too many other projects that need testing.

Maybe one of these days.

BTW, look what that rifle did with the 235 gr. CEB Raptor. I know, just three shots, but it does show promise. Those Cutting Edge Bullets are pretty impressive at the range and in the field. Terminal performance is outstanding. Here's a link to a CEB Raptor out of my .308 Kimber Classic with Broughton 5C barrel. www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/13866131/re-7mm-08-120gr-bt#Post13866131

DF

I get that question frequently, about why are you carrying a heavy rifle,
especially when they see some old geezer miles from road access carrying a heavy rifle,
I regularly hunt with a 340 wby and a 375 H&H rifle



you don,t need to be young...just set in your ways, stubborn, very confident in your rifle,and not in any particular rush too cover a great deal of ground.
Im 71, and while I may not be in the same physical shape I was when I was 20-50, having gained considerable experience , you learn to be observant,
you learn to hunt more productive areas, and waste less time trying to constantly get over that far ridge-line,
you spend more time reading topo maps , studying aerial photos and sitting in terrain choke points that naturally funnel game into a restricted location.
yeah, I may not cover nearly the same distances, but Ive gotten consistently more effective and if carrying a rifle that weights 9-10 lbs vs 7-8 lbs,
keeps you from hunting some canyon, what are you going to do with 350-700 lbs of elk down in some remote canyon.

My hunting bud loves Senderos. He kills WT’s and hogs regularly with a .270.

I’m getting his 7RM Sendero ready for African PG, loading the 160 NAB over RL-26.

I asked him why he likes those heavy guns. His reply, “I know what they’ll do when I get them there”.

It’s worth it to him to carry a big gun. His track record bears it out.

DF

I don't mind heavy guns either, had a bud bitching about how heavy one of my rifles was as he happily stood there and supported the extra 200lbs he put on his big ass since school. people can be a goofy fickle bunch.

I've got 2 boxes of Nosler Custom 375 with the 260gr Accubond, plus a Leupold VX6 2-12x42 to outfit your 375 if interested.

Perfect load, really nice scope. I have two and like them. Really easy to get behind (generous eye box), glass near Alpha Euro quality. Leupold bashers will chime in; these have had no issues.

DF

I can see the humor in that.

DF

My Sako 375 is one of my favorite rifles. I've had it since the 80's and early on put it in a McMillan stock. I've only used 300 grain bullets in them. Mostly Nosler partitions. Early on I tried some Barnes 300 grainers. In the box of 50, 2 were so out of round the bullet would stick in the die. Regardless I took my biggest bull moose with the bullet. I was very impressed, the bull was facing away from me looking over his shoulder at me. I was Leary of the Texas heart shot, so I shot him in the hip. It was obvious that the bull was immediately sick. I put in another round in him as I didn't need him getting any deeper in the bush before he died. The impressive thing was that the bullet went in, as clean as if I'd used a big drill bit into the meat. No shock, mess on the hip. You could eat right up to the hole. That rifle handled everything from brown bear, to moose and caribou. I considered it a very pleasant rifle to shoot and have shot 40 rounds off the bench before with no bruise or anything. What a wonderful cartridge.

Hey isn't that Trump Jr from the KUIU video?

Yep.

Not sure about the video.

DF

Not exactly my idea of a “sheep rifle.” 🙂

Mine either.

I guess if he wants to pack it, it did seem effective.

DF

The previously mentioned 375 H&H was an early Remington KS Mountain Rifle with a couple of inches knocked off of the barrel. It went 7 1/2#, scoped, slung and loaded. It has since been replaced with a tweaked SS M70 that weighs a few ounce more. No need at all for a heavy 375.

My Classic NH was way too barrel heavy. I had it cut back to 21" and fluted. which cut the forward weight a bunch. It's still in the 8# range, nine plus pounds with the heavy Victory scope, lighter with a VX-3 1.5-5x20. Those barrels are too good to swap.

What ya think Don Jr's big rifle weighs? Looks like a NF scope. I'm guessing 15+ pounds, a lot more than what I would want to pack up and down those mountains.

