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Joined: Sep 2010
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Sep 2010
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Until the front ocular hits the rail ! Hacksaw. That Mauser is an abomination. LOL
"I can't be canceled, because, I don't give a fuuck!" --- Kid Rock 2022
Holocaust Deniers, the ultimate perverted dipchits: Bristoe, TheRealHawkeye, stophel, Ghostinthemachine, anyone else?
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Campfire Tracker
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It's the German way. Most times the scope is carried in a padded leather case, and mounted once in the high seat. Its strong, and returns to zero. It's a bit high tho. My experience with a rail, is that rings have to be high enough for the front ocular to clear the front of the rail. That puts the scope higher than my liking. I dont like it..... So use lower rings and cut off the front of the rail, or buy one that's short enough to start with. This isn't that hard; a rail mount can end up about the same height as a dual dovetail and low rings. You came here asking for suggestions, and have been led to water. If you didn't want to hear suggestions, why not just stick with the DD setup you've got?
Last edited by Yondering; 12/10/19.
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Joined: Jul 2019
Posts: 158
Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
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I use Leupold dual dovetails, Warne’s, DNZ’s on hunting rifles. My killing rifles get Seekins or Nightforce.
Originally Posted by beretzs
I used an 06 with 212 ELD this year. I kinda joked with my buddies it was sorta like a 6.5 Creed with some ballz...
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Joined: Aug 2010
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,135 Likes: 12 |
I dont, and haven't liked the rail and rings thing. Had that kinda set up on a 300 rum, and soon changed to dual dove tails. Made my scope sit too high to me. If you go with a Nightforce (as you stated in the op), what Nightforce are you looking at getting? Most of my Nightforce scopes have 56mm objective lenses and taller rings will be needed. The beauty in the rail system is it is rock solid and gives you more places to put those robust rings. When going Nightforce, you might as well buy some Nightforce rings, while you are at it,.
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
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Campfire Outfitter
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OP
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Campfire Regular
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I use Leupold dual dovetails, Warne’s, DNZ’s on hunting rifles. My killing rifles get Seekins or Nightforce. Care to explain the difference?
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Joined: Jul 2008
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Campfire Outfitter
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I dont like rails because I, (looking back), not knowing more, put a long rail on a rifle. Had to use taller rings for the front to not hit. Wrong cheek weld for my Mcmillan BDL pattern. Didn't know other rails were available, so I didn't like it, so I didn't search more. Like what I use now.
Last edited by splattermatic; 12/10/19.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jan 2008
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Dual Doves are my favorite for hunting guns.
Just don't like the height of the rail set ups unless I've got an adjustable cheek piece.
Exactly. Same here. You know, they do make high, medium, and low rings that fit rails just like they make high, medium, and low rings to fit dual doves. It's just a matter of a little research. Depending on the rail you use...the general rule of thumb is...if you use medium rings with the dual doves...you would use low rings on the rail. If I’m putting a rail on a rifle it’s gonna have 20 moa built in which isn’t helping with height. I do love their modularity as well as adjustability
Screw you! I'm voting for Trump again!
Ecc 10:2 The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but that of a fool to the 24HCF.
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Joined: Jan 2010
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 32,130 Likes: 1 |
You know, they do make high, medium, and low rings that fit rails just like they make high, medium, and low rings to fit dual doves. It's just a matter of a little research.
Depending on the rail you use...the general rule of thumb is...if you use medium rings with the dual doves...you would use low rings on the rail.
https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbt...catinny-rail-heights-listed#Post14214699
If you put Taco Bell sauce in your ramen noodles it tastes just like poverty
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Joined: Mar 2001
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Campfire Outfitter
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There's nothing wrong with dual dovetails, they're extremely strong. Most of the problems you're going to have out of mounting systems are with the screws anyway, manufacturers should have long ago gone to 8-40 screws as standard. Misaligned screw holes and receivers can cause trouble too, the QC of some major American manufacturers through the years has been horrid and getting the rings to line up was hard. That's not a fault of the base/rings. 99% of the time if you hear of someone having trouble with the dual dovetails themselves it's because they twisted the ring in and out of the base. Once you install the ring in the base it's done, don't ever twist them out, consider it to be one piece after that. Removing them loosens the dovetail.
I like rails on some of my rifles because they're easy, give you a 20 MOA option, and make swapping scopes quick and easy. My big game rifles don't wear them though, they make the scope sit too high and obstruct the loading port more than I like. I do have some burris 2 piece picatinny bases on one rifle. They're 2 piece bases with picatinny slots that allow you to use the same rings that you'd use on a rail. I use them and super low TPS rings to get a scope with a 42mm objective low enough on my M70 7mm rem mag.
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Campfire Tracker
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You know, they do make high, medium, and low rings that fit rails just like they make high, medium, and low rings to fit dual doves. It's just a matter of a little research.
Depending on the rail you use...the general rule of thumb is...if you use medium rings with the dual doves...you would use low rings on the rail.
https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbt...catinny-rail-heights-listed#Post14214699Great info. Thanks!
