It's interesting to see some peoples priorities during all these times

His rant says it all.

Enjoy:

I've looked the man right in the eyes. I would trust him no more than any Western Diamondback.

Yes.!........... Send your money to God!....... Make the check out to me...... Here's my address....................................

He’s an evil bastard.

kills all the belief anyone might have had..

Christ is big business.

No...misrepresenting is big business.

They want your money!

Hanco: It is sad in a way, that most all major religions and churches put such a heavy emphasis (major objective!) on tithing (collecting vast amounts of money!)!
I will admit I have seen some church actually spend SOME of their monies on needy people and some worthy causes.
After my family (when I was a youngster) was kicked out of two major religions in less than 10 (ten) years, over this very issue, I have chosen to do my worshiping outside the walls of those greedsters buildings (church's).
Sad.
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Matthew 7:15
New International Version
"Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves.

Amen

Having sat on my Parish Board for almost 10 years when my kids were in Parochial School I can tell you it takes a lot of dang money to run one in modern times.

He has that Satanic look, doesn't he. There is a special place in hell reserved for him and other false teachers like him.

His job seems to be his source.

They shoud be taxed..

Uhhh....this is not a far out concept.



Lots of small churches really depend on the weekly offering.


Our little 31 member Presbyterian church had members that asked what address to send their offering to.

So, they decided to make the address known to the members so they can mail the offering.



Hard to see anything real satanic about that.




I dont know this Copeland guy.....but he never said send the money to him.....did he?

By definition, "tithe" is 10% of your gross income. When you are unemployed (zero income), 10% of zero is zero. All churches and religious organizations are going to take a double hit during this period. Many small churches were already dealing with declining attendance and declining giving. Then add in the reduced giving due to the doors being closed and parshioners being laid off / unemployed.

God has blessed our little church with very conservative leadership. As a result, we have approximately a 6 months of financial buffer. Unfortunately, many other small churches are not in such a position to weather the storm. When I see large affluent churches like the above video that have not properly prepared, I just shake my head...

I quit watching Kenneth Copeland, Jimmy Swaggart, and Jim Baker years ago when I realized all they talked about was money. Now the only television preacher I watch with any consistency is
Dr Charles Stanley.
Tithing is a very important to the local church. In fact, tithing is the only thing that God gives permission for us to test him. Malachi 4: 10-11.

Deans

You'd be shocked to see his "church campus." He flies around in a business jet. Or at least he did back in the 90s.

I have great disdain for most all tv preachers. I don’t like Copeland but in all honesty he said to tithe YOUR church not his.

Clyde

Got to get out more Jimbo!

^^^This^^^

That could be!



All I watch is cartoons.

Very good choice. You’d really like David Jeremiah then.

LOL!!

You're better off.

I got in a bit of a controversy at a business meeting of the Southern Baptist Church I attend when I took issue with the preacher about his previous Sunday sermon exhorting the members to tithe and he tied it to all income, gross income at that. He used the book of Malachi quoting "will a man rob God". I told him that tithing was strictly tied to the produce of the land to support the Levite priesthood. The Levites ran the whole country and did not receive an inheritance as did the other 12 tribes. I pointed out that wages were not tithed, neither fishing or mining. Also I pointed out that Malachi was accusing the priests of robbing, not the ones who tithed and gave offerings. I told him there were poor people in the congregation that did good to give $5 and that was more than me giving $1000. I pointed out that we had a man sitting in there with total kidney failure struggling to get by on well earned SS disability. He wouldn't back down and waved his bible at me saying he wouldn't apologize for preaching God's word. I told him he needed to read it first and that if wanted a tithe from me he had best be building some corrals. Darned if another retired preacher in the congregation didn't fall in and tell me that Abraham had tithed pre covenant. I said that's right he gave Sodom's goods in tithe not his own money and then returned the 90% back over to Sodom along with the captives. Anyway there hasn't been another sermon on tithing.

Good for you!

He is right to encourage folks to support their own church. All churches require continued financial support from the congregation.

if anyone listens to or sends money to that snake then they deserve what they get. you would have to be the most gullible dumbass on the planet to listen to him.

goes for most of the mega preachers, but him especially. that dude is evil itself.

