I have been following this thread very closely and I see so many here are wise, knowledgeable, politically correct but not prolific with the Bible, come on where are all the Bible student. I’ll no express my person believes on tithing but I will show you all God’s instruction on this matter. Let’s look to Deuteronomy 14 vs 22. And it says
22“You must set aside a tithe of your crops—one-tenth of all the crops you harvest each year. 23Bring this tithe to the designated place of worship—the place the LORD your God chooses for his name to be honored—and eat it there in his presence. This applies to your tithes of grain, new wine, olive oil, and the firstborn males of your flocks and herds. Doing this will teach you always to fear the LORD your God.
24“Now when the LORD your God blesses you with a good harvest, the place of worship he chooses for his name to be honored might be too far for you to bring the tithe. 25If so, you may sell the tithe portion of your crops and herds, put the money in a pouch, and go to the place the LORD your God has chosen. 26When you arrive, you may use the money to buy any kind of food you want—cattle, sheep, goats, wine, or other alcoholic drink. Then feast there in the presence of the LORD your God and celebrate with your household. 27And do not neglect the Levites in your town, for they will receive no allotment of land among you.
28“At the end of every third year, bring the entire tithe of that year’s harvest and store it in the nearest town. 29Give it to the Levites, who will receive no allotment of land among you, as well as to the foreigners living among you, the orphans, and the widows in your towns, so they can eat and be satisfied. Then the LORD your God will bless you in all your work.”
As you all can see the Bible never told us to bring money to the house of God. A lot of people don’t study. I didn’t put it there check it yourself. Jesus chased away people trying to make money off the church, the Bible mentioned that the LOVE of money is Evil. The Bible says bring us tith and eat it, give to the Levite’s(priests). If you house is far away from the church sell your tith( you can see here the tith itself is not important, bringing it to enjoy with the fellow members is the key) God doesn’t need money, he doesn’t. Believe what you want but this here is the truth.
Re, your last paragraph:
Anyone with a bare modicum of common sense knows that no organization runs for free.
Yours may be a case and example of why the Church in earlier times didn’t want folks to have a copy of the Bible.
I mean no offense.
The degree of my privacy is no business of yours.
What we've learned from history is that we haven't learned from it.
The Bible tells us to tithe. If you already belong to a church or parish, continue doing what you can as you always have.
But I personally wouldn't send one thin dime to any of these frauds. I'd pass up a clear shot at a Muzz to take a whack at one of those bastards.
Originally Posted by Jim_Conrad
Originally Posted by OrangeOkie
Originally Posted by Jim_Conrad
. . . I dont know this Copeland guy.....but he never said send the money to him.....did he?
Got to get out more Jimbo!
That could be!
All I watch is cartoons.
That actually demonstrates that you are probably smarter than the rest of us. The real question is Warner Brothers or Hanna-Barbera?
Here's a short intro to Copeland. He misread his tea leaves with Ted Cruz. Ignore the source of the vid. It's just the first on that showed up in the YT search.
Originally Posted by OrangeOkie
Originally Posted by George_De_Vries_3rd
Don’t judge God in His Heavens by those who claim to know Him and speak for Him when their actions are distasteful, disgusting, insensitive and what ever else they may. That’s nothing new. Hearts are out of bounds, but we certainly can judge words and actions and even intent. Those have nothing to do with who God is.
He isn’t responsible for the little gold-diggers that swirl around His feet. People always want to decry God because the people associated with Him — those that steal, lie, commit adultery, but It’s small thinking as we have no reference other then the scriptures for who and what God is, and that is incomprehensible.
Christ came to save the world, those who would believe and obey. The next stop, He comes as the Lion of Judah and as a judge and you can believe ever injustice, seen or not seen, great or small of every age, will be laid bare.
Every knee will confess; every knee will bow and there will be weeping and the gnashing of teeth. It will not be as the mild-mannered Christ of some two thousand years ago. It will be the end.
No, the opiate of the people which Marx, would gladly, share about if he could, is the lulling one’s mind into an attitude of indifference or rejection, and self-service, rejecting the gift of eternal life. This week is about what Christ did to purchase that very expensive gift for us — that payment for our sins. It’s free to us. You reject it and you pay.