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Campfire Outfitter
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.... I do have some burris 2 piece picatinny bases on one rifle. They're 2 piece bases with picatinny slots that allow you to use the same rings that you'd use on a rail. I use them and super low TPS rings to get a scope with a 42mm objective low enough on my M70 7mm rem mag.
I like the Burris XTP bases. Low height, open port, strong, flexible ring spacing....the low height being the biggest draw for me over other pic bases.
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Joined: Sep 2010
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Sep 2010
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And Leupold and Nightforce make two piece Pic style bases, with 20 MOA available from Nightforce.
So, other than DDs, is there anything of interest?
"I can't be canceled, because, I don't give a fuuck!" --- Kid Rock 2022
Holocaust Deniers, the ultimate perverted dipchits: Bristoe, TheRealHawkeye, stophel, Ghostinthemachine, anyone else?
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 26,585 Likes: 17
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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I guess I am just ignorant on this. When we talk "forever" on a mount, that implies that some systems won't last forever. Is anything failing on ring and base set-ups? Rails obviously afford better fine tuning of position, but that doesn't speak to durability/foreverness. How would one rail be any more forever than another? There are no moving are wear components. If the threads and screws are robust enough to accept the torque of tightening, what else is there? I chuckle when I see rings with six screws. The two screws on my 45-70 rings held just fine through many full house loads. I mention that because I don't think I have ever subjected a rifle/scope set up to more hard use than that one, and it was a cheap fixed power tasco 2.5X and Leupold rings and bases. I set it and it never flinched from there.
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Bet you have flinched a time or two...touching off those full house 45-70s
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Bet you have flinched a time or two...touching off those full house 45-70s I loved that gun and that cheap shotgun scope. At 100 yards with my best load (IIRC 57g 3031 350g Hornady RN) would typically put two shots touching and one barely not touching. So 1/2 to 3/4 inch groups were the norm. People marveled at that rig. Heck, I did too. That load was manageable. I developed a few 405 grain bullet loads that pushed beyond my comfort threshold. They weren't as accurate as the 350's, so the choice to avoid those loads was easier.
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Joined: Jan 2010
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 32,130 Likes: 1 |
I guess I am just ignorant on this. When we talk "forever" on a mount, that implies that some systems won't last forever. Is anything failing on ring and base set-ups? Rails obviously afford better fine tuning of position, but that doesn't speak to durability/foreverness. How would one rail be any more forever than another? There are no moving are wear components. If the threads and screws are robust enough to accept the torque of tightening, what else is there? I chuckle when I see rings with six screws. The two screws on my 45-70 rings held just fine through many full house loads. I mention that because I don't think I have ever subjected a rifle/scope set up to more hard use than that one, and it was a cheap fixed power tasco 2.5X and Leupold rings and bases. I set it and it never flinched from there. A two plus pound scope on that 45-70 might have transformed your impression of six screw rings. A two plus pound scope on a modest weight rifle chambered in a big magnum with a fast recoil impulse definitely would.
If you put Taco Bell sauce in your ramen noodles it tastes just like poverty
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 26,585 Likes: 17
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 26,585 Likes: 17 |
I guess I am just ignorant on this. When we talk "forever" on a mount, that implies that some systems won't last forever. Is anything failing on ring and base set-ups? Rails obviously afford better fine tuning of position, but that doesn't speak to durability/foreverness. How would one rail be any more forever than another? There are no moving are wear components. If the threads and screws are robust enough to accept the torque of tightening, what else is there? I chuckle when I see rings with six screws. The two screws on my 45-70 rings held just fine through many full house loads. I mention that because I don't think I have ever subjected a rifle/scope set up to more hard use than that one, and it was a cheap fixed power tasco 2.5X and Leupold rings and bases. I set it and it never flinched from there. A two plus pound scope on that 45-70 might have transformed your impression of six screw rings. A two plus pound scope on a modest weight rifle chambered in a big magnum with a fast recoil impulse definitely would. I suppose I get that. You just described very few of the set-ups people use in day to day shooting and none of the set-ups in which I have seen people extolling the virtues of six screw rings. Seems like they are most popular with the AR and heavy tactical rifle crowd.
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Campfire Tracker
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If I’m putting a rail on a rifle it’s gonna have 20 moa built in which isn’t helping with height.
A 20 moa rail doesn't make that much difference in height, compared to a flat rail. But they are definitely a good idea. I like a low mounted scope too - and use rail mounts when I can. Some of you guys have convinced yourselves that rail = high, which just ain't so.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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20 moa makes a huge difference in reality.
Vortex low on a 20 moa rail (Bighorn Origin- same diameter as 700 front)= .610” bottom of scope to bottom of base.
Vortex low on flat pic Rem 700 front = .472”
DD med on Rem 700 front = .392”
My PREFERENCE remains DD’s on a carry gun.
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Screw you! I'm voting for Trump again!
Ecc 10:2 The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but that of a fool to the 24HCF.
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