Home Forums Reloading Big Game Rifles why do hunters get talked into ........

I have the Leica 10x42 Ultra's. Purely tremendous!

I guess I could have thrown in my 8 year duaghter is waiting on her custom from Karl as well, to add a little fuel to the fire

Here, let me help:

"hey, whaddaya think ya betta than me?"

oh you don't know the half of it! You've been listening to me talk about it for six months now. Wait intil I actually have in my grubby litte paws (my wife is looking over my shoulder dictating this) - you'll never hear the end of it !

Nothing wrong with buying an expensive gun and scope, or shooting premium ammo, or going on hunts that cost more than some folks make in a year.

Can�t truthfully recall of any instance where anyone has said �you need a 1500.00 gun, 1000.00 scope and 150.00 set of rings�. But I�m only 56.

My most expensive rifle cost $475 NIB. My least expensive was $225. Most expensive scopes, by a considerable margin, are used Leupold Vari-X III�s, a 4.5-14x AO and a 3.5-10x AO, both about $350.

Not suffering much, though. Here�s a couple samples:

$350 Remington M700 .308 Win (used), $350 Leupold Vari-X III 3.5-10x AO (used)




$300 Ruger M7 .257 Roberts (used), $350 Leupold Vari-X III 4.5-14x AO (used)



$375 Ruger M77 MKII (canoe paddle), $189 Burris Fullfield II Ballistic Plex, 5 shots, clean barrel, 100 yards


All of which is not the same as saying I wouldn;t like to have some rifles that cost more. In fact I can think of several. Quite a few, actually. And time to shoot them, and expensive hunts to take them on - preferably in far away places...

Guns are all fun,I have Savages on up to Sako's and a custom in the works.If she shoots doesn't matter much to me. It's kinda like this ,a Chevet and a Mercedes will both get ya to the store,It's just how much style and enjoyment ya want on the ride there...

Cheap but decent guns are fun and useful. I bought myself a $300 old Husqy this year for my birthday. Quality guns that cost a bit are fun and useful. I plan to buy myself an expensive drilling next year.

Optics are not the place to sacrafice on quality, but a wide range of prices can be found for decent optics.

What is truly valuable in this life is anything that you truly enjoy. Spend every dollar you can afford on what you enjoy. Enjoy all that you can afford as much as you can. Time is too expensive to waste worrying about the other guy's gear.

Fireplug

This is the advice I give newbies when asked. Guns? You can get a good stick, used even, for a song. I see Rem 700s in the rack all the time that look in good shape for under $500. Top it with a Loopie VXII 3-9 and you got a right fine rig for $800-$850. Still under a grand if you go VXIII.

But, like you said there's joy in many of the paths to travel. A little tinkering for accuracy and reloading makes even a factory gun uniquely mine.

the reason i posted this is, everytime you see someone post ,like which rings are should i buy, or which scope should i buy . 90%of the answers will be only the very expensive stuff ,when you can put the cheapest rings and scope on most rifles and kill a animal as far as you can see him. i've killed them and seen many friends do it as well with 15.00 rings and a 50.00 scope. and over the years i've seen just as many high end scopes fail as cheaper ones.

280 fair point on the throwing pokes at those with more/better guns. If that was the intent of the post, I'm on board with you, but I didn't initially read it that way.

I know of polar examples that demonstrate my point. I know a guy with a semi-custom M700 in 300 WM � jewel trigger, pillar bedded, shilen barrel, VX III � nice rifle. He talks a good story but can�t hit shiite with it. Misses most everything he shoots at. He makes derogatory comments about Savage 99�s and Savage bolt actions. He�s a doctor and can afford such a rifle. My father-in-law is on the other end. He owns 3 rifles � 2 are Savage 99 and are in the Johnnie B �Gray Rat� category. Thats all he cares to spend. You don�t want to be a critter anywhere within 200 yards of him if he decides your going to be dinner.

My point: I�ve seen a little too much gun snobbery at times. Not the good natured ribbing but outright �That is the biggest POS I�ve ever seen�. Maybe but possibly that�s all the guy/gal can afford. I spent more than few years with Tasco�s and Bushnell Banners, M77�s and re-worked Mausers, unbedded actions and crappy triggers. I�ve always tried to help folks obtain the best they can afford � a tweaked M700, M70, M77 is within reach of most. That�s how I interpreted the initial post.

