Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire Evolution is a myth? Please explain:

It's not that a cyclic universe runs out of energy, but that gravity overcomes expansion. Other models include Heat Death, the Big Rip where dark energy is so strong as to tear apart matter. Then the various Multiverse models....

Anyone ever read/watched "Inherit the Wind"?

Yes. It's a caricature with no bearing on the current debate except to reinforce a convenient stereotype.

You Googled it? You let Google's algorithims do your thinking for you? Good luck with that one!

Hastings,

That's a great question, one I contemplated for many years before I found an answer that seemed to meet it's burden of proof to me.

For background, let's recall what happens when too much matter comes into to close of proximity. Gravity binds it together, and given enough mass close enough you get a black hole with a density sufficient to bend the fabric of space time itself.

The same principle also applies at much lower densities. The density of matter affects the "curvature" of the local presentation of our Universe.

A universe with a high matter density is said to be "closed". The density of the matter is such that the universe would eventually collapse back onto it's self into a new singularity. Now there's no guarantee the new singularity would be of the same nature as the one at the time of the Big Bang, so instead of a series of Big Bangs, it's possible such a universe would end as a single Black Hole containing all the matter of the universe.

The opposite condition is a universe with a low matter density, or one that's said to be "open". Even without dark matter, an open universe expands for ever, with the acceleration reaching a point where it over comes the forces of the gravitational, electromagnetic and strong binding forces, ripping apart the very fabric of space time itself.

The third possibility is a "flat" universe. In a flat universe, in the absence of dark matter, it expands for ever, but at a decreasing rate, until the rate of expansion eventually approximates (but never reaches) zero.

The empirical measurements indicate we live in a "flat universe", and are within the margin of error. Additionally, it's my understanding, a "Universe from nothing" as described above could only result in flat geometry.

Of course there's a twist. Dark Matter is real and it's accelerating the expansion of our universe. In this scenario, stars are expected to form normally for one to a hundred trillion years, but eventually the supply of gas needed for star formation will be exhausted. As existing stars run out of fuel and cease to shine, the universe will slowly and inexorably grow darker. Eventually black holes will dominate the universe, which themselves will disappear over time as they emit Hawking radiation.

I've hypothesized this state of the "heat death" of the universe could reach the condition we called "nothing", one where the laws of quantum mechanics once again takes over and the "nothing" once again becomes unstable and........BANG.........But this last part is just my speculation......

Not at all.

I know YEC's such as yourself like to quote mine Gould, and since you didn't quote a source I went looking. In this case, the google results speak for themselves.

If you don't believe me, feel free to read the above paper for yourself.

Young earth creationism in this day and age, incredible.

Google! OMG, what's next, Wiki?


OK, here it is, for the unlearned. It fits right in.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_antisemitism

As convinced as you are, the Ph.D young earth creationist feel your position is incredible; and they don't use blind faith for evidence like you do. They actually do field and lab work.

Again I asked for any Ph.D level creationist who became an evolutionist after achieving that level and I will post a list of Ph.D evolutionists who became creationists after they achieved that level.

I think you have it backwards.....all the evidence, geological, fossil, cosmological supports the current estimates for the age of the universe and our solar system.

It is not faith to base the estimates on evidence. Faith is to ignore the evidence and believe the opposite, to believe what it says in the bible.

Young earth creationists represent a tiny minority of scientists who work in these fields. Rather than being evidence based, their belief is a matter of faith, faith in the bible.

It doesn't matter what young earth creationists happen to believe, all the evidence is stacked against them.

I don't know what the science points to and frankly neither can science.
I have a faith in God and really love biology.
Science however conflicts with itself over quantum physics. It is more scary to hard core science than the bible. Time and space becomes unknowable.
A humans understanding of it is to simple.
Our God is a smart guy and faith is faith because some of the answers are not doable for humans.
It would take a greater leap of faith for me to believe solid matter came from nothingness.
The mystery of our faith in God is far more believable, imo

What you presented is knows as an argument from "personal incredulity". This is a subset of the "argument from ignorance".

Both are logical fallacies.

It would take a greater leap of faith for me to believe God came from nothingness.
Young earth creationist do not want to talk about that...

So it’s easier to believe that life came from a huge ball of fire? Both versions hold some truths I think. I am not a man of great faith but life suddenly coming from nowhere but molten lava is a little hard to swallow. Ed k

Who asserts it came from fire, suddenly or otherwise??

Who is claiming that life suddenly came from nowhere....yet alone from molten lava?

And how come god is a (good) guy?

Scientists claim the earth was a molten ball of lava.then it cooled and life began. Maybe so maybe not. That’s what they taught me in school. Ed k

When was this schooling and what level was the education? We've drifted from evolution to a whole 'nother topic though. I'd be more curious when folks learned about evolution and genetics generally....