[quote=johnn]They shoud be taxed..[/quote


But isn't the money they are sending already taxed by the Gov't.?

There is another thread going "what is dumber than a democrat"
The answer seems pretty clear

The opium of the unwashed..

Maybe misunderstanding each other.. I am saying churches should be paying taxes.

Not necessarily:

When you prepare your federal tax return, the IRS allows you to deduct the donations you make to churches. ... As long as you itemize your deductions, you can generally claim 100 percent of your church donations as a deduction.

https://turbotax.intuit.com/tax-tip...can-be-taken-off-federal-taxes/L1BjLBc7t

Her head looks like a really bad Photoshop job.

Yep.

Using his actions as justification for rejection of Christ is like using Mit Romney as the reason you’re not Conservative.

i have faith but don't attend any church, saw to many hypocrites there when i was young and did go.

here is with his medals.

Yup ........ God's going to hear a lot of excuses in the end.

Well, he's got bills to pay also. And, he needs more money to buy jet fuel, Ferrari's, new suits, etc.

Keep on sending that money in.

Mark 2:17
New International Version
On hearing this, Jesus said to them, "It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick. I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners."

Good on you for calling him out. I think someone ( a leader in your church) waving a bible in my face would be enough to find another church. The preacher sounds like a dick and not a decent human being with charity in his heart. You can find justification from stealing to murder in the Bible. Maybe you should remind him that the church should start paying its taxes to support the roads that enable the parishioners to get to church, their electricity, water etc all subsidized by tax payers who don't attend church.

Kenneth Copeland's net worth is about $760million!

Pretty good for a man of the cloth!

I had a nice little basement apartment in an old Victorian mansion back when I was between wives about 25 years ago. I'd get home from work about 3:30AM.

For a while there,..my routine was to get home,...fix a drink,...or two,....or three,....then watch Robert Tilton beg for money by speaking in tongues on the TV.

It was always good for a laugh.

Once or twice a week I'd call the number that was shown on the TV and tell whoever answered that they were going to hell.

It was always a black woman. You could tell from the way they talked.

They would respond by launching into hollering that Negro "praise the lord" stuff when I would tell them that they're going to hell for participating in that Robert Tilton charade.

They'd start to slow down and I'd say,..."It's gonna be hot!",..and they'd take off again.

They'd eventually hang up.

It didn't take much to amuse me at 3:30 AM after working a 10 hour shift back then.

Great story........

I'd like to do it again.

I wonder if they're still hustling money on TV by running those old Robert Tilton tapes?

I'm not going to stay up until 3: 30AM, however.

religion is very much a business in most parts, its why my faith is so hated by so many in the south, because we have no paid clergy. They don't want members asking the preacher, dude why are we having to pay you,

This guy:

Why deal with any of these middlemen?

Folks seem to lose track of their brains and forget that everything you see on TV is BS anyway...

Robert Tilton is a real piece of schit.
I remember when he had the Word of Faith Church in metro Dallas.

Copeland. What a piece of schit.

I wonder what happened to him.

I haven't seen him on TV since those days 25 years ago,....and they had him on tape during the wee hours of the morning even way back then.

Copeland needs his fleet of corporate jets
now more than ever.

he says he won't fly commercial cause of all the
demons lurking in the cabin, compounded with
covid 19...

Your two and D. James Kennedy Ministries along with Hal Lindsey I find very worthwhile to listen to each of the four.

Kennedy Ministries has a landmark lawsuit filed against the ACLU for labeling the Ministry as a hate organization for their stand on traditional marriage.

Hear hear, starman.

If you suggest it to Copeland im betting he’ll use it.

Don’t judge God in His Heavens by those who claim to know Him and speak for Him when their actions are distasteful, disgusting, insensitive and what ever else they may. That’s nothing new. Hearts are out of bounds, but we certainly can judge words and actions and even intent. Those have nothing to do with who God is.