It�s a gradual awakening to gun snobbery <grin>.

-- BW

Dude,

If that's the way you roll, then have a friggin' ball man! But if you ask such a question, and rationalize it with logic like that above, then you weren't really capable of understanding the answer to your query in the first place.

srw - the reason for that is simple: some variables are known quantities as Stick used to expose freqently. Your ring example: the difference between a $15 crappy set of rings and a $38 set of Talleys is $23 - and a world of difference in quality and reliability.

On the other hand, the differences between a $300 Leupie VXIII and A $1500 Swarovski are IMHO not nearly as great. I think Joe Average could do quite well for the rest of his life with VX III Leupie's - and more importantly not notice much difference between the two, other than $1200 missing from his wallet.

The botom line is simple: Buy the best you can afford. It's a priceless commodity if you have a scope failure when the biggest Mule Deer, Elk, Bear, etc walks into range. The difference betwen "known quantities" and cheap shiite ain't that much.

I'd be willing to bet that the total difference between the cheapest rifle and associated components known to man and known quantities ain't all that much.

bw,

Fair enough, but the answer to the question is the same no matter the intent of the post...I don't recommend anything, as most don't on here when asked, based strictly on the price. And if he can't understand why, then the question begged for an answer he can't understand.

I'm with you.

bw,

I'll add this. I don't begrudge a single human for having more than I do...if I did I'd hate a lot of folks. I don't take pokes, to their face at least :), at people that hunt with cheap $hit. Facts are most people hunt with something like the original poster described and as long as they know what to do with it and its functional...then its ok with me whatever it is. Here's the thing about the original post, and I think he restated it in his second post...he comes across as asking campfire members to justify to him their choice of tools and the amount of money they choose to spend. Where I come from If I was at a party and went up to a guy in a $2000 Brooks Bro's. suit and asked him to justify why he spent so much money when he could have clothed himself at S&K just like me for about $200...that would be considered rude and in poor taste. And he'd likely just grin and say: "If you have to ask, then you wouldn't understand the answer."

Great rifles do not have to be expensive. What they DO have to be is accurate, dependable in mechanical function, and hold point of impact really well through varying conditions encountered where you hunt. They also have to be chambered in a cartridge the shooter can REALLY handle, and loaded with great bullets. Then the shooter has to learn the rifle and load. That is it....If these characteristics are present, everything else is tweaking and embellishment. Course, you are more likely to get these things if you design them into the rifle, and this CAN cost a lot, but not always.

In scopes,it is far simpler than it seems if you read this web site much. My experience has been that high-dollar scopes may have fabulous glass, but big money does not buy ruggedness and dependability; neither does buying variables. For example, if you offered me a SWARO AV and a Leup 4X for a once in a lifetime moose/caribou hunt in the NW Territory, I'm taking the 4X everytime. Why? Cause I've seen the Swaro crap the bed after less than a hundred rounds from a 7 mag; untold thousands have been fired under 4x Leups without incident. Variable leups? Broke them ,too but it always took a LOT of rounds to do it. And the idea that you NEED boutique glass and a 56mm vari-something to see a half-starved forkhorn in upper NY state, is a notion only for the serially-obsessed.

One of the best deer hunters I knew used a thoroughly beat rem 721 in 270 with a 3x Weaver to kill big wilderness bucks in the woods of Maine; he was a crack NRA competitor as well. In the end,the guy behind the gun is more important than the cost of the equipment, so long as his stuff is RELIABLE and field-worthy.

Bob,

Somebody's wife is going to read that crap and next thing you know we got CHAOS at the campfire!

maybe not 100%

If all you've ever driven are Pinto's and Vega's you'll never figure out why real car nuts buy Mercedes and BMW's...'cause they can all can get you to where you want to go - right?

I like a good honest tool that gets the job done.

I do agree that there are a LOT of gun/scope/rangefinder/etc. snobs on these sites. That's just the nature of these forums. 90% of good ole' boys shooting granddad's old rifle don't hang out on these sites yacking alot of BS, getting into arguments and attacking each other. Lot's of people with too much time/money on their hands.

I do get some very useful info from these sites on load development, good hunting stories, etc. I don't need to compare myself or my equipment to others. I'd rather be in the woods or up on the river.