Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire Are we being visited a curse from God?

Amen!
Now I'm hearing good sense !
☕ 😎 👍


"For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast."

Ephesians 2:8

Do you work your way to heaven by baptism, turning from sins, keeping the golden rule, OR is it by grace (the undeserved kindness of God upon the one who believes in His Son)?

"And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work."

Romans 11:6

Can't get much clearer than that .

As this has drifted off the original topic, I'll post something my dear mother used to quote.

Yep. Jesus is grace personified. Grace isn’t a bunch of rules in the Law for one to keep, and grace isn’t a lubricant for greasing the cogs of good works. God gave us His grace through His son.

We sing that song/psalm Richard!

I wish that I had a music recording to go with it for you.

Agree with the sentiment, but would change it to

“ Oh you want to do all the things I told you would hurt you? Well, go ahead and learn for yourself.”

Why don't you just clamp on the shirt tails of those good men that will lead the way?

You see, it's about choice.......and about him.......and nothing to do with you.

Get out of the way!

If you love God you want to get baptized. After all. Jesus was baptized and God was very pleased. God's Word teaches "Work out your salvation with fear and trembling. For it is God Who is at work in you."
Philippines 2:12

This is the same apostle who wrote "By grace...."

We can't have one without the other.

Not unlike some on the CF, Paul considered
himself extra special and more personally
informed from God.. James brother of Jesus
and other devout followers of Jesus got it all
wrong apparently.. 😂

When Paul's life was threatened with mob jew
violence, it wasn't God or Jesus or Christians
that got his ass out of a serious jam, but his
Roman citizenship which was recognized by
a Roman legion Tribune[officer] leading some
Centurions and Legionary troopers in response
to the ruckus.

How different the world would be today
if they had just let the mob have him...
those damn fckn do-gooder pagan Romans!

Yeah what could make a person feel better when contemplating solutions to a real problem.

Free will is a red herring. I have pointed out that the decision making process is far more complex than the quasi religious term 'free will' can hope to encompass.

The term free will tells us nothing about how or why decisions are made, or human behaviour and its drivers as a whole.


Believers use the term as means of simplistic defense.

Yeah.... yada yada from you..... weak response. Like a child backing away from a fight he knows he cannot win.

So, If have this correct, you cannot provide your thoughts on predestination nor on free will.... you simply retreat to the some sort of mindless cut and paste that you cannot talk to........... or your just opt with some yada yada statement about "Free will is a red herring." You try to cover yourself with some empty comment about "free will tells us nothing about how or why decisions are made......"

Looks like full on retreat to me.

Well, since you offer no proof to back up your statements, we can saflye write them off as simply an opinion of a person who has provided no basis for his belief. You seem to alone with your thoughts....

Why would you say that?

Who do you think believes that God wills all your choices?

Classic strawman.....

It is your response that is weak and childish....all angst and emotion, accusation and denial.

It's quite clear that you have very little understanding of the subject matter.

Prove me wrong, provide a logical, unemotional argument for free will, a definition, be it compatibalist, libertarian, etc, how it works, evidence for support, with at least one good example.

Can you do that in a reasonable adult manner?

Seems to me that you are angry ... you are again "venting your spleen."

"To vent one’s spleen means to air one’s grievances, to make enraged complaints, or to express one’s anger."

If the "God botherers" make you upset ... why are you here?

You are like a moth drawn to a flame... you cannot leave Christian threads alone....Some sort of self abuse?

There is abundant proof to support the proposition that it is the brain that acquires information from the senses, processes that information and forms an internal mental picture from some of that information: consciousness. A simple hammer applied to the head with force can prove it.

It appears that way. A special form of predestination that is really not predestination at all, but freedom for all to do anything and everything that is not destined to happen. It's quite strange.

The Romans were not going to let their man Paul be captured or even tried. He was rescued and put in the witness protection program. Christians that wish to follow Jesus would do well to remember that Jesus was vey clear the law would remain as long as heaven and earth remain. Jesus was an observant Jew and most early Christians were Jews. He did not come to establish anything new. His message was to set the errant Hebrews straight and invite any who would to come to repentance an join the Jewish people in repentance and salvation. He clearly told his disciples to go to the lost sheep of Israel. Every one else besides Paul that Jesus called, he called publicly. I notice very little quoting of Jesus here and a bunch of Paul. Jesus gets quoted here less than the Mormons quote him.

There are parts of the Hebrew roots movement today that despise and seek to undermine the writings of Apostle Paul. They seek to discredit Apostle Paul and the early Christian Church and take people back to the bondage of Law and works salvation...rather than salvation by God’s grace. Remember, the first persecution of Jesus’ followers was at the hands of the Jewish ‘Law keepers’, not Rome. A leading proponent in this movement is a California based attorney named Douglas del Tondo, who promotes his agenda through his book ‘Jesus’ Words Only’...this agenda is also promoted through the website of the same purposely misleading name. They don’t like Apostle Paul because of his abrogation of the Old Covenant. He didn’t teach that ‘some’ Old Covenant laws are no longer binding on Christians (such as sacrificial laws or purity laws, for example), He taught that the Old Covenant Law itself, that ENTIRE system of laws that ‘used to’ define the relationship with God and His people, is no longer in effect. Apostle Paul argues that the ENTIRETY of ‘the Law’ has been set aside now that Jesus has come, and that the ENTIRE Mosaic covenant is no longer in force for Jesus’ followers. And this movement mentioned above...who ‘still’ insist, and want you to believe, that salvation is obtained by following ‘the Law’ and by works...instead of through God’s grace, clearly doesn’t like Apostle Paul’s teachings regarding this.