He isn’t responsible for the little gold-diggers that swirl around His feet. People always want to decry God because the people associated with Him — those that steal, lie, commit adultery, but It’s small thinking as we have no reference other then the scriptures for who and what God is, and that is incomprehensible.

Christ came to save the world, those who would believe and obey. The next stop, He comes as the Lion of Judah and as a judge and you can believe ever injustice, seen or not seen, great or small of every age, will be laid bare.

Every knee will confess; every knee will bow and there will be weeping and the gnashing of teeth. It will not be as the mild-mannered Christ of some two thousand years ago. It will be the end.

No, the opiate of the people which Marx, would gladly, share about if he could, is the lulling one’s mind into an attitude of indifference or rejection, and self-service, rejecting the gift of eternal life. This week is about what Christ did to purchase that very expensive gift for us — that payment for our sins. It’s free to us. You reject it and you pay.

Go to Christ now.

you pay grocery stores to feed you dont you?

ever think what these preachers do in a course of a day to feed and help the needy?
where do you think it comes from?

you can bend the word any way you want....but GOD keeps tabs on the books. let him.
you just do what is commanded of you.

big mistake the world makes is to think 10% belongs to GOD.
wrong..................its all his. he just wants to see if you can handle giving back 10% of it. which seems to be too much for most.
but not for a new fishing boat, ammo, guns, hunting, or vacations.

ponder this.GODS hard drive never erases.
so weigh the words youre about to type very carefully.

The Bible is pretty specific as to tithing, and nearly everybody misinterprets it. It says very plainly, every tenth part of your increase. How you define your increase is the kicker. Pre tax income is no way an increase.

I’ll take your words as fact. A good man can easily see evil.

I would also propose that in the event of a complete meltdown of society where horrendous acts of violence are being committed. Someone in his locale, please put a round through his face.

Call it a tithe of justice for all those he’s milked of limited cash through fear and guilt.

Bonus tithes if you smoke his bitch wife too.

PS,
Antlers, apologies for the aggressive words under your name. I hate these types of individuals.

😎

All of this was fulfilled in AD 70 when Jesus came in the clouds of judgment on the unbelieving and unrepentant Jews, and physically destroyed the city of Jerusalem, the temple, Levitical priesthood, and every physical vestige of the Mosaic economy. It was necessary to fully establish his kingdom, and his reign which shall never end.

👊🏻 You’re a good dude.

Back at you...👍🏻😎

I wouldn't give you a dirty dime for the whole lot of those television evangelists.

LD, there’s several, maybe more, that minister honestly to the flock. For shut in folks they’re a blessing. I’ve named 4 that put Him first and I’ve yet to see deviations from them.

Then there’s those that you speak of. They’ll get their due just as we will.

Jmo, LD.

Hell yes...

I adopted this long ago. I give 100% of everything I have to God...and more...!

That way I figger I'm 10 times better than everyone else.

Anyway...it's all here waiting for God to come on down and claim it...


As to which God...well...that's WAY above my pay grade...

I figger let all the big azz wholes work it out amongst themselves who gets what and then I'll only have to deal with the winner.

Takes the pressure off me...it's survival of the fittest..."...as it is on Earth so shall it be in Heaven...!"

I'm prayin' I can hang on to my TP stash though...

Put another way,,,you ain’t taking anything with you when you leave here.

He will be down soon enough to claim what’s His.

Amen George. We done.

Yes sir!

Old_Toot, Maybe you're right and there are some that actually help the shut-ins. I don't know. I don't watch any of them. My folks used to be pretty fond of Billy Graham, though.

Give D. James Kennedy Ministries a listen. The program takes some of his sermons given back in the 1980s. They were prophetic for today’s world here in the USA. It’d be worth your while, I think.

He ties government largess to exactly what’s now happened and continues to deepen. The staff are all well educated and well spoken.

Well, I have to say, that's a creative interpretation of the prophesy.

Can't find a fault in that, anywhere. Well said, Mr. DeVries.