Go to Christ now.
All of this was fulfilled in AD 70 when Jesus came in the clouds of judgment on the unbelieving and unrepentant Jews, and physically destroyed the city of Jerusalem, the temple, Levitical priesthood, and every physical vestige of the Mosaic economy. It was necessary to fully establish his kingdom, and his reign which shall never end.
We are mailing in our weekly tithe, because churches have expenses whether they're open or not, and just because we are attending in person, that does not give us a pass from tithing, As far as Kenneth Copeland and the rest of the TV evangelists go.........they need to get a real job and quit fleecing people.
Not that I believe in tithing, which I don't, I just make an observation. If you are not working then you are not making money. Tithe on what? 10% of zero is zero.
If you’re not working you can give of your time and your talents. There’s always work needing to be done.
Not preaching here. Don’t take it that way.
I object to the word "tithe" even being used in new testament doctrine. There is no foundation for it.
There really is not. As Hastings pointed out, in a lot of circles, people will point out the passages in the book of Hebrews comparing Christ to Melchizedek where the scenario of Abraham giving him a tenth of the spoils of a war as basis that Christians owe a tenth of their money. To my knowledge that is the only place you find the word "tithe" mentioned after the resurrection and establishment of the new covenant. I think that is mighty shaky theology. Far as we know it was a one shot deal. We don't see Abraham perpetually tithing to Melchizedek.
In the various epistles and the book of Acts there are instances where money is dealt with. In a nutshell, they helped the poor and were taught that if a minister was helping you with your spiritual needs, you should help him with his physical needs, and that a minister deserved to make his living preaching. The amount given was up to the individual there was never a percentage or amount put to it. I figure between Peter, James, John and Paul, had the tithing system not went out with the rest of the law, at least one of them would have said so.
You will be hard pressed to find a church that teaches this. I would love to go to one that says we need x number of dollars for the preacher, x to keep the lights on and we want x for this or that. Please give as you are led. No, instead they break out Malachi chapter 3 which really has nothing to do with us.
Its really common sense. If you are going to attend a church, you need to help out with the expenses unless you are a destitute person. Otherwise you are a free loader. How much you give is between you and God. Personally I think Billy Graham had it right when it comes to running a national tv ministry. He had a board of directors and was paid a salary. IIRC, their financial statements were available just like a public company.
"Men must be governed by God or they will be ruled by tyrants". --- William Penn
Gonna have to pay attention to RJY66. Maybe it's 'cause I agree with him, but he writes it well! (Have you noticed the elevated level of conversations since March began?)
I find it hard to believe that someone like that has a following. Or that anyone would actually give him money so that he and his cronies can live lavish lifestyles. I thought that would have all ended with Jimmy Bakker, et al, with their scandalous antics.
You ever watch wrasslin' on TV? The stands are packed.
I find it hard to believe that someone like that has a following. Or that anyone would actually give him money so that he and his cronies can live lavish lifestyles. I thought that would have all ended with Jimmy Bakker, et al, with their scandalous antics.
You ever watch wrasslin' on TV? The stands are packed.
Word.
It’s Showtime. People enjoy entertainment and are willing to pay for it. Or so it would appear to some.
The degree of my privacy is no business of yours.
What we've learned from history is that we haven't learned from it.
I have been following this thread very closely and I see so many here are wise, knowledgeable, politically correct but not prolific with the Bible, come on where are all the Bible student. I’ll no express my person believes on tithing but I will show you all God’s instruction on this matter. Let’s look to Deuteronomy 14 vs 22. And it says
22“You must set aside a tithe of your crops—one-tenth of all the crops you harvest each year. 23Bring this tithe to the designated place of worship—the place the LORD your God chooses for his name to be honored—and eat it there in his presence. This applies to your tithes of grain, new wine, olive oil, and the firstborn males of your flocks and herds. Doing this will teach you always to fear the LORD your God.
