We pray our sights be straight and our aim be true We pray for no pain to the game we pursue We thank you Lord for this land We thank you for the sights from our stands We pray for safety, one and all We pray we may return next fall
Decree of the Council of Toulouse (1229 C.E.): “We prohibit also that the laity should be permitted to have the books of the Old or New Testament; but we most strictly forbid their having any translation of these books.”
Ruling of the Council of Tarragona of 1234 C.E.: “No one may possess the books of the Old and New Testaments in the Romance language, and if anyone possesses them he must turn them over to the local bishop within eight days after promulgation of this decree, so that they may be burned...”
Proclamations at the Ecumenical Council of Constance in 1415 C.E.: Oxford professor, and theologian John Wycliffe, was the first (1380 C.E.) to translate the New Testament into English to “...helpeth Christian men to study the Gospel in that tongue in which they know best Christ’s sentence.” For this “heresy” Wycliffe was posthumously condemned by Arundel, the archbishop of Canterbury. By the Council’s decree “Wycliffe’s bones were exhumed and publicly burned and the ashes were thrown into the Swift River.”
They burned Hus alive also a Constance
Done in Convention by the Unanimous Consent of the States present the Seventeenth Day of September in the Year of our Lord one thousand seven hundred and Eighty seven.
History is not simple. Determining truth is not as simple as believing. Ideas and beliefs develop over time. The people at the time of the writing of genesis had a different set of beliefs than those who came later. Even the usage of word 'Satan' changed over time.
You read what others write when it agrees with your preconceived notion. You and I are the same. We are like parrots. We read what others says and either reject it or accept it based on our world view. I don't agree with what you are quoting. It makes no difference that you are appealing to authority. Your authority is flawed.
That's just an excuse to ignore actual research and objective scholarship. What I read and what I quote is reliable research by people qualified in the field. Some on the other hand prefer biased Christian sources and sites.
It is quite clear that the Satan of the book of Job is not the Satan of Christian theology, never mind earlier beliefs.
The satan/devil of the O.T. and N.T. became connected in the Vulgate,[4th century A.D. translation of Hebrew Bible into Latin]
Isaiah 14 refers to an earthly king as Lucifer,[“bearer of light,”] who falls from heaven. Jesus confirms such in Luke 10:18: “I watched Satan fall from heaven like a flash of lightning.”
..come the Middle Ages / 5th century, writers began to apply the Vulgate term for Isaiah’s [flesh-blood] Lucifer to the rebellious angel [spiritual entity] in Book of Revelation.
-Bulletproof and Waterproof don't mean Idiotproof.
The satan/devil of the O.T. and N.T. became connected in the Vulgate,[4th century A.D. translation of Hebrew Bible into Latin]
Isaiah 14 refers to an earthly king as Lucifer,[“bearer of light,” ] who falls from heaven. Jesus in Luke 10:18: “I watched Satan fall from heaven like a flash of lightning.”
..come the Middle Ages / 5th century, writers began to apply the Vulgate term for Isaiah’s Lucifer to the rebellious angel entity in Book of Revelation.
[quote=DBTThat's just an excuse to ignore actual research and objective scholarship. What I read and what I quote is reliable research by people qualified in the field. Some on the other hand prefer biased Christian sources and sites.
It is quite clear that the Satan of the book of Job is not the Satan of Christian theology, never mind earlier beliefs.[/quote]
Because you believe it is good scholarship does not make it so. Many of the authors are just as biased as you are. Appealing to authority is not working.
"Only Christ is the fullness of God's revelation." Everyday Hunter
Because you believe it is good scholarship does not make it so. Many of the authors are just as biased as you are. Appealing to authority is not working.
You are still asserting your own belief. Which is a claim rather than a reasonable, rational argument.
The qualifications of the author of the article are provided in the article.
I used to lean heavily in the direction of Calvin. He leaned strongly on Augustine. An argument made against Calvin is that he followed Augustine in applying Neo-Platonic reasoning to the idea of predestination. In doing so he introduced error.
Luther stands in contrast by working hard to accept scriptural tension as they are presented. His argument was that he would not use reason to explain away tensions but let them stand. Calvin tended to apply reason run to conclusions that were a bit questionable. If God is God it may be better to let tensions stand and not try to explain those tensions in a way that satisfies the human mind.
I used to lean heavily in the direction of Calvin. He leaned strongly on Augustine. An argument made against Calvin is that he followed Augustine in applying Neo-Platonic reasoning to the idea of predestination. In doing so he introduced error.