[quote=bobski]you pay grocery stores to feed you dont you?

ever think what these preachers do in a course of a day to feed and help the needy?
where do you think it comes from?

you can bend the word any way you want....but GOD keeps tabs on the books. let him.
you just do what is commanded of you.

big mistake the world makes is to think 10% belongs to GOD.
wrong..................its all his. he just wants to see if you can handle giving back 10% of it. which seems to be too much for most.
but not for a new fishing boat, ammo, guns, hunting, or vacations.

ponder this.GODS hard drive never erases.
so weigh the words youre about to type very carefully.[/quote]

Funny, then this whole forgiveness thing must be a lot of horse manure, right? God doesn’t forget? Most of us don’t forget the serious slights and wronging done to us either. But, we’re taught to forgive.

Apparently, based on your thoughts, God holds a pretty big grudge....Well, cool, then he and I will get along just fine.

😎

No grudges. Just a tally book.

The wrongs can be erased.

Our small church has to be hurting, we need to mail a check. The bills go on.

Not that I believe in tithing, which I don't, I just make an observation. If you are not working then you are not making money. Tithe on what? 10% of zero is zero.

If you’re not working you can give of your time and your talents. There’s always work needing to be done.

Not preaching here. Don’t take it that way.

Every preacher I had growing up had a nicer car than my folks.
Nicer clothes.
Easier life.
Had a priest cut in line for the keg at a wake, and I was done.

I will do what I feel is right to help the elderly, the sick, widows and the poor who need. Don't need a middle man handling it for me.
I'm prepared to explain that to my maker. Feel free to stand there and watch. Or laugh. No matter to me.

It ain’t about a middle man.

Can't convince me otherwise. I've seen it all. No matter HOW the individual or selected group comes to consensus on spending it, there is where cuts get doled out.
I don't need to pay dues and manage a clubhouse to feel just fine, the wretch I am.

You do have honest middle men who do His work.

As He told Peter each time after asking him three times , do you love Me?

Feed My Sheep.

All god wants is faith, you don't need any church.

They can't be too well educated if they are preaching today's current events are fulfillment of prophecy. That type of folly has been preached for the past 120 years in America.

We once had a highways minister in British Columbia who was also a minister in a church and a fairly wealthy man. The story was that his method for dividing the collection plate was to throw the proceeds into the air, saying, "What stays up is the Lord's. What comes down is mine!" I don't think many who had dealings with this individual doubted the story. GD

I wasn’t around 120 years ago. You ?

Listen to them and then form your opinion or take the easy way with your existing one.

Maybe you missed where I clearly stated, relative to our government of today ‘. You can go back and reread if you have the time.

To clarify for you, I wasn’t speaking of the Book of Revelation. Take your time with that one, too. You may be a while.

In all my years of running two fairly profitable businesses, I've come to the conclusion, I'd rather do business with sinners.

Money grabbing churches build their
business model around a middleman
they call Jesus.

I object to the word "tithe" even being used in new testament doctrine. There is no foundation for it.

What a slimey POS

I find it hard to believe that someone like that has a following. Or that anyone would actually give him money so that he and his cronies can live lavish lifestyles. I thought that would have all ended with Jimmy Bakker, et al, with their scandalous antics.

I have been following this thread very closely and I see so many here are wise, knowledgeable, politically correct but not prolific with the Bible, come on where are all the Bible student. I’ll no express my person believes on tithing but I will show you all God’s instruction on this matter. Let’s look to Deuteronomy 14 vs 22. And it says

22“You must set aside a tithe of your crops—one-tenth of all the crops you harvest each year. 23Bring this tithe to the designated place of worship—the place the LORD your God chooses for his name to be honored—and eat it there in his presence. This applies to your tithes of grain, new wine, olive oil, and the firstborn males of your flocks and herds. Doing this will teach you always to fear the LORD your God.

24“Now when the LORD your God blesses you with a good harvest, the place of worship he chooses for his name to be honored might be too far for you to bring the tithe. 25If so, you may sell the tithe portion of your crops and herds, put the money in a pouch, and go to the place the LORD your God has chosen. 26When you arrive, you may use the money to buy any kind of food you want—cattle, sheep, goats, wine, or other alcoholic drink. Then feast there in the presence of the LORD your God and celebrate with your household. 27And do not neglect the Levites in your town, for they will receive no allotment of land among you.