24“Now when the LORD your God blesses you with a good harvest, the place of worship he chooses for his name to be honored might be too far for you to bring the tithe. 25If so, you may sell the tithe portion of your crops and herds, put the money in a pouch, and go to the place the LORD your God has chosen. 26When you arrive, you may use the money to buy any kind of food you want—cattle, sheep, goats, wine, or other alcoholic drink. Then feast there in the presence of the LORD your God and celebrate with your household. 27And do not neglect the Levites in your town, for they will receive no allotment of land among you.
28“At the end of every third year, bring the entire tithe of that year’s harvest and store it in the nearest town. 29Give it to the Levites, who will receive no allotment of land among you, as well as to the foreigners living among you, the orphans, and the widows in your towns, so they can eat and be satisfied. Then the LORD your God will bless you in all your work.”
As you all can see the Bible never told us to bring money to the house of God. A lot of people don’t study. I didn’t put it there check it yourself. Jesus chased away people trying to make money off the church, the Bible mentioned that the LOVE of money is Evil. The Bible says bring us tith and eat it, give to the Levite’s(priests). If you house is far away from the church sell your tith( you can see here the tith itself is not important, bringing it to enjoy with the fellow members is the key) God doesn’t need money, he doesn’t. Believe what you want but this here is the truth.
Re, your last paragraph:
Anyone with a bare modicum of common sense knows that no organization runs for free.
Yours may be a case and example of why the Church in earlier times didn’t want folks to have a copy of the Bible.
I mean no offense.
Not offended buddie, the truth will set people free and I am not gonna come here and act like I know something that others don’t know but the Church wasn’t meant to be an organization, it was created my Jesus to be the body of God. Any church that’s an organization has taken the wrong turn.
I have been following this thread very closely and I see so many here are wise, knowledgeable, politically correct but not prolific with the Bible, come on where are all the Bible student. I’ll no express my person believes on tithing but I will show you all God’s instruction on this matter. Let’s look to Deuteronomy 14 vs 22. And it says
22“You must set aside a tithe of your crops—one-tenth of all the crops you harvest each year. 23Bring this tithe to the designated place of worship—the place the LORD your God chooses for his name to be honored—and eat it there in his presence. This applies to your tithes of grain, new wine, olive oil, and the firstborn males of your flocks and herds. Doing this will teach you always to fear the LORD your God.
24“Now when the LORD your God blesses you with a good harvest, the place of worship he chooses for his name to be honored might be too far for you to bring the tithe. 25If so, you may sell the tithe portion of your crops and herds, put the money in a pouch, and go to the place the LORD your God has chosen. 26When you arrive, you may use the money to buy any kind of food you want—cattle, sheep, goats, wine, or other alcoholic drink. Then feast there in the presence of the LORD your God and celebrate with your household. 27And do not neglect the Levites in your town, for they will receive no allotment of land among you.
28“At the end of every third year, bring the entire tithe of that year’s harvest and store it in the nearest town. 29Give it to the Levites, who will receive no allotment of land among you, as well as to the foreigners living among you, the orphans, and the widows in your towns, so they can eat and be satisfied. Then the LORD your God will bless you in all your work.”
As you all can see the Bible never told us to bring money to the house of God. A lot of people don’t study. I didn’t put it there check it yourself. Jesus chased away people trying to make money off the church, the Bible mentioned that the LOVE of money is Evil. The Bible says bring us tith and eat it, give to the Levite’s(priests). If you house is far away from the church sell your tith( you can see here the tith itself is not important, bringing it to enjoy with the fellow members is the key) God doesn’t need money, he doesn’t. Believe what you want but this here is the truth.
Re, your last paragraph:
Anyone with a bare modicum of common sense knows that no organization runs for free.
Yours may be a case and example of why the Church in earlier times didn’t want folks to have a copy of the Bible.
I mean no offense.
Not offended buddie, the truth will set people free and I am not gonna come here and act like I know something that others don’t know but the Church wasn’t meant to be an organization, it was created my Jesus to be the body of God. Any church that’s an organization has taken the wrong turn.
Couldn’t disagree more.
Take care.
The degree of my privacy is no business of yours.
What we've learned from history is that we haven't learned from it.