He took a lot of flack for those pictures and his Africa hunt with Eric.

Gotta respect them for that.

DF

He didn't, I grabbed my rifle from him and rec'd a gym membership.

All that said, I certainly would rather pack my 8.5lb Kimber 338 win mag up and elk mountain over a 16lb bull barreled Sharps 45-110.

Ya reckon ole Billy Dixon would be laughing about now...?



DF

I've got a Kimber Talkeetna in 375H&H w/2-12x42 Leupold VX-6 that shoots 250gn TTSX's right @ 2800fps. There's nothing about that rifle/load that would cause me to not want to hunt elk with it, at any range/conditions in which I could accurately judge what the wind was going to do.

Uh-Yessir, he is. ; ]

Sounds like a damn nice rig, Horse.

I need to draw a few more tags so I can actually take it hunting.

I forgot to add, I'm swapping the VX-6 off for a Leica 2.5-10x42 because I'm not fond of Leupold's wide-duplex and the center intersection is more coarse than I like. I live and hunt in very open country and have very good corrected vision, at this point for me regarding a reticle, the finer the better in the center.

Since I've gotten older I've cut the distance I walk considerably. Before my hip replacement it was difficult to go a mile, let alone drop in and climb out of canyons.

Still, I prefer lighter rifles to heavier. Most of the trips involve far more walking than shooting, and at the end of the day my shoulder can tell the difference. We pack our elk out on our backs or, if possible, with a cart. More than one elk has gotten walking papers because i didn't want (or physically couldn't, or both) want to pack it out.

Dropping 25 pounds last year made hiking those hills a LOT easier. I'll take weight loss where I can get it - rifle, pack, waist.

Agreed, I don't need trash in my reticles either, especially FAT trash, good luck getting those tags, you may have to book a big bear hunt with Phil, bet he has a tag!

There's certainly nothing wrong with a .375 for elk, although the high-BC hunting bullets are quite limited. The 260gr Accubond is one of the few that comes to mind. 600y seems a bit much, but then it's a bit much with any rifle.

Given a choice I'll take a 6.5mm or 7mm magnum in a smaller, lighter rifle and be able to shoot farther with the same impact from wind call error. Those big magnum actions are rather unwieldy compared to say a Kimber 8400. Yes, you CAN carry them but it's a lot less pleasant.

Ya think that big rifle Don Jr was packing on that AK sheep hunt (picture I posted) would weigh as much as your big Sharps? He must have packed it in.

DF

Had my 375 H&H at the range today for some practice. Oh, what fun to shoot!



This year though, I plan on bowhunting for elk, so the 375 will only come out to play for bear season. It's done just fine on bear in the past.

Guy

Bet it's a 15 pounder anyway DF, plus, Jr. is probably enjoying 20-30+ years youth on our old beatup asses.

NICE!, hope you bust a bear with that 375 and a bull with your bow!

Gunner - first big game animal I took with this rifle. Different scope then:



Since then I've shot two other bears, and before I bought it, that particular rifle took quite an array of game, even in Africa.

I'd kinda like to take it back to Africa... But I don't think there are elk in Africa...

Guy

My current 375 H&H M70 is pretty handy. It has hunted Alaska's three islands for brown bear without success and may see it up there again in the future. I really like this rifle and could be more than happy with it and my 270 Montana unloading the rest...

Life would be boring with just two rifles...

My Kimber Talkeetna 375 H&H is an 8400 action...........

I'm a newby to the 375. Using the Ruger version; two elk and a deer the last two seasons. More comfortable to shoot and about 7.5 inches shorter than my Browning A-bolt 338WM. However, I'm only shooting 200 gn bullets (3100 fps). I doubt I would use a 375 if I wasn't handloading. Too expensive...

That's a little confusing though because it's not vaguely the same action as the WSM 8400s. It's two sizes bigger. They just gave it the same name for some inexplicable reason.

Good stuff there Guy.