28“At the end of every third year, bring the entire tithe of that year’s harvest and store it in the nearest town. 29Give it to the Levites, who will receive no allotment of land among you, as well as to the foreigners living among you, the orphans, and the widows in your towns, so they can eat and be satisfied. Then the LORD your God will bless you in all your work.”


As you all can see the Bible never told us to bring money to the house of God. A lot of people don’t study. I didn’t put it there check it yourself. Jesus chased away people trying to make money off the church, the Bible mentioned that the LOVE of money is Evil. The Bible says bring us tith and eat it, give to the Levite’s(priests). If you house is far away from the church sell your tith( you can see here the tith itself is not important, bringing it to enjoy with the fellow members is the key) God doesn’t need money, he doesn’t. Believe what you want but this here is the truth.

The others not specifically mentioned that you are alluding to are known as “chrinos “.

Betting you can figure that one out very quickly.
Grins

Jim,
Slightly off topic.

Our little independent church supports quite a few missions and
charities. Frequently when they visit, they mention that almost
all there support is from churches like ours. Built the century before
last. Seats 100 packed. No blacktop, rec hall, gym....

Funny, our pennies go to the Lord's work.
Wonder where the big church's dollars go?

P,S, Our preacher really doesnt spend a lot of time visiting people.
With a full time job and preaching at two churches his time is limited.

We are affiliated with a two county conference of independent churches.
Around a dozen churches involved, I don't think there is 1 that
has it's own preacher. Most of the preachers have 2 churches, some 3.
Some churches don't have a regular minister.

This just illustrates two things.

1, Sincere pastors aren't doing it for the money.
2, There are quite a few qualified pastors that won't do it unless there is lots
of money.

P.T. Barnum of circus entertainment fame said that there’s a sucker born every minute. He was and is right.

People give in faith and with the best of intentions. They have a need and they want to fulfill a perceived need. It’s a small but complete cycle of sorts. Those who misuse that faith and twist it for their own gain put themselves in the deepest of peril. Time here on this earth is very short when compared to the eternity.

You mentioned your thinking that it would have all ended with Jim Bakker. That’s pretty funny. As the Book of Ecc. says, “There’s nothing new under the sun”. Those antics have long been here before we came and will be long after we’re gone.

It’s up to the literate individual to pick his own poison or his own nourishment. Ain’t no body holding a gun to our head in America forcing us one way or the other. I should add,,,,as of yet.

He’s hardly a middle man. He is the Man .

Where's that like button?

Re, your last paragraph:

Anyone with a bare modicum of common sense knows that no organization runs for free.

Yours may be a case and example of why the Church in earlier times didn’t want folks to have a copy of the Bible.

I mean no offense.

The Bible tells us to tithe. If you already belong to a church or parish, continue doing what you can as you always have.

But I personally wouldn't send one thin dime to any of these frauds. I'd pass up a clear shot at a Muzz to take a whack at one of those bastards.







That actually demonstrates that you are probably smarter than the rest of us. The real question is Warner Brothers or Hanna-Barbera?


Here's a short intro to Copeland. He misread his tea leaves with Ted Cruz. Ignore the source of the vid. It's just the first on that showed up in the YT search.


















You get it.

We are mailing in our weekly tithe, because churches have expenses whether they're open or not, and just because we are attending in person, that does not give us a pass from tithing, As far as Kenneth Copeland and the rest of the TV evangelists go.........they need to get a real job and quit fleecing people.

There really is not. As Hastings pointed out, in a lot of circles, people will point out the passages in the book of Hebrews comparing Christ to Melchizedek where the scenario of Abraham giving him a tenth of the spoils of a war as basis that Christians owe a tenth of their money. To my knowledge that is the only place you find the word "tithe" mentioned after the resurrection and establishment of the new covenant. I think that is mighty shaky theology. Far as we know it was a one shot deal. We don't see Abraham perpetually tithing to Melchizedek.