I used to attend a church in South Oklahoma City. The first time I ever went there, I was zoomin’ around on my VTX 1800 on a late Saturday afternoon...having no intention of goin’ to church...and I saw their sign out front that said “Services Tonight at 6 pm”. I looked at my watch, it was 5:50 pm...and I swear I just felt pulled to go...so I whipped into the parkin’ lot, and went in, wearin’ my shorts and tank top and tennis shoes. From the get-go, to say I was “blown away” woulda been an understatement. At the end of the service, they passed around some wicker baskets for a collection...and the pastor said, “if you’re an adult, and you’re in need of food or shelter or clothing, if you see some money in that basket that would help you reach this need, please feel free to reach in there and take it.” I was floored. I continued to go to that church for the remainder of my time in Oklahoma. And that pastor said the same thing about that, every time, at the end of the service when a collection was being taken. I’d never experienced anything like that before at a church, nor have I experienced anything like that since, at a church.
I used to attend a church in South Oklahoma City. The first time I ever went there, I was zoomin’ around on my VTX 1800 on a late Saturday afternoon...having no intention of goin’ to church...and I saw their sign out front that said “Services Tonight at 6 pm”. I looked at my watch, it was 5:50 pm...and I swear I just felt pulled to go...so I whipped into the parkin’ lot, and went in, wearin’ my shorts and tank top and tennis shoes. From the get-go, to say I was “blown away” woulda been an understatement. At the end of the service, they passed around some wicker baskets for a collection...and the pastor said, “if you’re an adult, and you’re in need of food or shelter or clothing, if you see some money in that basket that would help you reach this need, please feel free to reach in there and take it.” I was floored. I continued to go to that church for the remainder of my time in Oklahoma. And that pastor said the same thing about that, every time, at the end of the service when a collection was being taken. I’d never experienced anything like that before at a church, nor have I experienced anything like that since, at a church.
More than remarkable.
The degree of my privacy is no business of yours.
What we've learned from history is that we haven't learned from it.
Yours may be a case and example of why the Church in earlier times didn’t want folks to have a copy of the Bible.
They knew they were in trouble if people became literate and read it for themselves. They burned people alive for reading the bible or asking questions. Even with all the church's redactions to the bible they could not afford to have people read it for themselves and come to the conclusion that their religion was fraudulent and oppressive, far removed from Jesus' teachings. Damn right, the Catholic church could not allow reading and darned if all the Protestants given time didn't fall into the same mindset.
Patriotism (and religion) is the last refuge of a scoundrel.
Yours may be a case and example of why the Church in earlier times didn’t want folks to have a copy of the Bible.
They knew they were in trouble if people became literate and read it for themselves. They burned people alive for reading the bible or asking questions. Even with all the church's redactions to the bible they could not afford to have people read it for themselves and come to the conclusion that their religion was fraudulent and oppressive, far removed from Jesus' teachings. Damn right, the Catholic church could not allow reading and darned if all the Protestants given time didn't fall into the same mindset.
Would you agree that whole sects of religion have been founded on a specific text within the Bible?
Text without context is simply pretext.
The degree of my privacy is no business of yours.
What we've learned from history is that we haven't learned from it.
I used to attend a church in South Oklahoma City. The first time I ever went there, I was zoomin’ around on my VTX 1800 on a late Saturday afternoon...having no intention of goin’ to church...and I saw their sign out front that said “Services Tonight at 6 pm”. I looked at my watch, it was 5:50 pm...and I swear I just felt pulled to go...so I whipped into the parkin’ lot, and went in, wearin’ my shorts and tank top and tennis shoes. From the get-go, to say I was “blown away” woulda been an understatement. At the end of the service, they passed around some wicker baskets for a collection...and the pastor said, “if you’re an adult, and you’re in need of food or shelter or clothing, if you see some money in that basket that would help you reach this need, please feel free to reach in there and take it.” I was floored. I continued to go to that church for the remainder of my time in Oklahoma. And that pastor said the same thing about that, every time, at the end of the service when a collection was being taken. I’d never experienced anything like that before at a church, nor have I experienced anything like that since, at a church.