Luther stands in contrast by working hard to accept scriptural tension as they are presented. His argument was that he would not use reason to explain away tensions but let them stand. Calvin tended to apply reason run to conclusions that were a bit questionable. If God is God it may be better to let tensions stand and not try to explain those tensions in a way that satisfies the human mind.
Has anyone tested their free moral agency? :-)
I’ve been reading more Luther as of late and listening to LCMS pastors and this is tough to argue with.
Bondage of the Will is remarkably similar to Calvin’s thoughts. Many of the erroneous ideas bandied about here & assigned to Calvin came from his “followers”.
At any rate good conversation I think I’m headed in your direction.
An excellent movie showing what the catholic church was doing to many Bible believing Christians is "A Lamp in the Dark: The Untold History of the Bible. If you have Rocu and TUBI, you can watch it there free. Or you can go on Amazon and have it sent to you. It's such an excellent movie, and quite long (nearly 3 hours) that I ordered it along with Tares Among the Wheat which is a sequel to A Lamp in the Dark and also Bridge to Bablylon, which is also very good, on Tubi and available through Amazon.
We may know the time Ben Carson lied, but does anyone know the time Hillary Clinton told the truth?
Immersing oneself in progressive lieberalism is no different than bathing in the sewage of Hell.
About 4 years ago I a friend put me on to the Whitehorse Inn broadcast/podcast. I kept hearing these Lutherans and what they said sounded a bit different but I didn’t have a reference.
In early 2016 I realize that one of the Lutherans, Rod Rosenbladt, along with some other guys from Concordia at Irvine were doing their own podcast, The Thinking Fellows. Their first episodes are a little rough as they work on the audio but it’s a good place to start. They cover the major points in Melancthon’s Loci. Another good one is “Banned Books” where Gerharde Forde’s “On Being a Theologian of the Cross” is covered.
Calvinism as a framework for reflection is good but how about reforming and continuing to reform?
Limited atonement simply is not scriptural.
Done in Convention by the Unanimous Consent of the States present the Seventeenth Day of September in the Year of our Lord one thousand seven hundred and Eighty seven.
An excellent movie showing what the catholic church was doing to many Bible believing Christians is "A Lamp in the Dark: The Untold History of the Bible. If you have Rocu and TUBI, you can watch it there free. Or you can go on Amazon and have it sent to you. It's such an excellent movie, and quite long (nearly 3 hours) that I ordered it along with Tares Among the Wheat which is a sequel to A Lamp in the Dark and also Bridge to Bablylon, which is also very good, on Tubi and available through Amazon.
Thanks for the references. Dave Hunt, A Woman Rides the Beast. Well documented.
Done in Convention by the Unanimous Consent of the States present the Seventeenth Day of September in the Year of our Lord one thousand seven hundred and Eighty seven.
One only needs reform until Christ is is actual found at the center of the Gospel. After that reform becomes about self and remembering what was found at the center of the Gospel.
Faith Alone Grace Alone Scripture Alone Priesthood of all Believers. Christ Alone the one mediator and one head of the Church One finished and perfect blood atonement, not to be repeated Grace cannot be earned, bought or bartered.
Here I stand God help me Amen
Done in Convention by the Unanimous Consent of the States present the Seventeenth Day of September in the Year of our Lord one thousand seven hundred and Eighty seven.
Those things certainly help us try to wrap our heads around the matter in the here and now. Well. To the degree that we can. In that day all we will have is Christ.
I’m leery of the sola scriptura when combined with the Priesthood of Believers. It seems that in modern context,’maybe it’s a Merican thing, people lean toward this giving the liberty for personal interpretation. To one degree or another, a personal interpretation of the text. The idea has become a bastard son.
I’m leery of the sola scriptura when combined with the Priesthood of Believers. It seems that in modern context,’maybe it’s a Merican thing, people lean toward this giving the liberty for personal interpretation. To one degree or another, a personal interpretation of the text. The idea has become a bastard son.
Those things certainly help us try to wrap our heads around the matter in the here and now. Well. To the degree that we can. In that day all we will have is Christ.
I’m leery of the sola scriptura when combined with the Priesthood of Believers. It seems that in modern context,’maybe it’s a Merican thing, people lean toward this giving the liberty for personal interpretation. To one degree or another, a personal interpretation of the text. The idea has become a bastard son.
My experience is that serious Protestants are studious, and generally focused on Romans. I think that is a good thing. Private interpretation... I get your concern, but they used that directly against Luther Himself.
Done in Convention by the Unanimous Consent of the States present the Seventeenth Day of September in the Year of our Lord one thousand seven hundred and Eighty seven.
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