In the various epistles and the book of Acts there are instances where money is dealt with. In a nutshell, they helped the poor and were taught that if a minister was helping you with your spiritual needs, you should help him with his physical needs, and that a minister deserved to make his living preaching. The amount given was up to the individual there was never a percentage or amount put to it. I figure between Peter, James, John and Paul, had the tithing system not went out with the rest of the law, at least one of them would have said so.

You will be hard pressed to find a church that teaches this. I would love to go to one that says we need x number of dollars for the preacher, x to keep the lights on and we want x for this or that. Please give as you are led. No, instead they break out Malachi chapter 3 which really has nothing to do with us.

Its really common sense. If you are going to attend a church, you need to help out with the expenses unless you are a destitute person. Otherwise you are a free loader. How much you give is between you and God. Personally I think Billy Graham had it right when it comes to running a national tv ministry. He had a board of directors and was paid a salary. IIRC, their financial statements were available just like a public company.

Gonna have to pay attention to RJY66. Maybe it's 'cause I agree with him, but he writes it well! (Have you noticed the elevated level of conversations since March began?)

You ever watch wrasslin' on TV? The stands are packed.

Word.

It’s Showtime.
People enjoy entertainment and are willing to pay for it. Or so it would appear to some.

Not offended buddie, the truth will set people free and I am not gonna come here and act like I know something that others don’t know but the Church wasn’t meant to be an organization, it was created my Jesus to be the body of God. Any church that’s an organization has taken the wrong turn.

Couldn’t disagree more.

Take care.

I used to attend a church in South Oklahoma City. The first time I ever went there, I was zoomin’ around on my VTX 1800 on a late Saturday afternoon...having no intention of goin’ to church...and I saw their sign out front that said “Services Tonight at 6 pm”. I looked at my watch, it was 5:50 pm...and I swear I just felt pulled to go...so I whipped into the parkin’ lot, and went in, wearin’ my shorts and tank top and tennis shoes. From the get-go, to say I was “blown away” woulda been an understatement. At the end of the service, they passed around some wicker baskets for a collection...and the pastor said, “if you’re an adult, and you’re in need of food or shelter or clothing, if you see some money in that basket that would help you reach this need, please feel free to reach in there and take it.” I was floored. I continued to go to that church for the remainder of my time in Oklahoma. And that pastor said the same thing about that, every time, at the end of the service when a collection was being taken. I’d never experienced anything like that before at a church, nor have I experienced anything like that since, at a church.

More than remarkable.

They knew they were in trouble if people became literate and read it for themselves. They burned people alive for reading the bible or asking questions. Even with all the church's redactions to the bible they could not afford to have people read it for themselves and come to the conclusion that their religion was fraudulent and oppressive, far removed from Jesus' teachings. Damn right, the Catholic church could not allow reading and darned if all the Protestants given time didn't fall into the same mindset.

Would you agree that whole sects of religion have been founded on a specific text within the Bible?

Text without context is simply pretext.

I’ve never heard that before.

Well, I have politely invited the Jehovah Witness gang and the Mormons in and for sure they were taking scripture out of context. They both applied the dry bones in Ezekiel to their church and the Jehovahs got angry when I told them it applied to real Jews and physical Israel. The Jehovahs finally admitted to me that they had a central authority that dictated to them. Yes, if I understand the question, there are churches that ignore most of the bible and concentrate on a small part that ratifies their belief system. Like the ones that take Paul over the rest of the bible.

Sure, entertaining in a way, except when the balance goes from entertainment to something that is taken seriously....to the point of supporting an undeserving sheister's lavish lifestyle with hard earned cash. There are better ways to use one's money.

I appreciate your answer.

I have to say that I admire the Jehovas and the Mormons for ‘living their faith.’

Yeah, Paul accounts for 30% or more of the NT. It took him getting knocked off of his ass and onto his ass to eventually see the “light”. But see it, he did. Fearless.

You’re preaching to the choir.

Supporting undeserving sheisters has long been with us and ever shall remain.

Many, many people take their entertainment very, very seriously. Ask any Rugby or soccer fan.