Yours may be a case and example of why the Church in earlier times didn’t want folks to have a copy of the Bible.
They knew they were in trouble if people became literate and read it for themselves. They burned people alive for reading the bible or asking questions. Even with all the church's redactions to the bible they could not afford to have people read it for themselves and come to the conclusion that their religion was fraudulent and oppressive, far removed from Jesus' teachings. Damn right, the Catholic church could not allow reading and darned if all the Protestants given time didn't fall into the same mindset.
Would you agree that whole sects of religion have been founded on a specific text within the Bible?Text without context is simply pretext.
Well, I have politely invited the Jehovah Witness gang and the Mormons in and for sure they were taking scripture out of context. They both applied the dry bones in Ezekiel to their church and the Jehovahs got angry when I told them it applied to real Jews and physical Israel. The Jehovahs finally admitted to me that they had a central authority that dictated to them. Yes, if I understand the question, there are churches that ignore most of the bible and concentrate on a small part that ratifies their belief system. Like the ones that take Paul over the rest of the bible.
Patriotism (and religion) is the last refuge of a scoundrel.
I find it hard to believe that someone like that has a following. Or that anyone would actually give him money so that he and his cronies can live lavish lifestyles. I thought that would have all ended with Jimmy Bakker, et al, with their scandalous antics.
You ever watch wrasslin' on TV? The stands are packed.
Word.
It’s Showtime. People enjoy entertainment and are willing to pay for it. Or so it would appear to some.
Sure, entertaining in a way, except when the balance goes from entertainment to something that is taken seriously....to the point of supporting an undeserving sheister's lavish lifestyle with hard earned cash. There are better ways to use one's money.
Yours may be a case and example of why the Church in earlier times didn’t want folks to have a copy of the Bible.
They knew they were in trouble if people became literate and read it for themselves. They burned people alive for reading the bible or asking questions. Even with all the church's redactions to the bible they could not afford to have people read it for themselves and come to the conclusion that their religion was fraudulent and oppressive, far removed from Jesus' teachings. Damn right, the Catholic church could not allow reading and darned if all the Protestants given time didn't fall into the same mindset.
Would you agree that whole sects of religion have been founded on a specific text within the Bible?Text without context is simply pretext.
Well, I have politely invited the Jehovah Witness gang and the Mormons in and for sure they were taking scripture out of context. They both applied the dry bones in Ezekiel to their church and the Jehovahs got angry when I told them it applied to real Jews and physical Israel. The Jehovahs finally admitted to me that they had a central authority that dictated to them. Yes, if I understand the question, there are churches that ignore most of the bible and concentrate on a small part that ratifies their belief system. Like the ones that take Paul over the rest of the bible.
I appreciate your answer.
I have to say that I admire the Jehovas and the Mormons for ‘living their faith.’
Yeah, Paul accounts for 30% or more of the NT. It took him getting knocked off of his ass and onto his ass to eventually see the “light”. But see it, he did. Fearless.
Last edited by Old_Toot; 04/06/20.
The degree of my privacy is no business of yours.
What we've learned from history is that we haven't learned from it.
I find it hard to believe that someone like that has a following. Or that anyone would actually give him money so that he and his cronies can live lavish lifestyles. I thought that would have all ended with Jimmy Bakker, et al, with their scandalous antics.
You ever watch wrasslin' on TV? The stands are packed.
Word.
It’s Showtime. People enjoy entertainment and are willing to pay for it. Or so it would appear to some.
Sure, entertaining in a way, except when the balance goes from entertainment to something that is taken seriously....to the point of supporting an undeserving sheister's lavish lifestyle with hard earned cash. There are better ways to use one's money.
You’re preaching to the choir.
Supporting undeserving sheisters has long been with us and ever shall remain.
Many, many people take their entertainment very, very seriously. Ask any Rugby or soccer fan.
The degree of my privacy is no business of yours.
What we've learned from history is that we haven't learned from it.
![[Linked Image from i.pinimg.com]](https://i.pinimg.com/originals/98/b6/d8/98b6d863a5f722b551cd8e1440bd2bd4.jpg)