I don't let any of these preachers get in between me and God, God is solid, I'm abit shaky.

There’s only one between you and Him.

I hear you Old Toot!

I have Jehovah's Witness members in my family and have know a few Mormons.
I still say nobody lives the faith as well as the Salvation Army.

I'm feeling it on #1.
On #2, maybe drop the word qualified and I can groove.

Since they are simply one in the same (Trinity=Father/Son/Holy Spirit) I see nothing that's preventing a direct line to the Boss.
Don't need a human operator to place that call, for sure.
I'm ok with being a wretch. I will let the Creator do the heavy lifting as He is quite capable.
I will answer when I hear my name. I deal with whatever is placed in front of my own eyes. I am ready to stand accountable.

They are not one and the same. They are three distinct beings. The trinitarian unity belief is illogical, non-biblical non-sense.

And we're off and running!

LOL

Indeed they (SA) do, Bows.

I understand your intended meaning with the exception of “No man comes to the Father except through Me”.

You may recognize who the Author of that statement is.

You forgot to ring the Sanctus Bell to start things, kinda like at Churchill Downs.

Gimmetenhailmarys rat now!

Yep, time for me to unsubscribe.

Yep. The voice I get when I call has been the same voice I hear when I am called.
I'm not worried over the interpretative semantics, nor am I going to analyze it needlessly. Some folks have time to do just that.
Makes me no better a wretch.

Can’t fault that.

And starman is hardly a Christian. He is the devil's disciple.

Starman is a useful savant to go 180 degrees opposite to his agenda. Very dependable in that regard.

So you would not be one that believes Christ fulfilled the entire law. Romans 7:1-6 means nothing to you. You would side with the Jewish Christians Paul spoke of rather than Gods select, Paul. You would side against the counsel of the Apostles who sides with Paul in Acts 15, and in doing so held believers to Noanic principles. You would disagree with the conclusion in Hebrews 7-8 that says the law has passed and will fade away, new priest, new law.


Just to be clear. You believe The Pentateuch is fully binding on Christians given what is said in James.

Sorry to hear that you will burn in Hell fire because your faith in Christ is not enough alone. Since you believe in the law you are condemned by it. If you hold to one part of the law you are judged by its entirety.

JC is subordinate to his patriarchal Father.



Are you a sinner by being obedient to your God,
or to his adversary?

“If you have seen Me, you have seen the Father “.

That does not change the Bible narrative that
JC is subordinate to the Father.

Everything Jesus did was not of himself,
But done at the will/ request, approval or
authority of the Father.

and when the Son comes down to judge,
it will be because he was appointed and
Empowered to do so by... the Father.

It’s good to see you finally confess your “faith “ and humbling yourself before your fellow man. You’re getting better and you wear it well.

Your points made are well taken. Maybe you’re not a savant to go 180 degrees opposite.

Don't get carried away, I am just pointing out
Scripture to show how little you know about it.

JC gives all credit to the Father.

JC merely works as a dependent intermediary agency
of the Father.

Yes, yes, of course you are.

Back to the savant.

Did you overlook Chapter and Verse per chance or were you simply extrapolating ala typical Starman style ?

I would pay good money to kick this [bleep] square in the nuts. I'd bet Jesus would too.

JM, have you ever looked at the number of people in that venue ?

It’s a bunch and that’s quite a structure there in Houston town.

It’s the former Compaq Center where the Houston Rockets used to play basketball, seating capacity of 16,000. Osteen’s Lakewood Church spent 95 million dollars on the restoration alone. Then later on, they purchased the building from the City of Houston for 7.5 million dollars.

Id throw in $50 to watch you kick this fake in the nutz

I recall them having trouble getting the permits necessary for the work to be done.

Any way you cut it, he’s developed quite a humongous following and continues to grow.

He’s got a 17,000 sq. foot mansion in River Oaks, a ritzy area in Houston. He comes across to me as being more of a motivational speaker...with a religious tilt.

Oh boy. Paul's defenders ride again. I cannot reconcile Paul and Jesus or for that matter Paul and the rest of the book from Genesis to Revelations. Read it with an open mind, you won't accept Paul either

Gee, the apostles accepted Paul and his message.


Acts 15- 10 Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of Gentiles a yoke that neither we nor our ancestors have been able to bear? 11 No! We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are.”

I live in South OKC, can you remember the name and location of that church?

It was the LifeChurch South OkC Campus. It was next door to the Academy store on South Walker, just south of 240.

That is the strength and effectiveness of his messages. Motivational, feel good, almost like the style of, say, Tony Robinson.

To my knowledge I don’t believe that he was ever ordained or attended any Seminary. I could be wrong about this.

He’s somewhat akin to a modern day Marjoe Gartner who was hailed as a child prophet in his youth and pre teen years.

Great story Antlers.

Not all pasters are like Copeland.

Some actually get it.

I’m hearing JW in his post.

And the ones you hardly ever hear about. Those that go quietly about their business.

Still waiting on the Chapter/Verses from the Book that he professes to know so much about such that he can “educate “ others upon it.

Apples fall off apple trees and in this case a false teacher fell at the feet of her father.

Crazy eyes Ken’s daughter prophesied to stop the hurricane that devastated Houston and surrounding areas a couple years ago. It’s worth scanning the video for bits and pieces if you don’t want to waste 30 minutes of your life. Then the 30 minutes could be considered the equivalent of several years of observation condensed into half an hour. YMMV.

These people are nuts and represent a religion that in no way shape or form shares anything with Christianity.

A vey noble and worthy request Sir.

If a JW, based on his response, he won’t give a chapter and verse. If he does it will be from a special translation. After his comment on the guys that died defending the Texas congregation from a deranged killer I have no use for the person.

Let’s don’t give up on the boy. He might come around.

Might.
Heh.

Reminds me of 'ol false prophet Robert Tilton



Here's one with that other false prophet

In 1980 I sat in a big venue and saw Kenneth Copeland preach and have a healing service. A guy I knew was healed instantly of a lifelong defect.Hundreds were healed of all manner of things. He was the real deal then. I will admit it isn't a good look for a preacher to amass millions. But he has to answer for what he does.

Very interesting.

Hear tell that Oral Roberts taught his dog to heel.

True story.

a number of mainstream Bibles mention the
points I made. But it seems you need spoon feeding to find the relevant verses.

And nobody has disputed them except you.

I did not know this dude had some issues with folks defending themselves and others. But it makes sense, always felt he was a liberal plant anyway. Anyone that has issues with what happened at that church, doesn't belong in a 2nd amendment forum like this one. My opinion.

I dispute you as being a pompous assed phony.

Chapter and Verse to your pontification and assertions?

No ?

Take your time, we’ll wait.

Which “Mainstream Bibles” might you be referring to, per chance?
As you stated things,,,most surely there’s Chapter and Verse to support your learned “opinions “. Surely you wouldn’t create your own context being the most honorable sort that you’ve shown yourself to be.

You ain’t seen nothing with this boy. He’s a regular fountain of crap like that.

Theres a variety you can choose from for yourself,
Unless your feeble mind need me to decide for you?

You or anyone here are free to quote me
where I have expressed disagreement
with using effective self-defence.

If this about faith, or no faith, I'll plug in a Psalm my mother used to quote.[Linked Image]

David Jeremiah is good, he is not my Pastor. He's a good preacher, I don't know if he's a good Pastor or not.

There have been no actual documented cases of healing by the frauds. In fact all of them have put plants in their audiences to fake heal.

I saw a magician once float in thin air then disappear. Jesus must have granted him magical powers too

plant the seed 50 or a hunnert dollars don't make no difference

CON ARTIST ALL!!

I disagree. Strongly so.

No doubt more than a few are.

Chapter and Verse ?

Uhhh, is there a problem you phony phhhuuckkk ?

Decide for ?
You’ve been decided on a long time ago and you did by your own hand, no assistance needed from anyone.

With enough of them....there might be a place in Heaven for me yet!!

No question about it. So very sad, it’s legalized crime.